Men and respect

[Gigabitch]

So is the question whether you want someone who treats you respectfully, or someone who has great respect (admiration) for you?

What exactly entitles respect? The way the book made it sound, it is as if the writer thinks many wives don't respect their husbands, and that this is a major part of martial problems.

This is turning into a very good thread. I am absolutely fascinated to learn whether men are more interested in actual respect or just the appearance of respect.

I've known a few people who confused fear with respect (my father, for one). No one actually respected the man, and he didn't care, as long as he didn't get any lip and could make people do what he wanted. He thought that was respect, poor misguided thing.

I respect my bf, but I wonder if it shows to others, and I wonder if he cares about that. I would never be rude to him, especially in public, but I don't treat him like the boss of me either.

Come to think of it, I don't even treat my boss like the boss of me.

[Junket]

Come to think of it, I don't even treat my boss like the boss of me.

Same here.

I read somethin' at one time that went somethin' like: "You gain authority through power, and leadership through respect."

[zro]

Frasbee, most whte people live in the west, while ethinicities live in the east, i thought that would be clear that i was talking about the difference between white and ethnic people, if it wasnt clear before it is clear now

Respect and self respect in the east is a way of living, not like love or hate which is a momentary situation, you telling me that a 12 year old girl in a mini skirt is showing self respect?? you telling me a guy wearing more ****ing make up than a hooker shows respect?? I am not saying dont wear what you want, just dont wear something to gain acceptance or devalue yourself, that idea extends to other parts of my life, i will never be nice to you just because i want to be accepted, i am nice to you because that the way i want to be treated back

dont ever call me a punk again, those are the kind of people who i DONT respect, blindly following an idealogy in hope of becoming better liked, its very easy to insult someone from behind a computer, doing it face to face is a different story - but since probably we will never meet, there is no point in me insulting you back

Of course i looked to others for advice - i am not saying to disregard others as no one is perfect, and i do listen to hip hop - but i did not follow what everybody else was following, i chose people based on my beliefs and my ideaology, and would not change for anyone - and if somebody didnt like it...good, just dont open your mouth about it, if you did... then **** you and the hole you came from

I wasnt talking about people who "idolize" celebrities, simply people who are influenced by it, this aneroxic standard of beauty that exists in the west for example, and this isnt limited to an "obssessed" few, first of all its unhealthy and shows mental weakness to be so easily influenced, which in turn shows lack of self respect

and gigabitch, whether or not your dad was respected i dont know, but if he could instill fear in others and "make them do what he wanted" chances are he did not respect them either

[Junket]

Frasbee, most whte people live in the west, while ethinicities live in the east, i thought that would be clear that i was talking about the difference between white and ethnic people, if it wasnt clear before it is clear now

What is white? How are Irish, Italian, German, English, Swedish etc. similar in anything but maybe skin color? To separate the world into "white" and "everything else" seems a bit narrow minded, wouldn't you agree? That would be like me implying that everybody in the East is Asian, and by Asian, I mean, Chinese. I like to call that, absurd.

Respect and self respect in the east is a way of living, not like love or hate which is a momentary situation, you telling me that a 12 year old girl in a mini skirt is showing self respect?? you telling me a guy wearing more ****ing make up than a hooker shows respect?? I am not saying dont wear what you want, just dont wear something to gain acceptance or devalue yourself, that idea extends to other parts of my life, i will never be nice to you just because i want to be accepted, i am nice to you because that the way i want to be treated back

It seems to be your argument is more you versus the "white half" of the world. And not necessarily the "eastern half". Once again, I feel like you're arguing for both sides. One that suggests people should wear what they want and do what they want to do, and the other that condemns them for any sort of conformity, intentional or not. Most people wear clothes that make them comfortable, listen to music that makes them comfortable and hang out with people that make them comfortable. If they happen to fall in a particular stereotypical group, does that mean they did it just to gain acceptance and as a result lost their self-respect? I'm offended at your generalizations of America, which I am under the assumption is included in this "western/white" half of the world you speak of.

dont ever call me a punk again, those are the kind of people who i DONT respect, blindly following an idealogy in hope of becoming better liked, its very easy to insult someone from behind a computer, doing it face to face is a different story - but since probably we will never meet, there is no point in me insulting you back

Quote me where I called you a punk.

