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Originally Posted by squirrley
States removed it from curriculam due to either 1) Political Lobbying by right wing christian pressure groups or 2) Enough RightWing Christians got elected in order to have it removed. It's because people like you and sweetie got elected or brought their beleifs to bare that it was removed.
But seriously - we all know that our parents are our greatest influence. We're odds on favourites to beleive what they teach us in the long run....
I dont shove my beliefs down anyones throat-that wasnt cool Leight...all Im saying is that if it were such a fact why isnt it being taught like math? You can blame it on Christians or whatever-but the fact remains that if were such a scientific fact that would be taught...some schools took the morning prayer out...where were the right wing Christians then? Im not one of those right wing Christians and Ive already said I wouldnt push my own beliefs...
Well, the same arguement could be said for the Lord's prayer, leight. Because of people like you they had to remove it from the morning exercises. Although, it had a lot to do with the different religions. The only thing left at my kids school is the National Anthem and they don't even have to SING that anymore. They just stand there looking goofy while the music plays. (Up here we have to learn both the English and French versions). All I can say is what ever happened to tolerance?Quote:
Originally Posted by leight69
School is so watered down now that kids arent learning anymore. Think about it - kids these days are getting better and better grades. They have raised the failing mark from 60 to 70 percent. High school GPA's are raising drastically - hell, even I had a 4.6 GPA... But I know from experience, that once out of high school everything you've ever learned from there becomes irrelevant, null and void. Its like you are the dumbest person in the world. Even when you go on to college - yeah you might not realize a difference yet, but graduate from there - I bet its the same thing. You just get knocked on your ass entering the real world.
I graduated and immidiately fell on my ass. And I was there for 2 years. I am just NOW barely starting to get back up on my feet. and I graduated in 2002.
People need to stop worrying about Prayer in school , or the national anthems, or ANYTHING of that nature and just teach the ****ing kids. Stop watering down the history classes so that it is PG, or even G in some cases. Tell them the flat out truth. Teach what REALLY happened and dont leave out anything. Don't take out the Big Bang Theory in science classes. What happens when they get into a debate on Big Band and God. There are brain washed to instantly be with God because they know nothing of Big Bang. I personally dont believe in the big bang theory. But that irrelivant.
Kids these days are missing out on all the important information that we all had the privledge to learn. HELL, the govrnment is banning DODGE BALL from schools now ! It has been baned in 29 states last time I checked. Kids need to get toughened up ! Let them get hit with the ball ! geesh.
This country is becomming pussified more and more with each generation. Our grandparents were hard on our parents, and then when our parents had us they were all like "lets not treat them how our parents treated us" so the school systems changed. No more pops. Discipline has become less physical and more mental. Now our generation is growing up and we all have kids now, and most of US think our parents were mean to us so we are being even LESS strict with our kids. At this rate we are all going to turn into little prissies and fags by the time I am 50. **** people.
Dont prey in school. Teach the kids everything there is to know. KNOWLEDGE IS POWER. Don't worry about the little 'cute' things such as preyer or singing of the national anthems in schools. Hell, even the pledge of allegiance is unimportant - it wasts time that the kids could be soaking up more knowledge.
Put the physical discipline BACK into schools. Everyone knows that the only way to get someone to do ANYTHING is to hurt them. words dont hurt, they furiate. I am not saying to beat your kids. I am saying to pop them when necissary.
What would you be affriad of more ? A good pop or two on your bass ass with a nice thick wodden paddle ? Or be grounded from your phone ? Or have to go sit in a classroom and read a book (ISC/Detention) ?
Each generation is getting softer and weaker as all our opponents keep getting stronger - they are all just sitting back, and waiting for the erfect time when we are at our weakest and then they will attack (9-11).
Who gives a **** about anything else. Religion, Evolution, Big Bang, Witches, its all irrelevant when it all comes down to right here, right now. We are too busy looking to the past and the furture that we all often forget to look at TODAY !... And thats when we get hit. When we're not looking.
Wake up ppl. We are humans. We are mammals. We dont have a spirit. There is no God or greater power. The greatest power in the entire world is self success. Stop looking to the sky and asking for help. Pull your head out of the clouds. Come back down to earth and look around. There are plenty of people around that are willing to help. WE ARE alone on this planet. No higher power is ever going to come down and "save us all" from our sins. We are not going to magically float out of our bodies when we die and fly up to heaven. And the bad certainly dont get sucked down to hell. The is no heaven or hell. The is only reality. the here and now.
Wake up and look around. Unjack from your little matrix of a religion with souls, angels, demons, and a God & Devil. We are our own Devil, and we each have our own God within us all. Stop worrying about the future and the past. Look to the here and now. Help others that are in need. And you shall receive the help that you need in return.
