I hate how "adults" "hang out".

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Originally Posted by Frasbee [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

You should start a new moral campaign against natural birth.

C-section is a good start, but I believe birth without blood or pain would be the most civilized.

Think test tubes and vats.

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You lose almost twice amount of blood by cesarean section. Healing time is longer. And what the surgeon does to your abdomen, the muscles, the UTERUS...you will never be the same again. And you have increasing risk to mother and baby after each birth. I prefer vaginal over c-section. In fact having a c-section is a great fear of mind. She can always tone the vaginal area and giving birth is a great excuse to have it surgically toned. Of course, tearing to the rectum is horrific risk too. She could have fecal incontinence! Still, me no like c-sections and it has become quite elective now.

:goofy: And now back to topic....

Mine weren't elective, but I was glad for them at the time. My vaginal walls were, too. :D

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Originally Posted by Aeradalia [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

How is it any different for a butcher to slaughter an animal for you than for you to slaughter an animal for yourself?

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He's doing the "dirty work".

I think that someone that wouldn't, under any circumstances, kill an animal has no business eating meat. I've killed my own dinner before. I understand if someone finds this unpleasant and chooses not to do it, but I think everyone that eats meat should kill their food at some point in their life.

Oh, and Doppel, your fishing buddy sounds deeply disturbed.

I think the guy has huge problems. One time he pointed a loaded shotgun at me and thought it was *funny*

I haven't gone hunting/fishing with him since that moment.

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Originally Posted by Gigabitch [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

He's doing the "dirty work".

I think that someone that wouldn't, under any circumstances, kill an animal has no business eating meat. I've killed my own dinner before. I understand if someone finds this unpleasant and chooses not to do it, but I think everyone that eats meat should kill their food at some point in their life.

Oh, and Doppel, your fishing buddy sounds deeply disturbed.

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I think so too giga... something is missing when you never hunt or kill your own food. Seem to lose an appreciation for life (I know, it seems to not make sense) if there is someone else doing the 'dirty work' for you all the time.

I don't have a problem with vegans or vegetarians either... unless they try to force their higher sense of 'morality' on me.

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Originally Posted by doppelgaenger [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

I think the guy has huge problems. One time he pointed a loaded shotgun at me and thought it was *funny*

I haven't gone hunting/fishing with him since that moment.

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Yeah... I've had friends bring others along who were like that... those are the ones who derive entertainment from the act of killing and hurting living things. It's a quality you DO NOT want in someone who will be carrying a loaded weapon while you're out in the middle of the woods... :horror:

yeah, like Dick Cheney...

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Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

If one must kill for food, it seems like remorse would be the emotion I would experience.

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You made a confusing statement.

You mention "one" in the first part of the sentence, and then "I" in the second half.

I can tell that you would be remorseful if you had to kill something for food.

But why would anyone ever kill anything for food if they were going to cry about it later? They'd depress themselves into vegetarianism.

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Originally Posted by Frasbee [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

But why would anyone ever kill anything for food if they were going to cry about it later?

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??

Because they were hungry? I would kill if I were hungry, but I'd feel sorry I had to do it, and it would definitely be a last resort.

I don't really understand the whole argument that people should kill if they want to eat meat unless they are also willing to say that people who want to eat veges should be willing to be farmers.

We went from "Adults hanging out" to C-sections and birth in general, Ewwwwwwwww!

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Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

??

Because they were hungry? I would kill if I were hungry, but I'd feel sorry I had to do it, and it would definitely be a last resort.

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Oh, come off.

You'd only feel bad about it because you haven't been killing them all your life. It's not like humans are ingrained with a natural moral sense not to kill for meat.

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Originally Posted by Cbrider [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

We went from "Adults hanging out" to C-sections and birth in general, Ewwwwwwwww!

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And the art of killing for food.:D

i think the manner in which we get our meat now is far more brutal than how it was gotten in the days when killing was the only way to get meat. people used to be so much more connected to their food. people would praise cows and chickens or whatever animal they were eating and thank them for their bodies and would actually think about what they were doing.

nowadays food is cut up and packaged in plastic and nobody knows where it came from.

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Originally Posted by misombra [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

i think the manner in which we get our meat now is far more brutal than how it was gotten in the days when killing was the only way to get meat. people used to be so much more connected to their food. people would praise cows and chickens or whatever animal they were eating and thank them for their bodies and would actually think about what they were doing.

nowadays food is cut up and packaged in plastic and nobody knows where it came from.

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When you say things like this I just want to hug you

I'm proud to say that I haven't eaten a fellow mammal for a long time

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Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

I don't really understand the whole argument that people should kill if they want to eat meat unless they are also willing to say that people who want to eat veges should be willing to be farmers.

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That's not the argument... it's not a matter of having to kill every time you want meat... rather the argument is that you lose appreciation for the animal that died if you've never had to kill an animal for food in your life. The same holds true for those who have never farmed --- it's not as easy as you would think when all you've ever seen are the 'good and fresh' veggies at the grocery store. Having never hunted or farmed leaves a person open to taking food for granted --- taking life itself for granted.

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Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Because they were hungry? I would kill if I were hungry, but I'd feel sorry I had to do it, and it would definitely be a last resort.

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Originally Posted by Frasbee [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Oh, come off.
You'd only feel bad about it because you haven't been killing them all your life. It's not like humans are ingrained with a natural moral sense not to kill for meat.

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I have been killing for food most of my life.. even raised livestock. The first few times you may hesitate (fearful that you will not be 'merciful' enough...) but once you learn how to be swift and precise, this hesitation leaves you. These are things you couldn't understand if you had never killed for food. The 'feeling bad' part is temporary... after that, instinct takes over.

You maintain respect for the animal, but you do not feel bad for them --- they are food, and you aren't being needlessly cruel to them. Any sense of 'morality' you may have is fulfilled by killing them as quickly as possible... to go beyond that borders on the ridiculous.