Printable View
Did you read my two posts above?
I know they're a little long, and they don't make any beeps or whirring noises to hold your attention. But go read them. And then go read "No More Mr. Nice Guy" by Dr. Robert Glover.
Read the first chapter in the store, and if it doesn't speak directly to you, I'll refund you the money myself.
Like I said before subtle nonverbal flirting.
She's not going to see you differently till she feels a spark. Your challenge is to create that spark.
Go back an reread the last part of my first post. Think about ways that you can up sexual tension with out making the girl tense. ;)
Yeah, I read them. I was actually posting my post while you were posting yours.Quote:
Originally Posted by pisces7378 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
Cutting off most contact with her would be a HUGE step for me. I don't know if I can do it (also due to fact of mutual/intertwined friends). I've actually already started to cut back a little (not texting her pointlessly and calling every day and such). But I don't think I can do it completely. :(
NYC Guy, I think at some point you need to respect her decision to see you as a friend. After all, isn't that what a good, supportive FRIEND is for?
You weren't asking for this advice, but I really think you would be better off switching gears and finding a new girl to date. Make your intentions clear from the beginning that you want to be a romantic interest. I don't think you should cut out women friends entirely, just don't try to date them.
P.S. You're in a good city for dating. 3 Single girls for every 1 guy. The odds are in your favor.
I have no problem respecting her decision to see me as a friend. If that's what it is, I would be nothing but supporting and continue being her best friend platonically. I don't see why I should do that though until I at least get things out in the open and give it a shot. If it doesn't work, ok, not a problem. I'm mature enough to handle it. But what if it does in fact work out? Until I give it a test run, I'm not going to be able to get my mind off of her enough to focus on others, and will always be wondering what-if.Quote:
Originally Posted by starbuck [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
Quote:
Like I said before subtle nonverbal flirting.
She's not going to see you differently till she feels a spark. Your challenge is to create that spark.
Go back an reread the last part of my first post. Think about ways that you can up sexual tension with out making the girl tense.
Would it be too much to ask for more specific ideas/way on doing this? :)Quote:
Stick with nonverbal flirting at first, tucking a piece of hair behind her ear, serious eye contact, gently stroking her hand, etc...
Watch carefully to she how she responds. If she withdrawls or recoils, just give it up. It's hopeless. If she meets you halfway, smiles, blushes, acts extra cute, then you can consider ramping it up to verbal flirting and hint dropping.
I do do those things somewhat as it is. She doesn't ever recoil or withdraw at all. But neither does she blush or act extra cute. If I tuck or fix her hair once in a while, she would say thanks. I do flirt with her a bit here and there. And she does smile or laugh, but it's a friendly kind of reaction. Like she is not recoiled by it, but neither does she take it anything more than us a platonic kind of flirtation, unless I'm just bad at reading the signs. Once or twice in recent months I turned around and saw her smiling at me for no apparent reason (unless it was my imagination). I don't want to go too far and do something she'd consider inappropriate and mess things up though. That's why I would love to hear some other specific ideas in this area if possible.
Also, I don't know if this helps or not, but a long time ago after she had helped me through a difficult time, I thanked her for being having been there for me. I explained to her the qualities she had that really made her able to help me, and she said that my description of her had turned her on a bit, lol.
My specific goal is this: when I eventually ask her to go on a real date with me, I want her to be in a mental state in which she would consider me "on the merits" and not dismiss the idea simply on the grounds of us being best friends or like brother/sister. Right now it seems to me like a 50-50 about which one she would do. If you back and read my first post, I think it's clear that there is a chance it could go either way.
Don't listen to that "Respect her decision crap." 20-something year old girls don't make "decisions", they float in the breeze with everything. Sure, everyone wants to feel like they are making solid, reality based decisions, but come on... let's all get over ourselves here, what young GIRL have you ever known who actually made up her mind about anything?
I worked for many years in marketing, and trust me, the psychology is all there, females don't develop a strong sense of self, or even a strong sense of loyalty or decision making process until well into their 30's.
If you want her to see you in a sexual way... you will have to, as Heratriumphan said, WAKE HER UP! But I promise you, if you just all of the sudden start flirting, and touching her face, and trying to escalate things to a sexual level, she will run for the hills, and then you've lost your friend, all your mutual friends will feel awkward around you, and you didn't even get to tap that ass.
So... you may not like me, and you may hate what I am saying, but if you want to ever become a strong integrated male who sets goals, moves forward towards those goals, and eventually achieves those goals... then you'd better get used to listening to advice that makes you feel uncomfortable, and you'd better get used to the idea that success in ANYTHING comes directly from doing things that makes you feel uncomfortable. Otherwise, you'd just continue with how things are, stay in your comfort zone, and continue to love her from afar... and live with it when she starts screwing some guy that DOES know how to proceed with a goal.
The first thing you will HAVE to do, is a period of No Contact. You have to reset the situation. Relationships have an inertia. If you dramatically alter that pattern, then it can free the situation up for a "re-introduction." It's like when your best buddy down the street went away for summer camp for a month when you were 15, and when she came home, all of the sudden, best buddy was making you feel a little weird "down there."