Sweetie, it's fine that you're proud to be a Christian and are happy to share thoughts and ideas about faith. But these forums aren't the place to just post scripture without some question previously asked. There are lots of religious forums or Christian chat groups to talk about faith as much as you want but this forum is designed for discussion of what the main topics are on this group: Dating, love, sex and anything else that falls within the gamut of those concepts.
Sure, depending on your mindset you could infer that religion affects everything and everyone, but to just randomly post scripture isn't ASKING for advice or GIVING advice which is what the forum members are here for.
I don't see what would be wrong with posting a query of welcoming others to email or chat with you one-on-one to discuss faith or Christianity based concepts so feel free to do that. I welcome the idea of sharing faith with others just as you do, but this forum isn't the direct place to hold worship. It's like the bibles in hotel rooms. Everyone knows they're there, but it's up to each person to decide wether or not to read it. But we all know it's there if we choose to do so.
I think everyone on the forum knows who you are know and what you'd like to discuss further. If you wanted to leave an email addy or allow some private im's of some sort to where people could contact you if they wish to chat, then by all means, post something of that nature. I understand that part of the Christian faith is spreading the word, but remember that God gave us all free will and that it's our choice to follow his word or not. That's what the important thing is here, is choice. It's the forum members choice to seek further knowledge, but to force it at us isn't any better then telemarketers over the phone. Remember that only you can change you. It's up to each viewer to decide where they stand. Understanding that knowledge about Christ is available is a good thing, but please respect the people who come to this forum to post/reply to inquiries of what the forum has been designed for and let's keep it at that please. Nobody has to become banned from a group for having specific interests/beliefs, but people don't like being forced knowledge or actions even if the intentions are just and well. It's up to them to decide what to make of their lifestyle beliefs.
Do you understand what we're asking? This applies to all members as well. (such as nikeboy) We're here to respect one other, ask questions and seek input from other members. That's all. :)
Thats like me going into your home and peeing on your carpet. And then you say "Please dont pee on my carpet, its not necissarry and its nasty." Then I say "Well, if you dont like seeing me pee on your carpet then go into another room."Quote:
Originally Posted by sweetie_88
This place is like our home. And your comming in and peeing on our carpet and we are asking you not to. And you reply with that ?!
Think about it.
Thats deffinitly an interesting way to think about it, but true enough. lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy
I'm on the scientific/evolutionary side of the argument. I don't think I'll ever fathom the idea of a god.
I agree with Fawn. I don't think I'll ever believe in the whole God thing.
I've never met anyone who was an absolute TRUE atheist. Everyone believed that there is SOMETHING out there, God or not. I'm just curious myself what you think made us. I understand the idea of the Big Bang and evolution, but where did it begin? So one day, *bang!*, we existed? Ok, that's fine too but who/what created the bang? Something. I don't think we as humans are capable of figuring out exactly what happened. It's like knowing that there is a vault with a safe in it but never knowing the combination. We can only guess what's inside.Quote:
Originally Posted by KaWaiiSkYe
I'm not trying to continue the religion ramble, i'm just curious now from what the posts have beome. Everyone seems to agree through faith or not, that we exist today. For every action there is a reaction but there is also a SOURCE that the action originated. So let's say there really was a big bang. There's a alot of astronomical data supporting that. So what was it's source? Dinosaurs existed but what was their source? Human's came to exist (or primates came to exist if you look at it that way) but what was their source?
It feels that just saying "We just do" or "we've always just existed." or when asked how we came to be hearing "We just did". It seems as though EVERYTHING in existence that we know of follows a cycle of existing. It is born/created, it lives/lasts for awhile, it dies/becomes another object. (when looking at it from living/non-living structures: i.e. Humans/rocks)
But regardless, everything follows that cycle no matter how short, (seconds for molecules and cells), to centuries. (diamonds and minerals)
So if just the notion that "the world just always was." Then everything in existence should just be. There should be no cycles. We should never change/die and everything from the stars to blades of grass should have always just be there because they always were and that there is no cycle of life/existence.
But even science shows that this just isn't possible of course. Faith expresses that idea as well.
It just feels that alot of atheists, are fighting logic with logic instead of fighting faith with logic. If you believe that a "God" didn't create us/world, then what did? How could we "evolve" through nothing? Science shows that we could have evolved from lower primates. It even shows how animals gain/lose traits over time from previous ancestors. Even we show signs of this. (appendix organ) So I totally understand why you would choose to believe the evolution theory over others. But where did it all begin is the question. If everything evolves/originates from something previous, where did the world come from? A speck of dust? A ray of light? Pure darkness? Ok, that's possible, but what made the dust/light/darkness?
And if you say "well SOMETHING.", or maybe you say "God made it." But let's take it one step further. What made that something? If everything is made from something else then what could've made God? Is there something greater than God?
