Did I Assault Her?

[VincenzoG91]

I'm not going to whitewash the details to make myself look good about what just happened, because I would rather have the truth than a pleasant lie.

I've been slowly recovering from a nasty flu strain this week. Although I warned her about exposure to my germs, my girlfriend wanted to hang out with me tonight and watch something on Netflix. She stopped off to pick up some wine on the way.

We got into a silly argument about germs. She didn't think it was a big deal for me to uncork the wine for her, but was paranoid about whether or not my clean dishes in my cupboard were clean enough. Eventually, she declared that I was stupid. I told her that it was time for her to leave. I didn't yell or even raise my voice or use a nasty tone, I just simply stated that it was time for her to leave. She refused to leave.

I took a couple of normal steps across the kitchen and reached to place a guiding hand on her shoulder, as I gestured towards the door with my other hand. She flipped out and start slapping frantically at me. I had my contacts out and glasses on, and she smacked my glasses pretty hard, knocking them off my face. She also left a shallow one-inch cut on my temple, possibly from the same hit. By this point, I was yelling that she needed to settle down.

Then I grabbed both her wrists firmly and then quickly swung my hands past each other, causing her to spin. At the same time, I backed away and pulled down, causing her to sit down hard on the kitchen floor. Not like a bone-crunching thump, but not the softest landing either. She immediately starting crying, and she is not a person who ever cries in front of people. I continued to hold her wrists for a moment, but she had stopped struggling.

I let go of her and retrieved my glasses, which were bent way out of shape. She ran into the bathroom and continued crying. I stood outside the door and softly apologized to her, repeatedly. She kept yelling that I wasn't really sorry at all. She also said that the inside of her mouth was bleeding because of something to do with her facial piercing. I don't recall coming anywhere near her face, but maybe when I spun her about and sat her down her face might have brushed against the inside of one of my arms.

We talked briefly as she headed out the door. Her version is that she didn't start hitting me until after I grabbed her, but otherwise matches up. As she left, she also yelled at me that anger is bad for my immune system. But I wasn't angry, and she has known me long enough to know what I'm like when I'm angry.

I have never hit a woman in my life, and I wasn't even angry during this incident. I was very irritated when she called me stupid, but I wasn't angry about it, and I sincerely thought that it would be a good idea to end the conversation there and have her leave before it turned into a more serious argument. Instead, she now seems to think that I have become physically abusive. Maybe I have, and I'm just in denial, which is why I'm asking here.

For some background, we have been dating for over nine years now, and nothing* like this ever happened between us before. Two years ago, I found out that she had cheated on me for a long time, but she truly regretted it and I genuinely forgave her. The last 12 months have been the best time in our relationship, even better than the first year.

*Okay there was one incident, and I will mention that in the next post.

[VincenzoG91]

So, this other incident...

Summer of 2009 was a bad time for our relationship. My dad died in November of 2008. She got raped by an acquaintance in spring of 2009 but didn't tell me about it for a couple of years. She did tell the guy that she was cheating with back then. Then her cat died in June of 2009 and her car totally broke down in early July. She was working a part-time job and my full-time job was struggling to cover my regular expenses, some of her expenses, plus a debt management plan related to large amount of credit card debt I ran up in 2004 while she recovered from surgery related to a car accident.

So we were sharing my car for a while, and it was frustrating because she is always running behind schedule. So she was driving, racing to meet up with a friend who was giving her a ride so I could use the car that afternoon, and we were having an argument about something. No big deal, except that she was becoming very distracted by the argument while driving, spending too much time looking at me instead of the road. I told her to keep her eyes on the road and she told me off. In hindsight, it was reckless, but I reached over and put a hand on the steering wheel and said "let's pull over and switch drivers." That startled her into slowing down a lot, so I turned the wheel slightly and we pulled up at the curb. I snatched the keys out of the ignition, but not before she left a set of scratches going all the way from my elbow to my wrist.

Those scratches weren't so shallow, so there was a fair amount of blood. She was really sorry about that, and admitted that she got out of hand.

I know that it sounds like we're a terrible couple, but there are just these two incidents out of a nine-year relationship, and I don't have any prior history of abuse.

[VincenzoG91]

After considerable bending, I have glasses back in approximately normal shape. During this process, I noticed that I also have a cut on the base of my thumb, but it has already stopped bleeding.

[IndiReloaded]

Vince - either of those episodes I would consider violent. Both of you contributed. If I were her, I'd be breaking up with you if only b/c I wouldn't like the person I am around you. You have to sort out your own responses, but if you acted like this towards someone like me, I'd be gone in a heartbeat.

FWIW.

[HeartIsAching]

Depending on the state you're in, yes. Any unwanted touch is an assault. Raising your hand to her could be construed as battery as well.

It does sound as if her reaction was way out of proportion... has she been abused in the past?

Next time if you tell her it's time to leave and she doesn't, she's trespassing. Cops would be the safest solution for you in our litigious society. I realize you're sick, but you could have left also.

[Wakeup]

Seems you assaulted one another but I'm thinking she needs anger management classes. She sure doesn't like it when you're calling the shots. Has she ever gotten therapy to help her come to terms with the rape? Her anger may be manifesting onto you when you try to take the control away from her.. like when she was raped and had no say in the matter. Just my guess, anyway.

She has some issues that need resolving, that's for sure.

Sorry, you're going through this with her, Vincenzo.

