Nontrivial pursuit

In the Love Advice forum, muddblood posted the following comment:

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Originally Posted by muddblood [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

I had feelings for the girl next door (litterally), made plenty of advances toward her, even when we were both single, and she kept refusing me, and we stayed close friends for 20+ years. But now, 20 years later, she says, yeah, I had/have feelings for you and yeah things could have happened and still could. WTF? I KNEW she had feelings for me.

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And in the Kissing & Flirting forum, redmagnum posted this one:

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Originally Posted by redmagnum [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

It's better when you have to work for it.......that sexy girl you've been chasing for months,the one you (work with, have class with, etc.) you have a serious crush on her, (...).and when you finally wear her down enough to go on a date with you (...)

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When I make a move on someone I like, and she shows or tells me she is not interested, I generally back off immediately. I guess I try to avoid the awkwardness, but I also think it is the respectful way.

Am I a fool to back off too fast at every rejection? Should I ignore it and insist?

I'm interested in the opinions of women whom have been pursued for longer times, both who eventually gave in, or who felt harassed. I also would like to know what girls that have been spared of it think of this behavior. And if some guys have rare insight in the matter, they are welcome to share it too of course.

Thanks in advance,

J.

This is an easy one, but hard to explain ;)
If it is a person I like to have in my company, I don't mind too much being persuaded, as long as it all stays in a friendly mood and is more teasing around. There is no harm in letting a girl know you're into her. It's complimentory and as long as you stay nice, respectfull and airy about it, without pressuring, who knows maybe a girl will change her mind someday?
But if it's a clear no, where it is unmistakable not appreciated that you ever repeat that behaviour again, it is very respectfull to back down. You can still be friendly around eachother, but don't flirt under any circumstance.
Still don't know if I explained it right, though.
If you get the feeling that the "no" could just as well be replaced be a "never in my life", then back down. In any other case, feel free to try again untill you hear the previous "no" :)

Personally, I don't know why you'd waste your energy.

If she's being truthful and isn't interested and you spend a lot of energy "convincing" her until you finally get what you want, what're you left with? A woman that doesn't really want to be with you? What's the fun in that?

And if she's not truthful, if she's "playing" hard to get, do you really want to get involved with a game-player? That shit gets old FAST.

It's not always games, although it might quickly seem that way. Sometimes a woman just needs time to get used to the idea of someone or maybe she needs to go through a phase in life first before she realises what a great guy is after her. There isn't always bad intentions involved and you just never know. If you really want her, her no is not a complete and utter no and you still feel like she is the only one in the world. By all means, don't hold yourself back, it might just work.

My decisions of complete rejection are generally made quickly and without chance of repeal so any further attempts are just annoyance. There are a lot of guys that fall in the sort of category though. The ones I wouldn't mind dating casually and being friends but am pretty sure I don't want a serious relationship with. Those get a date though so they still don't have a reason to pursue until I decide to break up with them because they want something too serious or I want to move on to someone else. Once I make the decision to break up it's the same as the people I reject before dating. There is no chance I will change my mind. If I decide to break up it means I no longer have any feelings at all and usually that I've been annoyed or stressed to the point of even disliking the person. Or I just found someone I like a whole hell of a lot better. Either way you've got no chance anymore. I don't do on again off again or leading people on. My relationships are simple and if some guy starts to make it not simple I fix it by making them go away and blocking all contact.

I'm a guy (you know that jolicoeur), but I too back off WHEN told a girl has no interest. As a matter of fact, I usually ask something like "would you be happy if I never ever spoke to you again?" and if she says yes, I never do speak to her again. The girl I work with never said leave me alone, just that she has no feelings for me. And actually we are going to a renaissance festival tomorrow (me, my wife, my parents, my kids, her, her boyfriend, her kids. Talk about a HIGH STRESS situation!). I am WAY too afraid of being accused of harassing someone to be that persistent.

I don't know, this is an odd one because I have a few contradictory examples coming to mind.

I think it depends on the level of pursuit. A couple of examples. Years a go, I met a guy with whom I shared a lot of similar interests. I was the first girl he met that likes DBZ (possibly the only. haha!) We hung out a bit and I knew he liked me, but I was seriously not attracted to him, for a lot of reasons. When he asked me out I declined. We tried to remain friends. He never asked me out again but after I rejected him he went all weird and creeped the hell out of me.

Another time there was a guy I with whom I had a mutual attraction. We were hung out in big groups quite often and every time he suggested we hook up, I was honestly busy. Over the years the pursual dissipated though the last time I spoke to him my son was a baby and he made a reference to wanting to see my big mama jugs. I had to laugh at that.

Then there's hubby. We were friends for 8 months before we got together. He was rather cool that whole time. I caught him perving on me frequently and we enjoyed hanging out but he never made a move. I actually found that highly frustrating because I was always second guessing whether he liked me or not. To start with the crush was definitely mine, not his.

I don't know if I have a point, but it's 20 to 7 in the morning and I've been awake since 5 so I'm not ... umm, very functional yet.

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Originally Posted by Hollowfox [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

If it is a person I like to have in my company, I don't mind too much being persuaded (...) But if it's a clear no, where it is unmistakable not appreciated that you ever repeat that behaviour again, it is very respectfull to back down.

