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Hypothetically, if I get a speeding ticket, and I'm obviously guilty, can I plead not guilty and try to persuade the judge to not fine me? Or could I plead guilty and still attempt it?
How does that work? If I was blatantly guilty and wanted to persuade my way out (I persuaded my way from a $651 ticket to $150, and cut community service by 50% once, and it was a Black female judge ;)), how would that work?
Dunno.
Never got a ticket.
I don't know much about law, but I watch Law & Order, and I know that your personal testimony counts as evidence in court. But for traffic court, I think you need to produce "two" personal testimonies, you and someone else. The officer only needs to produce his own. This makes it harder for you to convince the judge. Again, I don't know. I'll have to ask my dad, but I think that sums it up. The judge is going to scare you in order for you to pay up, but if you fight stuff like this long enough, you will win. It's the state's way of squeezing more money out of you.
Thanks for the responses, keep 'em coming.
I don't think you'll be able to charm your way out of a speeding ticket. Most judges can't stand teen drivers and can't wait to throw the book at them.
In order to have the ticket dismissed, the officer who writes it has to fail to appear in court. They rarely do this when you are talking about a teen driver because they want to teach you a lesson before you kill someone.
What grounds would you have for having the ticket dismissed?
I rarely ever speed, Mom as my witness, I do a lot of community service (as Frasbee helped mention earlier), I'm a hardcore AP student, and I "work my ass off" (at $45 hourly...hehehe) to pay through my gas and insurance bills. Furthermore, it would simply do no good as I've already learned my lesson. I mean, at least lowering the fee....
Grounds for having the ticket dismissed are usually along the lines that the officer who wrote you did so in error. For example, if he said you were doing 100 mph when you were driving a car that couldn't possibly go that fast, or if your speedometer was broken, or if his gadget that measures speed was broken, etc...
How fast were you going, and where were you driving?
My husband's son got a ticket for doing 60 (?) in front of a school, and the judge took his license away for three months and fined him. The judge knew my husband since he often appears as an expert in that court.
I was in a school zone stopped at a red light, and directly after that was the end of the school zone. He claims I was doing 30 in a 20.
Uh this does not make sense. But are there cameras at this stop light? And when did the cop showed up behind you? Or was he already behind you and clocked you by using his car to do so? Some more info would be helpfull.Quote:
Originally Posted by Zarathu [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
Speed ticket law depends on your state law. So we can't give you adivce becuase the law vary enough from state to state that its hard to do so.
What VashTN told you sounds about right. I'm not taking Traffic Law, but I have a friend or two that have taken a course in it. Honestly, to win in court, you have to look at the law 50%, and reality 50%.
The law says that you must bring forth evidence to counter the evidence that the officer will bring against you. If it is you against the officer, the judge gets paid out of parking tickets, so he will naturally side with the officer. However, in some states, state law requires that defendents (YOU), present (two) seperate testimonies for it to be considered evidence on your side. The officer needs to produce only his own.
This is not so say that your mom can come in and say that you were not speeding, and you're off the hook. If you and your mom (or someone else) present your testimony in responce to the officer's testimony, you have only established "neutral speculation". This is a funny term to use in traffic law. "Neutral speculation" exists in harrassment cases when someone's character is put in question and there is an equal number of positive and negative testimonies.
Notice that right off the start, (YOU) need to produce (2), and the officer need only (1), for it to be neutral. And, even though it's called neutral, the judge will still act as the tiebreaker, and he will most likely side with the officer. The judge doesn't care, because he is doing everything by the book, that is of course until you break the tie before he can!
If it is not the case that there exists "neutral speculation", and you manage to present more evidence in your favor than the officer can, you will win the case regaurdless of what bias the judge has. Judges have to play by the rules, because if you appeal and his judgement gets reversed, it looks bad for him and he might be replaced! So he wants to have a clean record!
How can you present more evidence in your favor?
1) Win by default: If the officer does not show up to court, the judge will either give him one more chance at a later time, or let you win on default. Most likely, he will give the officer an other time to show up. Do not think that this is the same for you. Judges will NEVER give you an other time to show up, you will lose on default if you do not show up to court! (BIAS).