It's like, the more we come up with theories and ideas, the more we're contradicting ourselves. Personally, I do believe in God but I understand why others don't believe. There's so much knowledge available to us to sway our thinking in some other directions and as human beings with free will, sometimes we'd like to think that WE'RE the ones in control of ourselves and that we're not just a puppet on a string being led around for some higher beings amusement. Personally, I believe that we've been granted the right to do anything we feel regardless of future consequence as a test for something more.
We're the only species that willingly changes and manipulates this world. If humans didn't exist, every species would probably co-exist successfully. Creatures would kill or be killed but as necessary for survival. Have we ever proven that a species of animal has made another species extinct without HUMAN INTERVENTION? I doubt it. Animals are instinct. We are instinct with the gift/curse of free will. WE are the mutation in this world. WE are the square peg in a world of round holes. Other species attempt to adjust to the chaos we bring and some adapt and live, and others fail and die.
No, i'm not a hippy or eco-lover. I think that because we have been GIVEN the choice of free will that this is allowable in this test of life. We as humans are self-destructive, but we have the will to behave in this way or not. Everything instictually about us says "Reproduce and pass on your genes". Yet there are some humans that resist this and successfully fight the order of instinct. (Nuns, priests, celibate individuals) So we can CHOOSE how we act even if it is against primal nature. The whole concept of existence is a BALANCE of things. The planets balance around the sun. Our solar system is in balance next to others. The earth's climate and structure from the molten core to the air above is a BALANCE for life to exist. WE are the chaos that should not be. In a perfect utopia of existensential theory, WE should not be. Everyone knows that it is through us that we are constantly fighting the balance of this earth, throwing things for a loop. By nature's design, WE should not exist or LIVE the way we do. BUT we do. In my opinion we do be God's design, because scientifically, we should not fit in this order. Those who resist order and crushed and destroyed. A bird who leaves the sky and goes underwater dies. A fish that flops on land dies. A cow that decides not to eat, dies. Everything follows an order but us! So why is it so hard to fathom that something greater than nature, allowed us to do so? Even with the idea of evolution (like a fish creature one day being able to live out of water) there still is a balance.
Like I said, I think this is all a test. We have so much power over the entire world as one species that it can't be by chance. Looking at how the world works, there SHOULD be something else competing with us. ANOTHER comparable species that SHOULD resist us in some way. Big fish eat small fish. Lions eat more docile creatures, we eat anything. BUT nothing eats/rules us. Not even disease and bacterias because the human race has always survived. There's not one thing in this world that has ruled us or put us under it's control. That's one reason I believe that God has singled us out. Because we're his experiment. Wether you believe it or not, we WON'T have the final say in all this because we'll never been completly in control of existence.
We're so strong yet so weak in this game.
Just my .02 :D Please explain your thoughts more on this. We already have this thread going in this direction so why not make the best of it?
That was a hella long thing. I can't read that. It's like readin' a book set by my ex R.E. teacher. [I don't do R.E. anymore] I get a headache. I gave up after the first few lines. Sorry. I just can't.
Hate to buck that theory, but my parents are big with the whole "believing" thing (my Dad actually asked me where my Faith comes from) and I went to private schools my whole life but I started at the Jewish Community Center so it wasn't a school thing either.Quote:
Originally Posted by leight69
As an Oz junkie there was a quote I liked alot . . . "There is no choice between believing or not believing, God choses us." (Meant not in a "chosen people" kinda way but in a believer kind of way if that makes sense.)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Breezy18
Actually the Lords Prayer was removed due to the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. And what happened was the case was brought before the courts (A parent of a non-christian denomination) and challenged the law as it stood against the Charter.
The courts struck down that portion of the law deeming it unconstitutional.
The choices are in fact to either recognize ALL denominations/faiths/beleifs or to keep religion out of school.
There is also a HUGE difference between math and religion. Math can be proved, reproved and proved again...in fact that's what math is. Religion is a beleif, a way of living, guiding principles of how to lead ones life. This has been deemed to be kept out of schools as it infringes on equality rights.
....
As for our parents being our greatest influence - Are you deny the fact that the people who raised you on a day to day basis are the biggest influence on our values and beleifs?
Lord's Prayer is basically the "Separation between church and state" arguement. There are people trying to get the words "Indivisible, under God" out of our flag salute for the same reason. To me this is going overboard, and I say if you don't believe in God, just don't say the words when it comes to it.
Rod Steele
Actually i think humans evolving from monkeys is ridiculous, what other species evolves and the original form of it still walks the earth? Besides if the ORIGINAL form that we started from still exists, why not EACH form of man (like on the chart) is walking now makes no sense.. but thats just my opinion
Separation of church and state was NOT intended to keep church or references to God out of government or government functions.
Separation of church and state was intended to protect the CHURCH from the STATE. It is the modern day liberals and groups such as the UCLA that have distorted the constitution and the original founding fathers' intent.