Doormats

[IndiReloaded]

I think you might be judging some one too soon. The evidence does not fit the label.

I'm clearly missing something, but are you suggesting he may just be reserved, Mish?

If so, Derby, I would agree with Mish. Some men are velvet glove over an iron fist & they can be hard to read. Typically the best sort of man, tho, if they are otherwise decent.

[Mish]

I'm clearly missing something, but are you suggesting he may just be reserved, Mish?

I'm suggesting that what Derby posted may not necessarily mean the guy is a Doormat. He could just be a guy who doesn't really care where they go.

I also don't understand what she means when she says she wants him to push back when she pushes against him, that can be interrupted in lots of different ways. I think she needs to be more specific.

[CocoChanel]

LOL Mish! You have a point It may not be as bad as a doormat. Is he the same way in casual convo?

[Rollerderby]

I'm suggesting that what Derby posted may not necessarily mean the guy is a Doormat. He could just be a guy who doesn't really care where they go.

I also don't understand what she means when she says she wants him to push back when she pushes against him, that can be interrupted in lots of different ways. I think she needs to be more specific.

I do not mean physically pushing. But I don't want to be allowed to whip a guy and always have my way. I like a man who can be a man, but can be gentle at other times.

I am being purposely vague, because it's not this specific situation I am trying to garner info on. I want to know how to inspire someone how to be more assertive

And this guy cares. Trust me. I am just sensing something, which as indie pointed out, could be velvet glove and iron fist syndrome. This is also potentially true. I know he is shy, he is friends with my best friend and tells her so about me.

Other guy, when we met at a party, some other douche was drunkenly hitting on me, and other guy saw the tail end of this but didn't come to my defense. I asked him about it and he said he wasn't sure if I knew the guy, and if it was ok (even though I was obviously not amused.) I already know what you're going to say about this situation. Well, I can guess anyway. I'm leaning more towards guy one right now.

[Mish]

I am being purposely vague, because it's not this specific situation I am trying to garner info on. I want to know how to inspire someone how to be more assertive

You have to be specific because if he really is a doormat then like everyone else has said, there is not much you can do about it. It's a personality flaw. If he is just shy then you can use positive reinforcement to encourage him to come out of his shell. But like Vash said, if you don't like something about him this early in the game then you might as well not continue.

I like a man who can be a man, but can be gentle at other times.

This is enough to drive any man insane

From personal experience, nothing to do with this particular situation. I've been with girls who said something similar and honestly it was liking walking on minefield. You never know when you will be interpreted as too gentle to be considered a man or too strong to be considered a human.

[Rollerderby]

From the link that indie sent me:

"Apologize only when you've done something wrong," Linda advises. "If you spill coffee on someone's lap, then it is appropriate to say, "I'm sorry."
here is the re-posting of the link for those of you who are lazy:
[url]http://www.pioneerthinking.com/ej_assertive.html[/url]

The other day he told me not to apologize for ignoring him briefly for sending a text. I don't like to be on my phone around people, but he pretty much used this psych on me. However, I did think it was at least good of me to apologize. I know what chronic apologizers are like and they annoy me too. He fortunately, does not do this.

I think he may just be a bit smitten, and therefore kind of in a daze. I just don't want to be in total control. Honeymoon stages end, and then it's like resentmentville if someone has taken advantage of you. I don't want to be on a pedestal. I also think my attitude about not whipping guys is healthy. I'm saying, "Here, take your balls, I have my own metaphorical pair." I am a ballbuster by nature, I give guys a hard time in a playful way to see if they can take my bullshit. He isn't doing horribly.

I'll know if I need to bail.

[Yggdrasil]

Cross one of his boundaries and see if he's still a doormat.

Some people simply don't care where they go with you, as long as they are with you. Others need to be 'in charge' or take the lead.

I'm pretty much the same with the wife. I don't care where we go, as long as we are together and have a good time. I usualy leave the decission up to her, but if she can't make up her mind, then I make the decission. I think that's called 'easy going'.

Same for example if someone hits on her or embarasses her. I know she's a big girl and can pick her own fights. I also know if she needs my help, she'll somehow let me know, and I'll be there for her.

When it comes to the appologizing thing, my views are exactly the same. To many people say 'sorry' for something that doesn't need an appology. 'Sorry' sort of became a habbit and it's not being used sincerely anymore by a lot of people. There's nothing wrong with saying: "hang on for a sec, I have to text someone". That's not disrespectfull, that's not something one has to appologize for, that's simply life.

