Dimension of the Mind

[anachronistic]

Moment. Have to find it...

Here, just don't take it too seriously. Its religion afterall, tho the ideas are brain stretching for a lark. After a while his talks all start sounding the same (FYI, I've met him, actually; nice fellow ex-physicist as he likes to tell everyone).

May help you to sleep even.

[url]http://www.bswa.org/audio/mp3/Brahmavamso_2004_02_06.mp3[/url]

That was both interesting and boring at the same time! Equilibrium...

When he talks about understanding and trusting teachers and learning to trust oneself... I think that is somewhat ignorant. Brought up some interesting points, didn't really answer any of my questions, lol.

"I am human and I want to REALLY believe that we are special" BS. Where was your conscious mind when you were 1 year old...no one remembers that....that is because the hard drive was empty = no conscious mind.

I am not concerned with the importance of myself, or humanity. I am curious about consciousness. "Where was your conscious mind when you were one year old?" That is a very good question. Well, the only conclusion that seems acceptable as an answer, is because when you are born, you have to learn your instincts. If you are born again, how do you know the world is the same? How do you know that it is this world? When you die, your conscious is lost; you become unconscious. Right? How do you know that it disappears completely? How do you know that consciousness itself is physical? Only something physical can be lost in this physical world. How do you know that the consciousness detaches from your brain, and goes somewhere else?

NEVER even knew this was a debate....neurologists already figured this out long time ago. I can prove that it is the byproduct of the brain...give me a baseball bat and turn around.

Well, I am not here to debate it. I am here to understand the topic more. Furthermore, I didn't know that such a complex subject had been solved already. And when you render someone unconscious with a baseball bat, is the conscience really gone? No, when they wake up, after 3 or 4 or however many days, and they are informed of what happened.

Why can't the physical workings of the brain be enough? Is it because you can't comprehend the fact that our brain is complex enough to create something like the conscious mind you must create alternate universes and dimensions? Just interesting because you have the right answer in there" the physical workings of the brain"...just the rest is not necessary.

Because it does not make sense to me. I haven't dismissed the possibility that the brain generates consciousness, but it is more understandable for me, the other way. Sometimes, when you want to understand something, you have to step outside the boundaries of 'what is necessary'.

On the contrary. There is no conscious, there in only the body. The conscious mind is a by-product of the brain. When you die, your bodies decomposes but never the less still exists in one form or another...your brain dies and your conscious mind never existed in the first place.

How do you know it's not the other way around?

[boobaa]

To find out the truth, you have to abandon your beliefs. But then again, truth is very subjective and in the end it still comes down how we see things.
Thats the very reason why we have 5 different working theories about atoms and energy, different religions, and just the simple belief that bus will take us to school in the morning and not to some place else...

We believe what is easier to believe, what we are used to see around us. Therefore we can never truly believe something that exists outside of our world.

Even if consciousness is somewhere outside and reality is just the product of consciousness, we still live in this very world, be it imaginary if you will. And we must accept this, this is something we have proof for. We live in this world.

Ofcourse there are other dimensions, there always is, thats what quantrum physics is all about, but that is just beyond and unbearable.

I suggest watching NOVA: [url]http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/elegant/program.html[/url]

It may spark some ideas how complex and diverse it all really is.



And if we take as this, that conciousness exists outside from this world, but is bound with certain chemicals what we call our body, then why exactly is it so? Why doesn't stone have conciousness, or has it?

[vashti]

Why doesn't stone have conciousness?

Because it lacks a brain.

[misombra]

i don't know.

i don't really care either.

although i have been contemplating, quite a bit, the collective conscious of birds.

[IndiReloaded]

Why the hell is there an ad for a Neuro Programmer (that mentions NLP, arrrgh!) at the bottom of this thread?

The darn thing looks like a tin foil helmet that crazy ppl wear...

If you can't see the ad, let me know b/c I 'grabbed' it.

LoveAdmin, are you having a little joke at our expense?

[Gribble]

An algorithm checks everything that's being discussed in a particular thread, then searches of an ad that corresponds in some way.

[Kiechi]

[Junket]

I'm just sayin', I spent my high school years, thinkin' about that shit.

It's just mental masturbation.

[Tiay]

I concur with OV.

We humans seem to like to think that we're so f*cking special, and we need souls or spirits of consciousnesses or whatever else connected to us floating around on some other universe or plane or world or ethereal space to explain how we've come to be so very special.

why is it not enough to accept that nature is bloody complicated? I think it's because lay people have no idea how things really work. How does your body really work? How does DNA work? who "reads" DNA? how does one's metabolism really work? Whenever we're told about it, it all seems kind of science-fictioney. So there may as well be a portal to another world in our brains.