Or don't because you'll see that I didn't.

It's a shame you're so quick to judge, I've known many self-proclaimed punks throughout my adolescent years, and they were usually the friendlier sort. Most kids grow out of that phase anyhow.

i chose people based on my beliefs and my ideaology, and would not change for anyone - and if somebody didnt like it...good, just dont open your mouth about it, if you did... then **** you and the hole you came from

My point is that your response here is no different than the majority of people I have ever known in the "western/white" world. Or even the white, black, Indian, Russian, Korean community I happen to live in...

On that note, did you come up with that lifestyle yourself? Or was it encouraged by your family? Here in America at least, many young individuals are encouraged to become as independent and self-reliant as soon as possible. I think that children and adolescents would make up most of the population you speak of. It's during those years they often seek out their place in the world, some going far to feel accepted somewhere. I to looked up to my brother, he was my inspiration, and a very positive role model, I stopped following him so closely as I ended my teenage years, and don't hold his opinion as highly anymore, but I still respect him, and him me, and I would say we influence each other equally.

I wasnt talking about people who "idolize" celebrities, simply people who are influenced by it, this aneroxic standard of beauty that exists in the west for example, and this isnt limited to an "obssessed" few, first of all its unhealthy and shows mental weakness to be so easily influenced, which in turn shows lack of self respect

When you speak of influence it seems to me you're targeting a wider audience than the select few "crazies". However, clearly you yourself have been influenced by the anorexic "standard" beauty shared by such a select few people of the "western/white" world. Obviously in a negative manner though. In any case I can assure you that at least in the United States, this "anorexic standard" is by no means a standard of beauty for your average (majority) American. I cannot speak for Europe, or wherever else you consider western.

[Gribble]

I want respect, but that doesn't mean I don't want a woman with a good sense of humor. I love a sharp tongue and a strong will. Don't need a woman bowing and scraping to me.

[anachronistic]

Прувт!

what's with all the ****ed up "this or that" questions!??? I want it ALL. all of it. every last thing. i want respect, love, good sex, a decent looking young female who is of similar intelligence and age.

as far as i'm concerned, every woman i know is capable of reaching THOSE potentials, so don't go aiming for specific things. BE A WELL ROUNDED CHICK.

not only that! but we will give you it back in return!

i wouldn't put up with a woman that didn't respect me, and if she didn't love me, i would see no reason to continue any sort of intimate relationship.

[zro]

Frasbee, if you look "white" you are "white" - whether you are european or american, i will agree that sub cultures Europe like sicily, italy, russia and New Zealand in my opinion have a higher regard for respect, for example i met a few russian ladies a while back and was surprised at their demeanor, even though very good looking and pretty wealthy, they were all very modest and stuck to their values (i know its impossible to judge a whole population on a few, but this is also from my personal experience from my travels as well), but sadly in the "west" this is very rare, alot of girls will gladly walk around half naked to get ****ing attention, guys will gladly gang bash someone to feel tough, back when i grew up, if you got into a fight you were alone, either win or lose like a man....thats respect, it is simply being self confident enough to go at it alone, NEVER devalue your morals and value no matter what (this is the part where the west falls flat on its face and especially america - where in my point of view respect is sold for the dollar and is absolutely worthless nowadays) and finally communicating/ looking up to people because you like them, not for social status and acceptance, if you think respect has the same value in the west and the east, you need to either travel or read alot of books

maybe i was bit quick on the button on the punk thing, you did not call me a punk but since i did not insult you, i see no need for an apology

I dont think i will change your point of view, and you wont change mine, so i think its best to agree to disagree, nice chatting with you frasbee, really i am not being sarcastic, always good to hear another person's point of view

[Gigabitch]

Frasbee, if you look "white" you are "white" -

That would not fly around here. I know some Hispanic people who would lose their minds over that one.

