Club Team Effort Suggestions

[GrkScorp]

Hey wait. Are you insinuating that I'm gay?

I can assure you, I like dick very much.

I know Blue.. I know..

Not an insult.. just commenting on how rare it is..

[IndiReloaded]

Vash said exactly the same thing I said. Men are one of the main sources of revenue in clubs. What attracts them to these places? Women Women are the primary source of attraction to these places for them. Anyone who doesn't like this fact, please avoid the clubs.

True. But I don't think the mere fact of being present in a club means its Open Season on the women who are there. Touching without permission, in Blue's example, is definitely not okay.

Sounds to me like such places are really just an excuse for some men to drop the gentlemen act & go caveman. Kind of sad if this is their default.

[vashti]

Vash said exactly the same thing I said.

I just said it better.

Men are one of the main sources of revenue in clubs. What attracts them to these places? Women Women are the primary source of attraction to these places for them. Anyone who doesn't like this fact, please avoid the clubs.

I think what were were disagreeing with was that the point of going to a club (from a women's perspective) is to get hit on. If all women avoided clubs because the guys are aggressive, and decided instead to hang out in bookstores, guess where all the creepy guys would be? In the bookstore.

If women can't go to certain places because they don't love to get hit on constantly, I guess the only solution is to either wear a burqa, or never leave the house.

[bluesummer]

Vash said exactly the same thing I said. Men are one of the main sources of revenue in clubs. What attracts them to these places? Women Women are the primary source of attraction to these places for them. Anyone who doesn't like this fact, please avoid the clubs.

The point is Mish, that guys don't seem to 'get it' that the majority of girls DON'T go there with the intention of meeting/hooking up with guys. Ask any woman where the worst place to meet a guy is, and they'll pretty much all say the same thing: "at a club or bar". I'm female, I know this better than you.

Even the girls dressed like whores don't go there to pick up. Like GS said, they're going there to get attention. They like to be looked at, flirted with, have drinks bought for them. But they're usually not going home with you. I think guys know this deep down, but they keep hoping and hoping they'll beat the odds. They stupidly spend money on drinks for girls who might dance with them IF they're lucky. Occasionally, if you get one stupidly drunk, you may be able to drag her into a cab and back to your place for awkward drunken sex. Awesome!

So what exactly are you guys trying to accomplish?

Really, are you looking for one night stands? Do you just go to dance with girls so you can look like a stud in front of your buddies? If you're trying to actually 'meet someone' your odds are almost zero. How many people do you know are in a LTR with someone they met at the bar?

[GrkScorp]

Women know exactly what they're getting into, and the types of guys that go to these places on the regular..

They like this attention.. the whole complaining about it.. "ugh.. I hate it when you just go there and all these guys hit on you".. Yes, it's uncomfortable.. but guess what.. if it's not your first time, and you keep going there.. you have no excuse.. so cut the act.. you just like "pretending to complain" about (all the male attention I get).. because it indirectly communicates that you get male attention, that you're attractive, that loser/desperate guys who go there on the regular, and will hit on about anything that moves with the aid of alcohol are pumping up your image of yourself..

The dressing up for other women is a means of communicating to other women.. "b*tch, I look better than you, you have nothing on me, I can take your attention and man away in the drop of a hat, and you know it, that's why you looked at me that way, and now you're pretending that you're not intimidated, cut the act sister".. and hence the anger and strong time and effort women take in trying to rationalize this some other way.. "Oh no, these women are just wh0res".. don't hate them because nature blessed them, it's not their fault they're putting what they have on display.. don't be bitter and spiteful.. it's ok.. there's more to life than looks.. seriously.. there's no need to be jealous and catty..

That's why.. if Blue is serious about what she's saying.. then more credit to her.. because too many women say it as nothing more than denial of the truth.. but not too many women say it and mean it.. and if the latter is the case, then it's indeed rare.. and respectable..

Now, lesbians are like guys.. They don't try and find ways to indirectly/directly attract attention from women they're not interested in, just to feel sexy and attractive and validate their self-image.. No.. If they get such attention from lower-value people.. it has the effect of getting them thinking "oh gosh, are these the only people that find me attractive? Is this who i'm limited to?"

In clubs.. guys want sex.. girls want validation.. Even if you look at them, and you're not really interested in her, and you don't even find her attractive.. she's so thirsty for validation, that she'll find a million ways to rationalize that you DO like her, and that she IS sexy.. "I know he looked at me, I know he wants me, he's just looking away now to pretend he doesn't like me, he's just talking to her now to try and get my attention, ugh.. I see right through his act, how vain.. he's probably too intimidated and scarred to come up and talk to be over this music.. that must be it.. because there's no way i'm not sexy/attractive enough.. that can't possibly be the case".. So, why on earth would you throw that label onto yourself as a guy by stepping foot into a club? Better yet, who on earth would you just give out validation? You're paying the higher cover fee, you're thinking about buying her drinks, touching her, showering her with your full attention, why? What are YOU getting out of this? Exactly..