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This makes sense. But how do you show the difference? How am I to know that a 'no' is really not a 'maybe'. (Other than yelling 'RAPE! RAPE!" I mean).

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Originally Posted by HeartIsAching [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Personally, I don't know why you'd waste your energy.

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You talk like someone who has plenty of choice. It's ... difficult for me.

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Originally Posted by kageri [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

My decisions of complete rejection are generally made quickly and without chance of repeal so any further attempts are just annoyance.

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That's the problem I guess. Some women's 'no' is some other's 'I want to think about it, but please show me some more'.

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Originally Posted by muddblood [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

I am WAY too afraid of being accused of harassing someone to be that persistent.

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My feelings exactly. But then again, I wonder how many relationships I could have had if I was a bit more persistent.

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Originally Posted by MaidenMinx [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

I think it depends on the level of pursuit.

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Ok, but what does that mean? What's a guy allowed to do after he go rejected?

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Years a go, I met a guy with whom I shared a lot of similar interests. I was the first girl he met that likes DBZ (possibly the only. haha!) We hung out a bit and I knew he liked me, but I was seriously not attracted to him, for a lot of reasons. When he asked me out I declined. We tried to remain friends. He never asked me out again but after I rejected him he went all weird and creeped the hell out of me.

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How did he change? Is it possible that the way you saw him changed after you rejected him; after he showed vulnerability?

(By the way, what is DBZ?)

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Another time there was a guy I with whom I had a mutual attraction. We were hung out in big groups quite often and every time he suggested we hook up, I was honestly busy. Over the years the pursual dissipated though the last time I spoke to him my son was a baby and he made a reference to wanting to see my big mama jugs. I had to laugh at that.

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Hmm, I think I understand. The reason of rejection was not based on attraction. If there is no initial attraction, I guess there is no point in pursuing. So, I need to detect signs that someone is attracted to me.

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Then there's hubby. We were friends for 8 months before we got together. He was rather cool that whole time. I caught him perving on me frequently and we enjoyed hanging out but he never made a move. I actually found that highly frustrating because I was always second guessing whether he liked me or not. To start with the crush was definitely mine, not his.

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I guess you girls have all the power. Did you show you were interested in him?

(Erm... and what is perving?)

Ok, I haven't figured out how to do the lovely split up the quote thing, so bare with me.

First question, I think the ideal level of pursuit is just playing it cool. Like my second example, out of the occasions we caught up he only occasionally suggested we get together. He kept his options open, he dated other girls. He actually kept my interest for quite some time.

Secondly, how did the first example change and was it my perception of him that changed? Yes I think my perception of him changed but not enough for me to have imagined the change in him. He got possessive and a little obsessive. If we were hanging out with a group of friends at a club and I started speaking to another guy, he'd bring me a drink even if I had one, introduce himself to the guy and hang around as if he was my partner. The night he decided to follow me home and I had to chase him off like a lost dog was the night our friendship ended. *shudders*
DBZ = DragonBall Z. It's a cartoon. I've met lots of guys that think I am wonderful simply for my love of anime (well all things animated). I find it sickening. I tell them my interests and they go all doe eyed on me. I'm a lot more complex than one interest...

Best way to learn how read the signs that someone is into you is to read body language books on the subject. I've personally never had no problem telling when someone likes me. Some people would consider that a gift but it can be disconcerting at times. I'd rather not know sometimes. It would make friendships easier. But yes, you have hit the nail on the head. There is no point in pursuing if there is no initial attraction.

Hubby and I getting together was an interesting thing because for a long time I felt I had to hide I was attracted to him.

Perving = uhhh... watching someone with sexual intent.

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Originally Posted by MaidenMinx [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Ok, I haven't figured out how to do the lovely split up the quote thing, so bare with me.

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Secondly, how did the first example change and was it my perception of him that changed? Yes I think my perception of him changed but not enough for me to have imagined the change in him.

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I didn't mean to upset you. It's clear now that he did get creepy.

The reason I was interested is because someone I love very much has (I think) tried to show me she is not into me. Since she is in a relationship, I didn't want to tell her how I feel. But last time we spoke she looked kind of embarrassed, although still friendly. I think the signs are clear, but I wonder how much contact I should keep with her. I am worried that I will creep her out.

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DBZ = DragonBall Z. It's a cartoon.

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Oh, ok. I've seen some episodes a long while ago. I didn't know the abreviation. I liked Son Goku's idea to increase gravity in his space ship to improve his close combat skills.
:)

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Best way to learn how read the signs that someone is into you is to read body language books on the subject.

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I've read some blogs and seen some YouTube clips about it. I think I do pick up on body language, but I don't get much positive signs from girls.

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But yes, you have hit the nail on the head. There is no point in pursuing if there is no initial attraction.

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This is distressing, but you're right of course.

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Hubby and I getting together was an interesting thing because for a long time I felt I had to hide I was attracted to him.

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I did that for almost four years, with someone I always knew I would not get.

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Perving = uhhh... watching someone with sexual intent.

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I hope I didn't do that! My feelings for this girl were the purest.

Jolicouer - i don't think you have anything to worry about when it comes to creepin out girls. From what I've seen, you are a very respectful, caring, kind person.