[zro]

dont hispanic people look hispanic? if you have mixed parents and you end up white, take it up with jesus, buddah or muhammed, whoever you believe in... harsh but true, get a mirror and you will have your answer

[Gigabitch]

Does Christina Aguilera look Hispanic?

[zro]

what the ****? no she looks white and a bit of slut, i think i know where you are going with this and since you are a female a logical argument with you is damn near impossible, so i did search on wikepidia to get the facts, and yes her dad is hespanic but here mum is Irish, so she is WHITE, i dont give a **** how many spanish albums she wrote, she is not hispanic in my point of view, "if it looks like a duck, acts like a duck... its a ****ing duck"

[Gribble]

That would not fly around here. I know some Hispanic people who would lose their minds over that one.

I'm actually in that boat. Dad was born in Cuba, mom's great grandfather was born in Spain. But I look about as white as white can be. It's no skin off my back, though. If I'm applying for scholarships or hitting on black chicks I'm Cuban. If the police pull me over I'm white.

And to be honest, all this racial identity crap pisses me off. Why the hell do I need to categorize myself to get a license or enroll in college... enroll in anything, for that matter? I was born in America. I'm American. Not hispanic, not Latin-American. American. Thank you.

[Gigabitch]

And to be honest, all this racial identity crap pisses me off. Why the hell do I need to categorize myself to get a license or enroll in college... enroll in anything, for that matter? I was born in America. I'm American. Not hispanic, not Latin-American. American. Thank you.

I feel the same way, but I'm about as white as I can be, so I fit pretty tidily into the generally accepted perception of what American is. I'm TV American.

Where I live, the majority of people are Hispanic, and yes, Christina Aguilera counts.

Okay, zro, what are you if your mom is from Uganda and your dad is from Portugal?

[zro]

If i look portugese, i am portugese, if i look like i am from uganda then i am from uganda..simple really and if you think christina aguilera is hispanic, you need glasses or a guide dog, people really need to respect and cherish their identity and not alter themselves to suit different situations

[Junket]

people really need to respect and cherish their identity and not alter themselves to suit different situations

Y'know, in the grand scheme of things, this affects nobody but the individual in question.

For instance, ever think one thing and do another?

Seems pretty two-face doesn't it?

Deceptive?

How about respectful?

I've put a lot of thought into this, especially living in such a multi-cultural society. To a limit, I'll alter how I speak with certain people, especially for my job where the majority of my customers are black. Now, I'm not talkin' about things like "ya'll trippin", "dawg", and "nigga", but I will pull a "Sup?" and "Naw" stressing certain vowels more than I normally would. It helps make them comfortable, and makes my job easier, especially with those who find my "proper" speech condescending and thus disrespectful. I'm not out to prove anything to anybody on such a brief meeting. At the end of the day, does that really matter to anybody but myself? If I don't give a shit whether somebody see's that as bein' fake, or "selling out", why should anybody else care?

In my class however, I'm surrounded by urban blacks of several ages. There, I'm the "outsider". So I stay quiet, observe, speaking in a manner more similar to their's while slipping in bits of how I'm more comfortable with speaking. My goal to ease them into respecting who I am. Normally, I wouldn't bother with this, but these are guys (and girl) that I will spend the next couple months with, so I'll put in the effort. Some people need to ease into things. I avoid group attention, so walking in and speaking in the "proper" manner I do on the first day, would just draw me such attention.

And funny you bring up being what you "look" like.

Some people think I'm white, others can tell right off the bat I'm Asian as well.

Which identity to cherish, in front of whom?

Quite frankly I don't give my "identity" a thought anymore, 'cause it shouldn't matter to anyone but myself. And ****, if I could get a scholarship for being Asian? Why not? If I could avoid getting a ticket because I'm white? ****, why not? It's my identity, not China's, not Sweden's, not Italy's. I'm not here to represent them. I will represent myself, how I see fit.

I think the question more applicable to this thread is "what is the difference between self-respect, and pride?"