So, the guys who end up going to these places.. are exactly the types of guys that women don't want.. Just by showing up there, you put that label on yourself (unless you show up with female company).. and funny enough, these are the guys who they seek validation from.. because they don't want to take the risk and seek validation from a higher value guy.. they might not get enough stuff to work with, and rationalize that he likes her.. they might get strong & clear signals of disinterest which would be lethal to her ego.. so it's better to seek validation from desperate, loser, creepy, needy, cheap, low-quality guys.. than to seek it elsewhere.. (nice)

[Mish]

The point is Mish, that guys don't seem to 'get it' that the majority of girls DON'T go there with the intention of meeting/hooking up with guys. Ask any woman where the worst place to meet a guy is, and they'll pretty much all say the same thing: "at a club or bar". I'm female, I know this better than you.

Even the girls dressed like whores don't go there to pick up. Like GS said, they're going there to get attention. They like to be looked at, flirted with, have drinks bought for them. But they're usually not going home with you.

Ofcourse they don't go there "intentionally" to pick up. They go there to have fun, relax, enjoy opprtunities and experiences. And if something good was to happen, if someone was to make them feel all these incredible feelings inside, then anything can happen. At least this is my experience. Girls go there to let their hair down guys go there for girls, but everyone is aware of the limitless opportunities which turn into certain experiences. This is the nature of these places. They are not purpose build just for dance.

Occasionally, if you get one stupidly drunk, you may be able to drag her into a cab and back to your place for awkward drunken sex. Awesome!

So what exactly are you guys trying to accomplish?

Really, are you looking for one night stands? Do you just go to dance with girls so you can look like a stud in front of your buddies? If you're trying to actually 'meet someone' your odds are almost zero.

I don't know about other guys, but like I said I personally look at clubs as a simulation. It's a place for me to experience initiation, experience openning up to groups, experience conversations, stories, even kino when warranted, see what works and what doesn't with a wide variety of women. I learn a lot from these experiences and use them with real life prospects.

How many people do you know are in a LTR with someone they met at the bar?

One recently got married after being in a 4 year relationship

[GrkScorp]

So what exactly are you guys trying to accomplish?

You're implying that Mish specs in bars & clubs, maybe his friends spec in bars, but Mish never mentioned that he specs in clubs, only that he's better than his friends in pulling female attention..

Want some good places to start?

- Coffee houses/Cafe'-lounges
- Book Stores, Music stores (any store that has nothing to do with food or clothes)
- Diners (1-4am, after they start comming back from the clubs, alone, trying to sober up before they go back home)
- Colleges (seriously, go to stores around a college area, related to books, food, the subway, etc)
- Employees (again, seriously.. bartenders, hostesses, waitresses, assistants, are all fair game, but you have to go about it the right way)
- Weddings and other chick-events & parties

Ask someone, "where do you go when you want to meet guys? take your time to really think about it, where do you go when you're actively looking to meet men you want to go out with?".. You're going to get a long pause.. No woman ever wants to admit that she's "looking for" a man.. that would blow up and shatter the face/mask/image/act she puts up.. So after that long pause, you're going to get some crappy thinking.. "Just out on the street I guess, work, the grocery store, when I walk my dog, I don't know".. And if you probe at it deeply enough.. and long enough.. you're going to slowly allow each and every woman to realize.. that they're constantly looking for a man.. that's why they're unable to answer the question.. but there are instances where they are NOT looking for a man, and those instances they can name.. and "clubs & bars" are way up high on the top of the list.. right next to her "OB/GYN's office"..

It's like they're turned-off.. Litterally, the off-botton has been clicked.. imagine being at a Femenist's rally, and having a girl come up to you, just as some 350lb. cow of a woman goes up and starts yelling her lungs off about how men want to take over the world, and they think they can because they have a penis, and how women should just cut it off and do the world a favor.. and that women have the vagina, they should make the rules.. you get the idea.. But here is this really nice girl.. still talking to you.. are you REALLY in "yeah, i'd consider her as a potential gf" mode? Not really.. She would have to cover a LOT of ground to get you to get into that mode.. Now, think about how it feels like to have those shackles on.. to have those gates come down.. and try and imagine them 20 times stronger and more powerful.. that's what it feels like for a girl to walk into a bar/club.. she knows what she's walking into.. she likes it, but at the same time, doesn't want it to lead anywhere.. it's a double-edged sword, and both blades are bad news for you..

If you want to practice, go to coffee shops and book stores.. you're get a lot more experience that way, and a clearer idea of what her signs/reaction really mean.. as opposed to bars/clubs.. (again, i'm thinking NYC bars/clubs.. if bar/clubs in Australia are like bar/clubs in Europe.. then by all means.. this doesn't really apply.. at least not fully)

[bluesummer]

That's why.. if Blue is serious about what she's saying.. then more credit to her.. because too many women say it as nothing more than denial of the truth.. but not too many women say it and mean it.. and if the latter is the case, then it's indeed rare.. and respectable..