2) Character Testimony: Besides your mom (or friend) giving testimony on what happened that day, he/she is the only one in that room that can also give what is known as "character testimony". This is where he/she may comment on your character and convince the judge that you NEVER speed, and that your character is not such so that you ever WOULD speed with others on board. The officer cannot deny this testimony on any grounds, and you may not give your own character testimony. Since character testimony is considered ADDITIONAL evidence in your favor, you will most likely win the case even if an other officer is there.
3) Discrediting the Officer's Testimony: If you have your mom (or friend) with you, you both probably have no idea what ticket this is for, if you were actually speeding, or what you were even wearing. Guess what, if YOU don't, then there is no way in hell that the officer does! Question him on what color shirt you were wearing, what color your car was, how fast you were going, ask him if your girlfriend was sitting in the front or in the back of the car.. and then tell the judge that you don't have a girlfriend! The point of all of this is to discredit the officer's argument and testimony. What this does is, it leaves you with (2) valid testimonies and even (1) character testimony, and if successful, will leave the officer with (1) invalid or otherwise questionable testimony.
My own advice, if they offer you to pay the ticket and to get 1 point instead of 2, tell them you want to fight it! When you fight it, bring 2 other people along with you that are good at lying! When they are there, make sure they have the story strait! The judge will be working against you, and will be trying to catch your bluff. If he sees how much effort you put into this act of yours, and you use the 2nd and 3rd options, you should get away with this one..
:french:
On the other hand, you could just take your lumps and learn your lesson. It would build character. Besides, you said you were obviously guilty.
Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. I don't want to lie in court, that's just messed up. Besides, it'd be in front of the cop who knew I was speeding and I knew I was speeding--it's be really wrong (in my opinion).Quote:
Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
So the only way out would be lying and saying I didn't? Damn. Alright, looks like I'll just plead no contest.
Yeah. I agree with Vashti on this one. There are ways around the law, and enforcement... but rules are there for a reason... and if you choose to get out of this mess this time.. let it be a LESSON to you, and not a reason for you to be careless next time. These things show on your record, and down the line, even the Pope won't be able to save you as a witness.
Some guy asked me if there was anything wrong with this illegal immigrant to seek refuge inside a church so she wouldn't be deported. If you ask me, I think the U.S. is too loose on this policy, but my answer was yes!
Rules are made for a reason, and no, not so they may be broken! They are made to preserve and maintain order. If today we let her stay in that church, tomorrow we'll all be learning english as our second language!
Nobody wants to pay the price of a ticket, because in reality, we all know that this money and law does not serve it's intended purpose. But that is only so because state governments have made tickets into a form of indirect taxation.
If you look at the historical origins of such "good law", it was put into effect and then carried out so that individuals would pay the price that society would have to suffer for their mistake. It is estimated that people who are speeding, cause $68-$87 worth of damage to society. However, when you hit someone, IF you ever do, that person will get paid by their insurance, NOT by your ticket money! The idea was good, "to prevent people from harming society", but the enforcement was flawed!
I respect such good law regaurdless of enforcement flaws. It is put into effect to keep others safe. By grandfather died in Greece by a driver who was speeding. Sad part about it, he confessed in court that he was running late for a date with his girlfriend and didn't notice my grandfather. Under Greek-law, he got off with a warning, and if he were to run over an other person within the next 2-years, he would be fined, go to jail, or both.
That is an example of BAD LAW! You should be thankful that you live in a country where you are fortunate enough to have good traffic law! It's perhaps the reason you are able to show up to court to fight a traffic ticket, and my grandfather can't. The least you can do, if not pay your well earned debt to society, is to make this a leason to try and obey the traffic law, and consider others in society before you consider yourself.
:french:
What is it with you and that French asshole that appears at the bottom of way too many of your posts?
In California you can keep your record clean and not have to pay the fine if you agree to attend online Driving school (It's ajoke class and won't take but a couple hours to finish.) Depending on the severity of the ticket, sometimes it's a cheaper alternative, and obviously it depends on whether or not it's even an option.
My girlfriend got a ticket for an illegal turn or some bullshit that had a rediculous fine, and got out of it free and clear by attending this lame class. Dunno what the laws are like in Tex-ass though.