Don't know if I'll change my mind on marriage.

[Aeradalia]

Its not just financial, Dalia. Even in troubled marriages, most children enjoy the stability of having two parents and would choose this over divorce, even to extreme situations.

I think people underestimate the trauma that comes from only living with one parent where there was once two. Huge insecurities. My son in his funny moments has said that 'oh well, if something happens to one of you, I've still got the other plus X, Y, Z relatives...'

Clearly, he thinks about it, sometimes. Kids do, its natural.

I know this argument of the quality of children produced in one scenario versus another.

I believe it has little to do with the marriage and more to do with the parents. Forcing parents together for the sake of the children is no guarantee of being beneficial for the children.

To assume that this idea of forcing two people to remain is what brings more stability (emotionally) to the child is folly. It has more to do with the mentality and character of the parents involved. Either they'll work together or they won't.

I'm sure statistics could be provided to show a relationship for your argument... but I wonder if this were to be cross-referenced with age, general disposition, standard of living, and a few other details would that show a more integral influence than simply marriage alone? Also, would unmarried couples with children be included as well?

[misombra]

children are far more worth the work of keeping a relationship together than a marriage is.

[Mish]

What exactly do you believe you are seeing when you look upon these 40+ couples? How much is really there and how much is being mixed with your hopeful ideals?

The unmarried couples that I know are coming from a different place and a different perspective. First of all they don't share the same idea of permanence of their relationship as the married couples I know do. They tend to be more inclined to view their partner as someone they are with only in the here and now. Second they are more inclined to be casual in their attitude towards their partner towards their interaction and the over all quality of their relationship.

The married couples I know, you can sense that these are the people who once exchanged vows who once said "till death to us part" and who meant it. You get the impression (with people I know) that these are the people who will give their life for their partner if necessary. With unmarried couples I just don't get this same impression. For an outsider these differences are very noticeable.

[Aeradalia]

Do you know of any unmarried longterm relationships of 40+ couples with whom you can observe so you can do a more straightforward comparison?

[misombra]

i'm 1000% sure those unmarried, 40+ couples could really give a shit about what outsiders think about their relationship.

[Aeradalia]

Agrees Misombra.

Sorry Mishanya, but I fear you may be window shopping as far as marriage is concerned.

Those married couples might be happy because they love each other... not because they are married.

[Mish]

Do you know of any unmarried longterm relationships of 40+ couples with whom you can observe so you can do a more straightforward comparison?

Yes, some of them are close friends of mine.

Those married couples might be happy because they love each other... not because they are married.

The unmarried couples I know love each other as well. But somehow you can quickly tell that their love is of a different variety.

[Aeradalia]

The unmarried couple I know love each other as well. But somehow you can quickly tell that their love is of a different variety.

And why do you feel that marriage is the deciding factor between a more permanent feeling of love?

All you've provided are two different couples... one apparently more in love with each other than the other. From this method, one could present a married couple who's love is less heated and compare them to a long-term unmarried couple who are more impassioned, and argue a point in contrast to your own.

I still see the quality of love having more to do with those involved than with marriage.

[misombra]

mish you simply have not had enough experience in love to make any kinds of judgements toward a couple and their love. maybe one day you will.

[Mish]

And why do you feel that marriage is the deciding factor between a more permanent feeling of love?

My opinion (if you want to know) on this is that people who get married (that I know) are more comfortable with their choice of partner than the unmarried ones which is why they don't have any reservations in saying their vows where as with the unmarried the impressions of longevity are not as strong, because their certainty in compatibility with their partners is not the same.

This is not an attack on the unmarried couples by the way (after all, I'm one of them). I'm sure despite of this there are many unmarried couples who loves each other very deeply. I'm just saying how I've come to see it based on my personal experience of these dynamics.

[Aeradalia]

Then you've noticed a difference in these two couples. Is one being married and the other not the only thing different? Or are there other factors to take into account as well?

[Mish]

Then you've noticed a difference in these two couples. Is one being married and the other not the only thing different? Or are there other factors to take into account as well?

My comparison is more of 6 married couples and 4 unmarried ones of similar age group. There are some differences between them, though the impression of lacking feeling of permanence and the casual attitude to the relationship are the factors which the 4 appear to have in common.

[misombra]

if that's what you've seen then that's what you've wanted to see. because i have seen many many people get married because it gives them a false sense of security and they get to front to the world how in love they are. and i've seen a lot of married people get divorced. hell i've seen most people get divorced. in the time my bf and i have been together we have seen people meet, get married, and get divorced. their love may be of a different "variety", but i sure as hell don't want that variety.

also, what if i were with a woman for that long, and we weren't legally allowed to marry. would that make us less certain about our compatibility?

[Mish]

if that's what you've seen then that's what you've wanted to see. because i have seen many many people get married because it gives them a false sense of security and they get to front to the world how in love they are. and i've seen a lot of married people get divorced. hell i've seen most people get divorced. in the time my bf and i have been together we have seen people meet, get married, and get divorced. their love may be of a different "variety", but i sure as hell don't want that variety.

Yeh, that's true as well. There are a lot of people out there who get married under the false pretences and for the wrong reasons. The ones who want to show off or prove something shouldn't get married in the first place (this especially true with younger people who get married too early, which is why I mentioned over 40). I see it as a different type of a problem, one where a very serious decision is made too soon without proper consideration of responsibilities that come with it.

If we talk about numbers of people around me then, personally I've witnessed 5 marriages and about 32 new relationships. Out of these I saw 1 divorce and about 27 break ups.

also, what if i were with a woman for that long, and we weren't legally allowed to marry. would that make us less certain about our compatibility?

Isn't there a ban on gay marriage? You wouldn't be able to get married even if you wanted to. It's a gray area because there are no married gay couples that I know, I have nothing to compare it to.

[Junket]

The unmarried couples I know love each other as well. But somehow you can quickly tell that their love is of a different variety.

Uh, yeah, probably because you know they're not married.