Debates: A Holistic Perspective...

[indigosoul]

Unfortunately, Humans don't want to learn.
[URL=http://www.iraqbodycount.org/]The worldwide update of reported civilian deaths in the Iraq war and occupation.[/URL]

The link you post is terrible, but that isn't proof that humans don't want to learn. Your attitude promotes hopelessness, which I categorically reject. I'm human, and I certainly want to learn.

[G-TEX]

i don't think you've been exposed to the holocaust.
[url]http://www.parascope.com/gallery/galleryitems/holocaust/holocaust15.jpg[/url]

RSK check this out, this map. See the Capital cald Riga in the center of the map....
[URL=http://www.parascope.com/gallery/galleryitems/holocaust/holocaust59.htm]"Ze Map"[/URL]
That Realy freaks me out, 150KM east there is a grave ov more than 35,000 corps...

[Only-virgins]

The link you post is terrible, but that isn't proof that humans don't want to learn. Your attitude promotes hopelessness, which I categorically reject. I'm human, and I certainly want to learn.

I want to learn too. It's why I continue to exist.

[indigosoul]

The man who saved a billion lives. There's hope for you:

[url]http://www.aworldconnected.org/article.php/311.html[/url]

LOTS of examples of this throughout human history, BTW. Think of our world population... there are more of us now than ever! NOW all we have to do is focus on QUALITY rather than quantity...but we are getting there, I think!! Keep debating gang!

[indigosoul]

I want to learn too. It's why I continue to exist.

I hear you OV.

[Only-virgins]

The man who saved a billion lives. There's hope for you:

[url]http://www.aworldconnected.org/article.php/311.html[/url]

LOTS of examples of this throughout human history, BTW. Think of our world population... there are more of us now than ever! NOW all we have to do is focus on QUALITY rather than quantity...but we are getting there, I think!! Keep debating gang!

Getting there? lol, you sound like you know the answer. I don't need to debate anymore, arguing against cultural relativism is setting yourself up for failure. Yes, lost of people believe(including me) that what Nazi germany did was terrible, and yes, it is STILL AN OPINION.

[indigosoul]

Getting there? lol, you sound like you know the answer. I don't need to debate anymore, arguing against cultural relativism is setting yourself up for failure. Yes, lost of people believe(including me) that what Nazi germany did was terrible, and yes, it is STILL AN OPINION.

Of course I don't know THE answer. But I DO know that looking backwards w/o any application of that knowledge for the future ISN'T the answer. And as long as ppl continue to focus on the atrocities of both past AND present w/o DOING anything about it, including making ppl recognize such mental stagnation, then debate IS most certainly needed. Probably always will be.

[G-TEX]

2 indigosoul , Its not enoth with You, OV and ME, until there are such leaders like Bush, We wont survive.
Tell me, is it posible that every one in the world could change in one moment, I think No, It would take time, How Long ? How much Time Do We have ?
And I think that Link does proof that We wont make it.

[G-TEX]

But Let's Just Hope For The Better Future!

[indigosoul]

2 indigosoul , Its not enoth with You, OV and ME, until there are such leaders like Bush, We wont survive.
Tell me, is it posible that every one in the world could change in one moment, I think No, It would take time, How Long ? How much Time Do We have ?
And I think that Link does proof that We wont make it.

Pessimist. Where do you think leaders like Bush come from?? Why does everyone in the world have to change at once? Did you even read the example I just posted?? That was from just ONE MAN. Since you like to focus on the negative, I'll remind you that Hitler was also just ONE MAN. Great change, good and bad, definitely starts at the individual level. How else could it be??

Stop whining and start DOING buddy, if you really give a care. You have to do more than HOPE. Which is just another way of saying you want to SOMEONE ELSE to be responsible. But, actually, it all starts with you.

[vashti]

LoL, I don't think so. The Nazi events are not wrong, they are wrong in the perspective of a "not" nazi. Too Nazi's it felt like they were doing the right thing. Cultural relativism is every real. Its the only real.

Its all relative. Nazi holocaust sucks, if your jewish hahahaha. To me it was just population control. I could not care either way. I'm not a Nazi and I am not jews, I would be the guy who would just sit back and watch the bully beat the kid up, with some popcorn.

That is the by far stupidest thing I have ever seen you post, but if you really find it necessary for someone to explain to you why it is stupid, then I guess I will.

The question is WHY is it wrong to murder people? It is wrong to murder people because it denies them the oppportunity to live. (duh!) You claim to be an advocate of Utilitarianism, but surely you realize that a main component of philosophical utilitarianism is that one must treat every person's welfare as equally important. Murdering people violates the "rules" of philosophical Utilitarianism. Additionally, Classical Utilitarianism says that actions are to be judged right or wrong based on their consequences, and that in assessing those consequences, the only thing that matters is the amount of happiness or unhappiness that is created. I think it is safe to say that the amount of unhappiness caused by the death of 12 million people during WWII greatly outweighs the amount of happiness a few stupid anti-Semites derived from the murder of Jews.

[G-TEX]

1- "Did you even read the example I just posted" ,no ectualy, I was writing back then. Sorry.
2- "definitely starts at the individual level" I agree with You.
3- "if you really give a care." I Don't.

[indigosoul]

I think it is safe to say that the amount of unhappiness caused by the death of 12 million people during WWII greatly outweighs the amount of happiness a few stupid anti-Semites derived from the murder of Jews.

To add to this: Not only is it about happiness, but the loss of all that human POTENTIAL. What if ONE of THOSE souls had been the one w/the answer to human hunger?? Or curing cancer, or ending war, or... you see my point.

Thanks Vash!

[vashti]

Yes, that reminds me of the quote "Those who dwell on the past are doomed to repeat it".

That is NOT how the saying goes. It is "Those who don't learn from the past are doomed to repeat it". Pretty much the exact opposite of what you wrote.

[indigosoul]

3- "if you really give a care." I Don't.

Not now, perhaps, but one day you might. I didn't care either when I was younger. That was before I had a family, people I loved and felt responsible for, became a contributing member of my local community. It takes a certain amount of stability and maturity (mental, emotional, financial) to be able to think about these things, I understand. But one day, you may care VERY much. Or not, as you will. A lot of ppl can't, or won't. You'll have lots of company, if so.