Your paranormal experiences

[Doc Durian]

Doc can't take me to the place where he was attacked by spirits. He can't repeat that experience for me. Nobody was around to document it. He doesn't have camera footage. He hasn't recorded everything in painstaking detail. All I have is his word. That isn't good enough.

Who said they were spirits as such?

Good luck trying to objectively replicate my experiences, bud. You're going to need a miracle to not prior influence the events with your own thoughts/feelings.

[ecojeanne]

Then gribble why do you so vehemently refute the claims by calling them bullshit since you know nothing about it..why bother?

[Gribble]

Because someone has to. Someone's got to stand up to these lunatics and snake oil salesmen.

This kind of talk should be met with undisguised disbelief and the more absurd cases should be met with open disgust.

We aren't living in the dark ages. There's no excuse for this crap.

[ecojeanne]

lol, now thats not a reason. you never know, do ya? if it's not harming anyone to share their experience then whats the problem?

snake oil salesmen do harm people so i will back you up on that but blue and doc aren't hurting anyone by telling their story which might be true..

[Doc Durian]

You don't like it, Gribble, don't read it.

[bluesummer]

Yeh maybe you are right in your fears and it was a ghost, but don't close your mind to other possibilities which could have been just as likely. .

My god, Mish, I'm not retarded. My mind is open to all possibilities, trust me.

And Grib, like I replied in the other 'invisible thread', these things aren't controlled things you can simply recreate in a lab, which is why they're so random.

You know, I'm not arguing this anymore. I'm not an idiot. I'm quite rational, and I know I can't make it make sense to people that haven't experienced it, which is fine. I'm open minded to the fact that many of these things can be explained with simple logic. Anyone who can't look past logic, though, is close minded. So I'm one up on those of you that think so one-dimensionally.

[Mish]

yes it is harder to believe coz the experience is likely never to repeat itself under a controlled environment, but like i said it doesn't make the experience untrue. it's ignorant to say otherwise. afterall the world is round not flat.

On the contrary. I think if the experience happened then it should be very repeatable. For example if there is a ghost haunting the house who makes noises through the night every night it means you should be able to stay through the night with recording equipment and record the noises which occur. You should be able to measure the frequency of the noise and pin point exactly where the noise is coming from. So far no noises had been pin pointed back to ghosts.

The fact that most paranormal experiences seem to be non repeatable, "unreplicable" and deeply subjective casts a serious doubt about their authenticity. Don't take me the wrong way, I'm not calling anyone stupid. I think most people would want to believe in something like that, it's just I think there has to be something tangible for an experience to become accepted as real interpretation of a real event and not something which is widely open to subjectivity.

[bluesummer]

For example if there is a ghost haunting the house who makes noises through the night every night it means you should be able to stay through the night with recording equipment and record the noises which occur. You should be able to measure the frequency of the noise and pin point exactly where the noise is coming from. So far no noises had been pin pointed back to ghosts.

.

Um, I'm sorry, but hasn't this been done? There are thousands of recordings of sounds from 'haunted' places, replicated. Voices, scratches, footsteps. Problem is, certain people in the scientific community always try to find some way to refute the evidence. There are actual scientists with actual degrees that work on and study this stuff. Feel free to argue if you want. I've read their books. I suppose one guy's PhD is better than anothers though, based simply on what they believe. But hey, the guy who first suggested plate tectonics was also a laughingstock whose career was ruined, just because some snot-nosed scientists with different ideas thought they knew more.

I prefer to keep my mind open than shut, lest I have to eat my words later. I suppose most of you don't believe in extra-terrestrials either. I consider that sheer arrogance.

[Mish]

Um, I'm sorry, but hasn't this been done? There are thousands of recordings of sounds from 'haunted' places, replicated. Voices, scratches, footsteps. Problem is, certain people in the scientific community always try to find some way to refute the evidence.

I read about the cases where people did recordings of sounds and proved that the sounds weren't made by ghosts but by footsteps or voices of actual people. There was always an alternative explanation. And I'm a bit skeptical of a global scientist conspiracy. I'm not aware of any cases which left the scientific community puzzled. Do you know of any I can look up?