I don't bullshit. I've been to a club once in the last four years because I really started to get annoyed with the piggish comments and inappropriate fondling. In fact, the pics in the gallery are from that one time....one of my best friends' birthdays....we had a group of guys and girls there (mostly married ppl!), we went to drink and dance together as a group (this is what she wanted for her birthday...so I went). The night was great, and fun, until some guy came up behind me and grabbed my ass (oh, and some little asian girl hurled chunks all over the bar beside us - ew!!). Suddenly I remembered why I didn't club anymore. I left.

So, the guys who end up going to these places.. are exactly the types of guys that women don't want.. Just by showing up there, you put that label on yourself

Exactly. So the girls who do go there and whore themselves out to these guys deserve what they get. But those ones are easy to pick out. Note to guys: if a bunch of girls are there in a group, they are likely out for a girls night, and want to be left alone. Don't go there.

[Gribble]

Bars and clubs are the last places I go to pick up women.

Take me to a party on campus. Lots of booze and stupid freshmen girls pretending they're women. Easy pickings.

Sigh... I never should have finished school.

[bluesummer]

- Ask someone, "where do you go when you want to meet guys? take your time to really think about it, where do you go when you're actively looking to meet men you want to go out with?".. You're going to get a long pause.. No woman ever wants to admit that she's "looking for" a man.. that would blow up and shatter the face/mask/image/act she puts up..

Are you kidding me? I can answer this question without even thinking about it. When I want to meet men I go out to social events, join clubs, play sports, even join online dating groups (thats how I met my current bf, and he's the greatest guy I've ever met).

Why would you think a woman has a problem admitting she's looking for a relationship? Honestly, sometimes I wonder what kind of women you associate with, they must be either total bitches or just plain stupid. Either that, or you just underestimate women on the whole.

[vashti]

Honestly, sometimes I wonder what kind of women you associate with, they must be either total bitches or just plain stupid. Either that, or you just underestimate women on the whole.

Yeah, that. ^

[Mish]

In the end, we all know that women really dress for other women. Men will hit on anyone, regardless of what they are wearing, but women? They KNOW about your clothes.

See, I don't understand this. Why do women dress up for other women? What's the point of that? Do they want to get hit on by other women? Is that what it's all about

But seriously, what's the intention? What's the need to look more diserable than other women?

My biting retard ex explained it to me very simply one day as "it's all about competition, you have a rank and you're competing with other women for the highest one. The prize is validation and attention". This is not too disimilar to what Scorp was saying, logic behind it "I dress up so I can get more attention than you". I'm pretty sure she was wrong, but what's your take on this?

[vashti]

When I say that women dress for other women, what I mean is that they are dressing for the female social group they wish to identify with. I suppose there are hyper-competitive women out there, just as there are hyper-feminine men, but I don't think the majority of women think this way.

Also, if a woman thinks you look hot, that is more flattering than if a male thinks it. Women aren't trying to hit on you, so if they tell you you look great, it's the truth.

[bluesummer]

When I say that women dress for other women, what I mean is that they are dressing for the female social group they wish to identify with. I suppose there are hyper-competitive women out there, just as there are hyper-feminine men, but I don't think the majority of women think this way.

Also, if a woman thinks you look hot, that is more flattering than if a male thinks it. Women aren't trying to hit on you, so if they tell you you look great, it's the truth.

Exactly, I look at it more in a social interaction sense. I dress to the level of the people I like to socially interact with. I've actually befriended other women over outfits, lol. But CERTAIN types of clothing also tell me that that's not a woman I would likely interract with. Like the ones in the super tight jeans with their g-strings pulled way up their back.

[Mish]

When I say that women dress for other women, what I mean is that they are dressing for the female social group they wish to identify with.

But whats the reason for wanting to look more desirable than the women in the group? This goes way further than identity. If you wish to identify you can wear matching clothing with other members of the group, but that's not the case. Try to wear something that looks remotely like one of your girl friends and she will hate you forever. This is what I don't understand, whats the motivation to try to out-compete members of your own group with dressing up?

Also, if a woman thinks you look hot, that is more flattering than if a male thinks it.

I agree. But I think it's because male motivation is mostly to conqeur and female motivation is mostly to choose and keep the right match. Knowing that you look hot with intention of being choosen is much better than knowing you look hot with intention of being conquered (If that makes any sense)

Women aren't trying to hit on you, so if they tell you you look great, it's the truth.

True. Though (stranger) girls don't say this very often. Actually it's very rare to hear compliments to guys from women, they aren't as open to strangers as guys. Ussualy this truth comes from girls who are friends and ofcourse friends are honest and mean well.