[VincenzoG91]

She was abused by her stepfather. That was her first rape. She didn't press charges because the family depended on heavily on his income. She did move in with her boyfriend's family. Her mother is still married to that guy, but all has been forgiven. I can see where grabbing her wrists might be especially scary for her, but I only did it to stop her from hitting me more.

In an argument, I used to get verbally abusive. A high-speed mixture of profanity and random insults. After our second argument, she persuaded me to take an anger management class, and it changed my life for the better. For years since, I have occasionally felt that she could also benefit from an anger management class, but she is hostile to the idea.

I can see the logic of us breaking up. After all we've been through together, both good and bad, it seems ridiculous that the relationship would end this way. I've apologized, and I'm ready and willing to talk to her about this. If she wants to end the relationship, I will respect that. However, she is currently just working part-time while finishing her college degree, so she was going to be financially dependent on me at least until the end of 2013. She also has an unpaid internship, and her family doesn't have money to spare, so she really doesn't have any good way to support herself.

[Wakeup]

She also has an unpaid internship, and her family doesn't have money to spare, so she really doesn't have any good way to support herself

well then i suspect she'll forgive you.. at least until she has her degree, anyway. You should be considering whether or not you should forgive her. She was rather violent with you and she's drawn blood more than once. Don't let her use you for your income and then dump you when she's making some coin. If you're going to stay together I suggest you really try to persuade her to get personal councelling to help her come to terms with her past sexual abuse/rape and couples councelling so that you both learn to communicate more calmly.

[VincenzoG91]

We have talked about counseling in the past. Although she won't admit to an anger management problem, she has expressed interest in personal counselling for herself and maybe couples therapy before we get married. I'm not worried about her using me for money, for two different reasons. First, she isn't subtle. She knows that she can't even tell a lie without giving herself away, so at worst she refuses to answer a question rather than tell a lie. Second, she is going to be paying off $100,000 in student loan debt, most likely while working for a non-profit organization.

[vashti]

I am having a hard time being sympathetic to her if (as you say) she hit you before you grabbed her, regardless of her personal history. I don't see why anyone should tolerate that. In my mind, you engaged in self-defense.

[Boisdevie]

She hit you. That's what got the ball rolling. And if my GF hit me like that I would be out of the door very very fast. And more worrying is the she seems to not want anger management classes = that's denial isn't it? And if it is denial it is not good.

[smackie9]

No what got the ball rolling is when she started to insult him and then refused to leave. She was slowly antagonizing him. None of this would have happened if her behavior was different right? She is the abuser. I think the one in denial is you Vince.....even tho only a few of these incidences got to the level where things got violence...I bet there are many incidences of milder abusive behavior....like manipulation, insults, head games.....so much of it you stopped acknowledging it and that this relationship is truly not all rosy like you think it is. Maybe you have been blindly tolerating it. You asking if you were the one that assaulted her make me believe this is so.


I have been with my husband for 23 years...we have never behaved towards each other like that ever.

[HeartIsAching]

She was abused by her stepfather. That was her first rape. She didn't press charges because the family depended on heavily on his income. She did move in with her boyfriend's family. Her mother is still married to that guy, but all has been forgiven.

Excuse the **** out of me?

I can see where grabbing her wrists might be especially scary for her, but I only did it to stop her from hitting me more.

In an argument, I used to get verbally abusive. A high-speed mixture of profanity and random insults. After our second argument, she persuaded me to take an anger management class, and it changed my life for the better. For years since, I have occasionally felt that she could also benefit from an anger management class, but she is hostile to the idea.

Why? And why is it ok for her to suggest it for you, but she won't take one herself? You've got a blamer on your hands - a hallmark of a controlling and abusive person. Smackie's right.

I can see the logic of us breaking up. After all we've been through together, both good and bad, it seems ridiculous that the relationship would end this way. I've apologized, and I'm ready and willing to talk to her about this. If she wants to end the relationship, I will respect that. However, she is currently just working part-time while finishing her college degree, so she was going to be financially dependent on me at least until the end of 2013. She also has an unpaid internship, and her family doesn't have money to spare, so she really doesn't have any good way to support herself.

How is this your problem, Vincenzo? I smell more than a bit of white knight syndrome. She's an adult... and she's using emotional abuse to force contrition from you. Review your course materials from your anger management class. Personally, I think you need to separate yourself from her to protect yourself. Trust me, you DON'T want a conviction for a violent crime on your record - it REALLY sucks when trying to find a job.

Smackie's right.

[HeartIsAching]

No what got the ball rolling is when she started to insult him and then refused to leave. She was slowly antagonizing him. None of this would have happened if her behavior was different right? She is the abuser. I think the one in denial is you Vince.....even tho only a few of these incidences got to the level where things got violence...I bet there are many incidences of milder abusive behavior....like manipulation, insults, head games.....so much of it you stopped acknowledging it and that this relationship is truly not all rosy like you think it is. Maybe you have been blindly tolerating it. You asking if you were the one that assaulted her make me believe this is so.


I have been with my husband for 23 years...we have never behaved towards each other like that ever.

Thanks Smackie - I missed that, and from me that's weird.

[Boisdevie]

Oh and Vince, you're not responsible for her financial situation. She's a grown up so she should be able to take care of herself financially. I would have assumed that since you're paying for her lifestyle at the moment she'd have a bit more respect for you - but she thinks it's OK to bit the hand that feeds. There is a world of difference between being a nice guy and being a pussy.