Spirituality

[firewired]

Hey guys, I've been thinking about this for a while now and would love to get some good conversation going on this. I know it's a touchy subject and all, but lets try and just give opinions and share our thoughts on this and respect others as well.

I was raised Christian Lutheran and have always felt a strong connection with God. In the past few years since I've been out of college and on my own I have seen religion divide people more than bring them together. I also have left church feeling worse than when I went there and I know that's not right. It's like it's a big guilt trip in there. I have heard/read stories about how the bible may be a loose translation of things written long ago and may be far from what really happened.

I almost feel as though I am searching for something else...there's so many other religions out there and who's to say which one is right?

From reading and talking to others I have gravitated more toward referring to God as "Source"....as in Source Energy. Where people are all connected to each other and the universe through energy...and the source of all our energy and the universe is Source Energy. It feels right to me and it is not religion specific. Source Energy could be God or Buddha...or whomever you wish it to be.

However, since I have been raised believing in Jesus it almost makes me feel bad to think that may not have happened etc....does that make sense?

[IndiReloaded]

Oh boy. Good post, but oh boy.

What exactly is your question, tho?

[firewired]

Thanks, I guess it's more of a "What is everyone's view/thoughts on this topic" post than a question.

It's been one of those things that I've been giving more and more thought to lately and I'm curious about how everyone else feels about it. It's interesting what shows up when different views are presented. Sometimes it just gives an interesting and different perspective on things that just make you think a little more

[vashti]

I was raised Catholic, but converted out to a different religion as an adult after studying for a few years.

My opinion is that you take the time to explore the various streams of whatever you are interested in (in depth) before you decide to make a break from your childhood religion. I would pay attention to the esoteric aspects, too. Most religions are much more complex than the average adherent realizes. For example, your attraction to the idea of God being a source of all energy is not new.

Also, keep in mind any given religion's political leanings. Organized religion plays a big role in politics.

I can tell you that making a break from your religion can cause a lot of pain to your family, so you had better be really sure before you do it.

[kai]

God is one, that's the basic teaching of most of the religions. You can become a buddhist, hindu, sikh or something else, everyone has the same core message. It's the people who mess it all up.

[MetalPhoenix]

Hey guys, I've been thinking about this for a while now and would love to get some good conversation going on this. I know it's a touchy subject and all, but lets try and just give opinions and share our thoughts on this and respect others as well.

I was raised Christian Lutheran and have always felt a strong connection with God. In the past few years since I've been out of college and on my own I have seen religion divide people more than bring them together. I also have left church feeling worse than when I went there and I know that's not right. It's like it's a big guilt trip in there. I have heard/read stories about how the bible may be a loose translation of things written long ago and may be far from what really happened.

I almost feel as though I am searching for something else...there's so many other religions out there and who's to say which one is right?

From reading and talking to others I have gravitated more toward referring to God as "Source"....as in Source Energy. Where people are all connected to each other and the universe through energy...and the source of all our energy and the universe is Source Energy. It feels right to me and it is not religion specific. Source Energy could be God or Buddha...or whomever you wish it to be.

However, since I have been raised believing in Jesus it almost makes me feel bad to think that may not have happened etc....does that make sense?

Your first "problem" is that you were raised to believe in the bible (or Jesus, or the christian belief...call it what you will). I think that this is a form of indoctrination. You are told to believe in something that is not there. And you are told so often that it does exist, that you start believing it yourself, without EVER having seen any proof.

The bible, the koran and all the other books are based on naturally occurring fenomenon (movement of stars for instance).

Look up the movie "Zeitgeist" and watch the first part about what religion is based on. It's available online and you can watch it for free.

[Gribble]

If you must believe in that stuff at least you're doing some thinking.

While you're mulling over possibilities, why not consider that there may, in fact, be no god at all? Or that humanity's got it all wrong and we're all worshiping false gods to our detriment? Or that god doesn't want to be worshiped? Or any of the other infinite possibilities, for that matter?

[doppelgaenger]

I was raised a Christian Lutheran as well. Now I am an atheist. I know more about religion than most people, though, because I was raised as a scholar, the grandson of a knowledgeable professor and pastor. Gradually over time, I began losing what they call faith in 'God', something I never truly accepted as a belief, and instead questioned... even though I had to go to church 2-3 times per week, attended a private Christian school, and everything else. I've read the Bible many times, also in German. I've been to Wartburg, where Luther translated the New Testament into German, while he lay in refuge. I've been to ancient Ephesus (Does the book of Ephesians sound familiar?), a very significant place in history for Muslim and Christianity. I've been to ruins of the Holy Roman Empire as well.

