clinton and obama

[DoesntMatter]

Pulling out of the UN would almost be as good as getting kicked out (something I think the US deserved for Iraq--sorry, I know not everyone agreed but its still ultimately what the Bush admin deserves, or at least a removal of the veto status).

That's a funny thought, the worlds only superpower being kicked out of the United Nations

Shit, if *I* was president,
we would be out of Iraq letting those ****ers kill eachother,

social security would disappear,

income redistribution would be limited to those who literally cannot put another meal on the table,

funding for NASA, our military, and science and math programs would quadruple,

Iranian president would be assassinated and made to look like an internal event,

the border would be secured (illegals throwing rocks at custom agents would be shot),

protestors in 3rd world countries demanding the death of America like they love to chant so much would be missiled and any additional protestors demanding the death of American (and by extension me and my family) would meet the same fate,

we would drill in Alaska and let the 12 polar bears in the drill sites radius find a new home,

alternative oil possibilities would be pursued like mad with money saved from pointless government programs like welfare,

man would walk on Mars as soon as possible,

prostitution would be legalized,

etc

[IndiReloaded]

That's a funny thought, the worlds only superpower being kicked out of the United Nations.

You don't actually believe this^ do you? This is debatable, both militarily & definitely economically. The asian markets could cause chaos in the US tomorrow if they wanted.


Read more, DM. The Economist is expensive as a personal subscription, but your library should have it. Its a decent rag for starters.

[DoesntMatter]

Come on Indi, everything is debatable. Our military straight up kicks ass, one reason I wanted to become an officer through NROTC. What our military was not designed to do was police a country. It was designed to kill! Damn politicians using the military for the wrong reasons. But back the main point, we have the most advanced military along with our British allies because we can share stuff with them

OK I don't know anything about economics so I can't argue that one, but compare the standard of living of the average Chinese dude to the average American. I'm pretty sure we win

But my main reason for saying the US is THE superpower is because we are responsible for the greatest technological achievements. We had a pretty easy formula, just take all the smart people from other countries and let them in and they are just as American as me. We have 17 of the best 20 colleges internationally. I mean, come on.

Also, I know other countries have higher average standards of living, but in the US you can get really rich with just a little bit of hard work

Some countries may have individual parts of this, but the US has it all

[Gigabitch]

Ay, caramba. Yes, the Chinese own our asses. Jeeze.

Indi's right- y'all should pick up a copy of the Economist and try to get through the whole thing. It'll give you nightmares.

[DoesntMatter]

Hmm Yeah my dad is always complaining about how we are too dependent on China. He's really into economics and money-(as is any good Calabrian) and has nightmares because of China (not literally)

If we let loose our grip of technological dominance then ... yeah

[IndiReloaded]

But my main reason for saying the US is THE superpower is because we are responsible for the greatest technological achievements. We had a pretty easy formula, just take all the smart people from other countries and let them in and they are just as American as me. We have 17 of the best 20 colleges internationally. I mean, come on.

Yes, come on. "If wishes were wings" would apply.

The Chinese own ALL our asses, DM, as Giga said. This is the PRESENT situation. You are very ignorant to suggest otherwise. Sorry man, but everything you post above... totally irrelevant. May as well compare 20th century US with 18th century England or ancient Rome. B/c all the US achievements are related to those with about as much relevance.

Now that you know your opinion is not quite what you thought, this should motivate you to become more informed. I hope so anyway.

[IndiReloaded]

If we let loose our grip of technological dominance then ... yeah

You are ALREADY DOING THIS. What the hell did you think my pages of argument w/Mish in that other thread were FOR, anyway? I hope noone actually thinks I *care* about religion versus atheism?

Ken Miller's final warning in his well-publicized lecture about the dangers of ID in schools was about this very point. There are MANY countries who are more than ready & willing to take the mantle of 'world class research leaders' away from the US (& Canada to a lesser extent). And once gone, you will almost certainly NEVER get it back.

Please, please wake UP ppl.

[DoesntMatter]

Yes, come on. "If wishes were wings" would apply.

The Chinese own ALL our asses, DM, as Giga said. This is the PRESENT situation. You are very ignorant to suggest otherwise. Sorry man, but everything you post above... totally irrelevant. May as well compare 20th century US with 18th century England or ancient Rome. B/c all the US achievements are related to those with about as much relevance.