You have to GO AWAY!!! And if you can't handle 2 months, then you are a weak asshole, and don't deserve her anyway. :D
Not me!! I think it's strange to have a brother/sister like bond with a friend then all of a sudden you want to bang them. I think not. My and my 2 male best friends have never been that way.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cbrider [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
Pisces, while I generally agree with you completely, my circumstance is such that the going-away approach is much better suited for the long-term (if it doesnt happen now), but not in the short term. As for the short-term, it's not possible because our lives are too much intertwined. Our families are friends, our friends are friends, and she & I have a few upcoming trips planned (both alone and with others). That is why at the moment I'm more interested in other techniques to kindof test the water a bit, even though I do agree with your point overall. Then, if I get a sense that I may have a good shot at it, I'll do my best to keep a distance for a while before I go and actually take the shot. That's my point. I guess I should have been clear from the start. I am not interested in "how to do it" advice, so much as I am in "should I do it" based on the facts of our relationship that I have laid out.
Ohhhh... Then why didn't you just say so. NO! You shouldn't do it.Quote:
Originally Posted by nycguy [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
You are bullshiting yourself, and I hate to see a good man bullshit himself. You talk as if you are wearing ankle shackles to each other, and that your families live in a commune on in some one room hut. And you make it seem like you have no option on Earth to do what's necessary to achieve your goal.
I bet you pull this same bullshit to your parents about school, chores, money, whatever... "Mom, I can't pass Biology because I don't have the right graphing calculator. Chapter 6 is all about genetic codes, and it has a lot of math. The calculator I got in high school doesn't do this one algorithm and so I need $200 or I'm going to fail."
"Mom, I can't seem to focus on my Psych 101 course because my room mates always play the PlayStation until 3:00, and you know I can't study in the library, because I'm sensitive to the fluorescent lights, and I get head aches from the stuff they use to mop the floor. And I had to quit my job because there is a one hour lab for my Spanish class that conflicted with...."
Do you see what I'm saying. Fcuking excuses, excuses. I don't believe for one single second that you just CAN'T back off on this girl for 2 months. I am not your mom, or your dad, or your naive grandparents that think you are so amazing. I see someone who bullshits himself, and tries to bullshit others.
Grow up. If you really want her... it will take some work. You WILL have to be uncomfortable. You WILL have to deal with finding someone else to spend time with. You will have to rearrange your entire schedule to avoid seeing her. It will change everything about your daily activities.
But if you just want to "test the waters" because you are a lazy, needy twirp, then yeah, go ahead and start all that hair touching, and eye gazing, and stuff. Just please post an update when she hands you the "I just thought we were having such a great friendship" speech. PLEASE!!!
20-something year old girls don't make "decisions", they float in the breeze with everything.
Wow those are some of the truiest words I ever read. But all jokes aside man, I'm caught up in a love triangle myself, and being that as it is im the go to guy to talk about her problems. So what I did was cut all ties with her for about 2 months, next thing i know shes messaging me n now we talking but im just leaving the situation, woman in there 20's are very indecisive in my experiance. I know you like her alot and all but more then likly if it didnt pop off when you first started talking it won't. I liked my bff and was trying to get with her, but now that I've known her for like 5-6yrs I'm glad we didnt hook up because of how she is. Your best bet is to start thinking of some excuses for those trips, or if while on those trips don't pay her much attention and flirt with other women with her right there. But I highly suggest destroying all forms of more then a hi and bye type of communication. She wont see you how you want to be seen in your current light, I been there and done that bro, dont do it to urself.
So he shouldn't respect her decision to be friends, cause she's a 20-something woman and they don't know what they want?Quote:
Originally Posted by pisces7378 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
Is your idea of dating creepily stalking women in parking lots?
@starbuck i think he was simply saying that he has to be aggressive towards the situation in every aspect, like not communicating with her on a regular basis amongst other things or maybe some of the things i suggested as well as others. If she flat out says no then ya no means no, but sometimes people say no at the first thought of something, then they start to entertain the idea and sometimes depending on the situation go with it.
I think he just meant that females are fickle and their "decisions" (minds) can be changed.Quote:
Originally Posted by starbuck [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
As for respecting her decision...I've answered that part in one of my posts above.
BTW this one is not your typical girl. She's quite mature for her age.
LOL, perhaps I misread his post.Quote:
Originally Posted by nycguy [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
I actually gave the same advice as Pisces earlier in the thread. That you'll need to pull away from her for a while if you want her to see you in a different light. Maybe even try some light dating with other women as an experiment. She may end up realizing she is missing out.
Starbuck... Parking lots? Huh?
nycguy...Stop all that "She's mature for her age" bullshit. This girl is going to eat you alive. You have her so high on a pedestal already. Girls are looking for partners. Equals. Hell, a LOT of girls are looking for a provider to LEAD. How on Earth are you supposed to be equal or lead if you have her on a ten foot pedestal?
She's not AWESOME. She's not GREAT! She's not Mature for her age. She's just a girl. NOTHING more. There are billions and billions of them.