'wing, you claim that it's not about the importance of humanity, but it IS. You didn't just go eenie minie miney mo, I'll choose to speculate about the human consciousness existing on another plane, rather, than, say, speculate about whether mice are really super intelligent pan-dimensional beings who've come to study us - that's obviously why they're in all the labs. Free cookie for anyone who gets the reference.



They are both silly unfalsifiable theories for which there is no support. They are, in my mind, equally silly and pointless to argue about.

[anachronistic]

I concur with OV.

We humans seem to like to think that we're so f*cking special, and we need souls or spirits of consciousnesses or whatever else connected to us floating around on some other universe or plane or world or ethereal space to explain how we've come to be so very special.

why is it not enough to accept that nature is bloody complicated? I think it's because lay people have no idea how things really work. How does your body really work? How does DNA work? who "reads" DNA? how does one's metabolism really work? Whenever we're told about it, it all seems kind of science-fictioney. So there may as well be a portal to another world in our brains.

'wing, you claim that it's not about the importance of humanity, but it IS. You didn't just go eenie minie miney mo, I'll choose to speculate about the human consciousness existing on another plane, rather, than, say, speculate about whether mice are really super intelligent pan-dimensional beings who've come to study us - that's obviously why they're in all the labs. Free cookie for anyone who gets the reference.



They are both silly unfalsifiable theories for which there is no support. They are, in my mind, equally silly and pointless to argue about.

No, Tiay, you're wrong. I believe that all living things (with a brain) are conscious, and "special". I already said that, so why are you assuming, still? Furthermore, if I did not understand how the physical part of it works, wouldn't I have asked a question related to that instead? Yes!

You seem to be unable to step outside things as you understand them. That is a level of ignorance. You posted once, that I jump to conclusions. Who is jumping to conclusions in this case?

And again, I have not made this thread to ARGUE about beliefs. So if you're close-minded, I am sorry, but this topic is not fit for you, because you can't be close-minded and actually have a discussion about such things.

[Only-virgins]

I used to think about this the same way lilwing does....when I was 12. No offense. I have nothing more to say here, the conscious mind is the byproduct of the brain and there is no reason to assume anything else. Though please do not assume I don't think "out side the box" I have in order to have come to the conclusion. I wrote a paper a LONG time ago in my Philosophy class on the conscious mind. Animals are not as conscious of their existence as we humans are and we have the much larger frontal cortex to thank for that.

You can call people closed minded and ignorant all you want because you think they don't think like you but that doesn't make them wrong. It is in fact pathetic and insulting that you would think that someone like me didn't consider EVERY option before coming to the conclusion I have come too. It is great pondering things like this, I used to think about these things all the time...falling asleep to it as sometimes...ideas like the conscious mind, free will and cause and effect, human choice and chance, ethics and all kinds of things...but after all that it became evident that the truth is always rational and logical.

The frontal lobes have been found to play a part in impulse control, judgment, language production, working memory, motor function, sexual behavior, socialization, problem solving initiation, facial movement, planning abilities, coordinating, and motivation. The frontal lobes assist in planning, coordinating, controlling, and executing behavior. People who have damaged frontal lobes may experience problems with these aspects of cognitive function, being at times impulsive; impaired in their ability to plan and execute complex sequences of actions; perhaps persisting with one course of action or pattern of behavior when a change would be appropriate (perseveration).

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontal_lobe[/url]

I know it is hard to comprehend by some people that it is just this that allows us to be self-aware of our existence and say "I am who I am" and it brings up questions such as "Why am I me and not him?" ...but these are old questions and have been answered already...it really is that simple...THE BRAIN!

Thank you evolution ! ...oh and we are special and unique as the homo sapiens ...but that doesn't mean we need some unexplainable theories to attach to.

Hey, I'll share that cookie with you Tiay !

[IndiReloaded]

I'll choose to speculate about the human consciousness existing on another plane, rather, than, say, speculate about whether mice are really super intelligent pan-dimensional beings who've come to study us - that's obviously why they're in all the labs. Free cookie for anyone who gets the reference.

Douglas Adams, sweetie. That was an easy one. But give the cookie to OV b/c I prefer steaks from self-marketing cows.

[Only-virgins]

Douglas Adams, sweetie. That was an easy one. But give the cookie to OV b/c I prefer steaks from self-marketing cows.

I didn't know that. ... thanks for the cookie

[IndiReloaded]

Told you, Dougie Adams was one of my favourite atheists. Own all his books (except the Salmon of Doubt), lol.

I think the mice show up in Restaurant at the End of the Universe, but not sure. Was reason for the cow reference (..just go in the back & shoot myself now).

[Only-virgins]

Told you, Dougie Adams was one of my favourite atheists. Own all his books (except the Salmon of Doubt), lol.

I think the mice show up in Restaurant at the End of the Universe, but not sure. Was reason for the cow reference (..just go in the back & shoot myself now).

I know Adams but I just couldn't figure out that the quote was from him. Ah well, mice in a restaurant at the end of the universe lol.