What do you mean "if wishes were wings" would apply? Are you saying it's wishful thinking that the US is the lead researcher? It's not, we are. Look at Nobel Prize winnings from the last 20 years and see whose country is most represented. The US (with my school having 11th most worldwide)

In all honesty you haven't changed my opinion. I know China is a growing power and a lot needs to be done if the US wants to retain it's position, but if we weren't in Iraq right now, 1 vs 1 the US would destroy China in a war


Are you saying some countries are just going to will themselves into becoming more active researchers? That is something more closely tied with a school than a country

And finally I pretty much read next to nothing on your posts with Mish. I don't know if you were implying this, but if you think religion is somehow preventing the US from maintaining it's technological prowess ... Verify this?

And what do you mean about "IDs" in public schools

[DoesntMatter]

May as well compare 20th century US with 18th century England or ancient Rome. B/c all the US achievements are related to those with about as much relevance.

WTF? No. How about compare the end of the 20th century US vs the end of the 20th century any other country? That is actually relevant

[IndiReloaded]

What do you mean "if wishes were wings" would apply?

About being the only major military power on the planet. Its hard to get actual #s on China's military (they are pretty darned closemouthed on the subject) but all signs indicate they are at least as powerful as the US at present.

Are you saying it's wishful thinking that the US is the lead researcher? It's not, we are. Look at Nobel Prize winnings from the last 20 years and see whose country is most represented. The US (with my school having 11th most worldwide).

Meh, no offense DM, but that was then & this is now. If the US keeps going the way it is, it will be lucky to remain in the top 5.

In all honesty you haven't changed my opinion. I know China is a growing power and a lot needs to be done if the US wants to retain it's position, but if we weren't in Iraq right now, 1 vs 1 the US would destroy China in a war.

Then you're more ignorant than I thought. Good luck w/that attitude. I hope you have a proficiency for eastern languages, lol.

Are you saying some countries are just going to will themselves into becoming more active researchers? That is something more closely tied with a school than a country.

You are very naive if this is how you think it works. Most public research $ comes from governments, DM (NIH, NSF, NASA, etc). Institutes like universities just manage the funds & provide a home for scientists. They don't actually FUND the research, lol. This is why scientists who bring in huge research $$$ have the schools bending over for them. Money = power.

Other countries are increasing spending while the US considers cutting theirs (or hamstringing scientists so they don't want to work there anymore). You're in Germany, right? European schools are one of the regions that are starting to look more attractive to US-trained researchers. The reasons are complicated, but truth all the same.

I don't know if you were implying this, but if you think religion is somehow preventing the US from maintaining it's technological prowess ... Verify this?

Okay:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVRsWAjvQSg"]YouTube - Ken Miller on Intelligent Design[/ame]

Its almost 2 hours long, so I would suggest you just scroll to near the end of his talk & listen to what he has to say on the subject. BTW, even tho Ken's a scientist, he's also a devoute Christian. Gives his points even more power, to my mind.

Its an opinion held by many in the research community, esp elite ones. Good scientists hate nothing more than feeling hamstrung & will leave countries to be able to do their work w/very little loyalty for their country of origin, as far as doing their research goes. Ref examples like Soviet Union & German scientists (Einstein) of the 20th century.

And what do you mean about "IDs" in public schools

ID = intelligent design. Its just one example of how US research efforts are being undermined.

Anyway, I don't have time for this (again), just telling you like Giga already did, that you need to read a bit more b/c your opinion is a bit limited.

[anachronistic]

Why the **** is religion cramming its ass into every single thread?

and doesntmatter lives in germany?

[DoesntMatter]

I didn't say that we are the only major military power on the planet, I said we are the strongest. "All signs indicating they are at least as powerful as the US at present" <-- that's bullshit. They have more infantry. We have superior small arms, superior tanks, superior fighter planes and stealth bombers, super subs, just overall technology that pwns them. Saying China has a better military, THAT is ignorance

I know that the government gives money to schools for research and that is where most of it comes from, I'm probably going to be doing undergraduate research in transition metal chemistry junior year. A lot of countries don't have that kind of money to spend on research. The US does, and we also the the schools already established with a certain level of awesomeness that does attract these individuals.

If you think intelligent design is undermining US research efforts you are clueless. I don't even see how you could argue this. I'm at one of the best schools for undergraduate research anywhere and can't even imagine where this would start to play into the equation

No I'm not in Germany, I'm in the US

[Junket]

The US is no longer a super power.

Period.

[Tone]

Go Obama !

[DoesntMatter]

Not when we have douchebag liberals running every form of media trying to convince the world we aren't

We beat Afghanistan in what, I can't remember, 3 weeks? And how long was it for Iraq?

Now that we decided to stay for the aftermath it's reflecting poorly on us. It isn't a war, it's a bunch of dickheads strapped with bombs. Who cares what they're blowing up? We toppled their government and that's done with