I have some bad news for you, firewired. The 'bible' *is* a loose translation of texts. Did you know that Catholics and Christians have different books and chapters in their Bibles? Even certain denominations have various books. Most Christian dates and holidays are not accurate. Christmas (Dec 25) is not the day of Christ's actual birthday; it was updated (many times. in fact, orthodox christianity still follows an older calendar) to accommodate a busy work schedule. Do you know how Lutheran Christianity developed? You should look this up. I have some news for you; the bible wasn't written in English all those years ago. Jesus was not a white man. There are so many facts for you to learn. Don't worry though, most people do not know these things. The way I see it, religion was developed to maintain control over a population; to maintain order, establish a government, and enact laws, forcing citizens to pay taxes. People were originally taxed through the church, you know. They had to pay indulgences to the church to get into heaven. This, as you see, is not the way Christians today feel. All thanks to Martin Luther, who objected to this.

And so Vashti suggests studying various philosophies of scholars as an alternative to breaking your religion, I would suggest in addition to that, to study the history of religion. I would also encourage you to follow your own beliefs, even if that means denouncing Christianity. It may or may not upset or hurt a few of your family members, especially if your family is as adamant and religious as my own. Of course, you never have to tell your family, either. Just don't marry an overzealous christian woman.

[IndiReloaded]

Well, I was raised Presbyterian. Loosely, mind. It was more like "We will send you to Sunday school b/c that's our tradition. Think about what you learn and when you are old enough, you are free to make a decision about whether to keep going or not." At about 10, I think, I lost interest and focussed on other things. We have clergy in my family, and very religious grandparents so we do the church service at xmas, weddings, christenings but that's about it. I respect others right to their faith so long as they don't try to force theirs upon me.

[irrelevant_89]

I'm probably an exception in this forum because I was raised with no religion at all. Although 95% of Portugal is Catholic, including my parents, they grew disillusioned with their faith, and decided not to get me baptized, giving me that option when I was old enough to understand.

I didn't - right now I'm an agnostic, borderline atheist. Nobody can know if God exists or not, but if I were to take a guess, I'd say he doesn't. Not as the Christian God at least, but maybe just as "something that created the Universe somehow"... if the Universe, or multiverse as some physics models suggest now, was indeed created in the sense that it has a beginning (the Big Bang theory is widely accepted, but it might not have been the beginning of the Universe/multiverse... not all of it at least).

I'm also a bit of a nihilist, because I don't believe in a superior purpose to life other than just living it, trying to be happy and help others. And I believe that when we die, it's all over, which quite honestly scares the hell out of me. The only thing I miss of religion is the promise of an afterlife... xDD

[Gribble]

The afterlife scares the hell out of me. I don't want to be the plaything of a megalomaniac god. I don't want to suffer in hell because I didn't obey its rules. I don't want to bow in fear of it in heaven, either.

Even an eternity of beer and women would become its own hell in time. I want my consciousness to end at some point.

[Asip4u]

haha, Gribble...I agree with the "even an eternity of beer and women would become it's own hell in time"...I saw Constantine few days ago..Hell looks pretty cool!

[MetalPhoenix]

I'm probably an exception in this forum because I was raised with no religion at all. Although 95% of Portugal is Catholic, including my parents, they grew disillusioned with their faith, and decided not to get me baptized, giving me that option when I was old enough to understand.

I didn't - right now I'm an agnostic, borderline atheist. Nobody can know if God exists or not, but if I were to take a guess, I'd say he doesn't. Not as the Christian God at least, but maybe just as "something that created the Universe somehow"... if the Universe, or multiverse as some physics models suggest now, was indeed created in the sense that it has a beginning (the Big Bang theory is widely accepted, but it might not have been the beginning of the Universe/multiverse... not all of it at least).

I'm also a bit of a nihilist, because I don't believe in a superior purpose to life other than just living it, trying to be happy and help others. And I believe that when we die, it's all over, which quite honestly scares the hell out of me. The only thing I miss of religion is the promise of an afterlife... xDD

You're not the only one....there were at least two other atheist posters bofore you in this topic.

Oh...1 question: Why are you scared about the idea that after your life nothing will happen?

You won't be aroud to witness it, so why care?

[MetalPhoenix]

The afterlife scares the hell out of me. I don't want to be the plaything of a megalomaniac god. I don't want to suffer in hell because I didn't obey its rules. I don't want to bow in fear of it in heaven, either.

Even an eternity of beer and women would become its own hell in time. I want my consciousness to end at some point.

Why bother caring and worrying?

If everything is "meant to happen" or "God has a plan for us all" then you shouldn't care because threre is nothing you can do about it.

Just enjoy life without fearing something you've never seen

[Mish]

I believe in God, but I don't follow any Religion. I see all Religion as man made and corruptible, teaching people only that which serves it's own agenda. I believe in good and bad, but I see them more as universal principles and no Religion has a monopoly on what they are. I wish more people saw it that way instead of associating them as tainted by Religion and moving away from them all together.