Same if someone crosses my boundaries. First time I'll give a subtle hint. If that doesn't stop it, there will be a 'less subtle' hint. You keep on pushing it, well, that strange tingling feeling you'll experience in your lower back area, will be my foot up your ass

What can I say. I am someone who gladly will be there for someone else, but not at the expenses of my personal wellbeing, health, dignity or moral and ethic views.

I'm also someone who won't easily interfere if someone else is having to set boundaries for themselves, unless it's running out of hand or this person is asking for help. How else can that someone else grow and mature?

Maybe this person has a similar approach to life?

[starbuck]

Roller, are you purposely looking for flaws in this guy? To me, he doesn't sound like a doormat, he just sounds somewhat laid back and/or eager to please you. Doesn't sound like such a bad thing to me, but I then again I like men who dote on me.

A doormat, to me, has always denoted someone with a bit of a damage to overcome. Someone who lets a more aggressive person push him into doing things he doesn't want to do or take advantage.

I wonder if you're taking little personality traits and turning them into flaws in order to have an excuse to bail? As (I think) you mentioned in another thread, you were non-commital.

[Peter Pry]

Rollerderby,

I want to make you consciously aware of the power language you are using to describe your love relationships. "Doormat," "Challenge," "push back," "let me walk on him," "here, take your balls." One of your needs from a relationship is clearly a power exchange. Which kicks ass. Power is hot. But you're going to have to find someone who can provide you with that. Your boys, they're not doormats exactly; they're powerless.

They're stunned into submission by your own powerful personality. they perceive you as the power broker, but your posts here are almost begging them to overcome you and take you in hand. You are choosing lovers too young and inexperienced to understand that. When people see a powerful person, they tend to assume that she wants obedience.

Take the easy case: Loser Boy #2 who should have saved you from Drunken Douchebag. He knows that you are a powerful in-control person, so he reasons that you wouldn't be talking with DD unless that was precisely what you wanted to be doing, when in fact what you really wanted was for him to ride up and save you. Better Boy #1 is reacting to you the same way: you always seem so together and in control, so he abdicates thinking to please you, not realizing that what you really need is a man to match you with his own brain and the testes to use it.

You can't grow brains and testes for them. That can never work. You can't train someone to assert themselves to you. Your "encouragement" is likely to only put you even higher on the power broker pedestal. The best you can do is break down the social training that is at the root of some of this behavior (they think that by leaving you alone to make all the choices they are respecting you) and to just say what you're feeling and hope that one of them will get the message. Perhaps something like: "I have to deal with idiots all day. They wouldn't know how to tie their shoes if I didn't tell them. I need you to be better than that. I don't want to be the one constantly directing you. I've got enough sycophants at work. I need you to challenge me. I'm yours to take, but you have to step up and take me."

[Gigabitch]

Do you want the carrot or the stick?

Carrot: reward him for assertive behavior

Stick: ask him if you can borrow a tampon from him, call him "girlfriend", take him out for pedicures...

[Rollerderby]

I like what you guys are saying. And yes Starbuck, I think you're calling me out, and I need that lol. Thanks peter, giga mish and yggdra

[IndiReloaded]

I am just sensing something, which as indie pointed out, could be velvet glove and iron fist syndrome.

To be clear: I don't consider it a "syndrome". I actually admire men of this character, who have managed to tame their inner beast. They aren't wimps at all, the sort I'm describing.

[lovesjoyajm]

To be clear: I don't consider it a "syndrome". I actually admire men of this character, who have managed to tame their inner beast. They aren't wimps at all, the sort I'm describing.

Ok...but...

Sometimes you want to know they HAVE an inner beast that has been tamed. Don't you feel like it's sometimes hard to tell the difference?

[Mish]

Take the easy case: Loser Boy #2 who should have saved you from Drunken Douchebag. He knows that you are a powerful in-control person, so he reasons that you wouldn't be talking with DD unless that was precisely what you wanted to be doing, when in fact what you really wanted was for him to ride up and save you.

Derby, are you sure you are communicating properly what it is that you want? Because above scenario is very likely with any guy whether or not they happen to be loser or a non loser. If you are projecting a domineering personality then you lose a lot of 'damsel in distress' claims. I believe every relationship has a more dominant type and more laid back type personality to be able to work (either one can be a man or woman), the more dominant initiates and the more laid back reciprocates, which one are you? It is very hard to be both. If you are more dominant then maybe you are looking for more laid back guys?

[Junket]

I'll push back.




With my cock.