I prefer to keep my mind open than shut, lest I have to eat my words later. I suppose most of you don't believe in extra-terrestrials either. I consider that sheer arrogance.

Well, personally I think there is a huge difference between believing that there are extra-terrestrial life forms in existence somewhere in the universe (something we have no way of telling at the moment) and believing a friend who says he gets abducted every night and plays poker with aliens (something that can be verified). I believe there are levels of open mindedness. I think it's important that people are aware of the boundary.

[IndiReloaded]

yes it is harder to believe coz the experience is likely never to repeat itself under a controlled environment, but like i said it doesn't make the experience untrue. it's ignorant to say otherwise.

Eco, your argument is just stupid.

I mean, there is a *chance* that the murderer didn't really kill his victim. People saw him holding the bloody knife over the victim. Twelve people heard him screaming obscenities and found his back bedroom full of photos of her with all kinds of lewd comments written on them. He claimed to hear voices and see ghosts.

But you are totally right. Just b/c the proof all says otherwise doesn't mean that the ghost he's been chatting it up with made him convince the local butcher to lend him his knife and the knife 'just slipped' while he was kneeling over her with her open blouse that she just happened to forget to button closed that evening. And he had a temporary case of tourettes.

Your 'logic' is the sort that allows criminals to escape justice b/c of a lack of 'reasonable doubt'.

For the love of life, will you young ones start to THINK for yourselves and take responsibility for your own rational thought processes? What the hell is wrong with you today? Too many of you can't think critically. Are you so overwhelmed by all the data out there you are baffled by the bullshit? Its the same old crap, snake charmers, fake remedies, conjurers... there's just more of it.

Wake up already.



EDIT - I think your teachers are too easy on you. Time to start raising that bar again, its dropped way too low in the current education system.

[IndiReloaded]

And I'm a bit skeptical of a global scientist conspiracy.

LOL! A bit?

Oh yes, I forgot to mention I am totally a member of the Illuminati. All the scientists at CERN have access to their uber secret weapons and toys way down in underground lv42. If you insist on letting our secret out, I will hunt you down by your IP address and elminate you.

[Mish]

LOL! A bit?

Oh yes, I forgot to mention I am totally a member of the Illuminati. All the scientists at CERN have access to their uber secret weapons and toys way down in underground lv42. If you insist on letting our secret out, I will hunt you down by your IP address and elminate you.

I never doubted that you were secretly running the world (and the banking system)

[Mish]

For the love of life, will you young ones start to THINK for yourselves and take responsibility for your own rational thought processes? What the hell is wrong with all of you today? None of you know how to actually think critically anymore. Are you so overwhelmed by all the data out there you are baffled by the bullshit?

Boo!

......

[IndiReloaded]

A field guide to critical thinking:

[url]http://www.csicop.org/si/9012/critical-thinking.html[/url]

[Doc Durian]

Eco, your argument is just stupid.

I mean, there is a *chance* that the murderer didn't really kill his victim. People saw him holding the bloody knife over the victim. Twelve people heard him screaming obscenities and found his back bedroom full of photos of her with all kinds of lewd comments written on them. He claimed to hear voices and see ghosts.

But you are totally right. Just b/c the proof all says otherwise doesn't mean that the ghost he's been chatting it up with made him convince the local butcher to lend him his knife and the knife 'just slipped' while he was kneeling over her with her open blouse that she just happened to forget to button closed that evening. And he had a temporary case of tourettes.

Your 'logic' is the sort that allows criminals to escape justice b/c of a lack of 'reasonable doubt'.

For the love of life, will you young ones start to THINK for yourselves and take responsibility for your own rational thought processes? What the hell is wrong with you today? Too many of you can't think critically. Are you so overwhelmed by all the data out there you are baffled by the bullshit? Its the same old crap, snake charmers, fake remedies, conjurers... there's just more of it.

Wake up already.



EDIT - I think your teachers are too easy on you. Time to start raising that bar again, its dropped way too low in the current education system.

And now into the criminal system, the innocent until proven guilty clause, and a hot air balloon's worth of broadly suppositional bollocks encapsulated in a child sized scold for scold's sake?

Get down with your bad self, Indi.