Why should everyone assume they're worthy of "confidence"?

[basilandthyme]

The religious aspect of it is, does confidence violate that deadly sin called vanity? Doesn't a (referring to the Judeo-Christian concept of god) person have to be humble always and does having a healthy amount of confidence violate that?

Reply from an athiest FWIW.

I see balance as the answer here. To me, it's about being aware of what you're good at, and being confident in those things but without boasting or otherwise seeking to draw significant amounts attention to yourself.

In short, I find quiet confidence more attractive than the kind of confidence which hits you in the face.

[TheEvilJester]

I consider myself to be spiritual, but not necessarily religious. What do I mean by that? I believe in God, I believe in Heaven, I just don't necessarily believe that any one religion has it 100% correct. Nor do I believe in a God who would condemn you to Hell along with murderers and rapists merely for such horrible sins as saying "God damn" or having a special night with Rosie Palm and her five sisters.

So, not sure if maybe you'd more so want thoughts from somebody who does more strictly follow their religion. However, my thought is that, once again, having confidence is not the same thing as having vanity. To me, being vain is again similar to how I described the difference between being confident and being cocky. I also do not think being "humble" has to mean having no confidence. In fact, It is very important to have confidence, it is just important not to over do it. Make sense? But, again, that is just my thoughts on the matter.

[YoungCosmo]

Well I'm drunk again, lol. Real surprise huh? Psychology basically says certain brain pathways that haven't been exercised at an age close to mine basically shut off permanently soon. Which means I don't have the brain capacity to talk to girls. Which means getting myself shot or driving off a cliff will be real easy. No one to miss me when I'm gone!

[basilandthyme]

I've been gone too long.

What happened to you being able to talk to girls?

[TheEvilJester]

Well I'm drunk again, lol. Real surprise huh? Psychology basically says certain brain pathways that haven't been exercised at an age close to mine basically shut off permanently soon. Which means I don't have the brain capacity to talk to girls. Which means getting myself shot or driving off a cliff will be real easy. No one to miss me when I'm gone!

God, I know how you feel. I'm there myself at the moment. But, the thing is guys like us, we really cannot give up. You can't win if you don't play. I don't believe that you ever lose something like the ability to talk to women. Not if you had it. You can get rusty, sure, but it will just take some time to get back in the swing. Me personally, I never really knew how to talk to women, other than to just talk to them the same way I would a friend.

Anyway, though I certainly know how you feel, I am sure there are people who would very much miss you if you were gone. I know how easy it can be to feel like there is no point in going on, but the thing is how will you know if you don't try? Eventually you will achieve balance and peace in your life, and that will make all the suffering seem worth it. Just hang in there. Trust me, I know how hard that can be. It is hard for me to believe my own words right now. It just so happens that God bestowed me with the gift/curse of a strength I cannot turn off that will not let me give up no matter what, no matter how badly I may want to just give up. I wish I could share that with people. Nobody should have to suffer like you and I have, my friend. But, in the end, we will wind up so much stronger for surviving it once we finally get our piece of the pie.

[basilandthyme]

Well I'm drunk again, lol. Real surprise huh? Psychology basically says certain brain pathways that haven't been exercised at an age close to mine basically shut off permanently soon. Which means I don't have the brain capacity to talk to girls. Which means getting myself shot or driving off a cliff will be real easy. No one to miss me when I'm gone!

That's bollocks.

I'm 47 and still changing and learning new approaches and attitudes. I'm nothing like who I was at your age.

[pcmaster]

[MENTION=64115]basilandthyme[/MENTION] what does it means bollocks?

[TheEvilJester]

I believe "bollocks" is a British phrase. Not being British myself, I cannot say this for sure, but I think it basically means "bull$h*t."

And I agree with basilandthyme. You can't teach an old dog new tricks..... but we aren't dogs, are we? You learn and grow every day, and it is never too late to improve or get yourself through a weakness.

[woody]

Doesn't everything in life come down to the bottom line? So with this logic in mind, I am thinking that if a guy has poor history with girls that he shouldn't be anything but lacking in self-esteem: After all, based on the stats the fact points to someone who shouldn't feel good about himself because his history says he's sucked in the past and he'll suck in the future.

So I am wondering why "Get some confidence" is always used as advice. If he's not attractive to girls, why should he have confidence? What's there to be confident IN? If a guy is confident without any reason to then he should be thought of as arrogant, no?

It just seems like an unattractive guy's options are to fail but be humble or fail with arrogance. Cuz being nice, always listening and fun are the very basic things a girl deserves in a guy so if he's not physically attractive on top of those, isn't he just a genetic failure? And doesn't genetically failing equate to losing at life?

Y.C,

Are you flippin kidding? Your line, "if he's not attractive to girls, why should he have confidence".. Hhmm. Well I suppose there's many variables there but if he's a nice man, thoughtful and sweet, what's not to be confident about? His looks? Your assuming that most women are rather superficial in this no? Forgive if i'm off base but your wrong..

"A genetic failure" Wow, good grief man, that's pretty harsh. I hope your not talking about yourself here for if you are, come on, smarten up; your being highly unfair and assuming a good woman only goes for so called superficially attractive men; again, wrong.....

This confidence thing does matter no matter what one thinks they look like or if they deem themselves desirable. a kind, thoughtful man with confidence in his own self is what attracts a quality lady.

Hey, you don't want some superficial flake do you?

Please don't be so down. Grab some pride in your self, please.

[basilandthyme]

Yep - Jester nailed it. Bollocks translates to Bull$hit. It can also refer to testicles.

[dickriculous]

I've never given "be confident" as advice. Not only is it terrible advice, it can be dangerous.

If you lack confidence or you feel like shit about yourself, that's your ID telling you that something in your world isn't right and it needs to be changed. Nobody lacks confidence in things they are good at. If you're the shit at math you will be far more confident in any math-related competition than someone who sucks at it, no matter what either of you tell yourselves going into the competition.

If you think "be confident" is useful advice then you have been mislead by the self-esteem movement. Said movement was perpetuated by people using super confident people like Michael Jordon as examples, saying that he was as great as he was because of his confidence, but they got it backwards, he was as confident as he was because of how great he was. The result of the self-esteem movement is a lot of people who's confidence is dangerously disproportionate to their abilities who don't understand how hard it is to be great at anything and think they are entitled to being treated/spoken to as if they are great when really they are mediocre or even terrible.

People who think "be confident" is the answer and telling themselves they are the shit or whatever is going to help are the same people who after 20 years of doing this still need constant reassurance from all of their friends that they don't suck at life, they're not fat, they're beautiful, they're strong, they're not stupid, they're confident, etc.

You're finding out the hard way that changing yourself for the better is actually really hard and simply "becoming confident" out of nowhere or because you or people close to you tell you certain things is a joke.

Such is life.

[pcmaster]

Great post [MENTION=62630]dickriculous[/MENTION] . Thats some deep thinking and opened my eyes. When my psychotherapist says I have to accept myself and love myself as I am and be confident - after your post I understand theres a long way to go yet because theres many things I have to achieve yet. Really why be confident when you are nothing that you want yourself to be. In the end of the day confidence is not fooling yourself that you are good but confidence is doing things that gives you confidence. Doing the right thing is the hardest and longest way but thats how it works.

I often look at celebrities and how confident they are. When someone says bad about them they dont even care. Because theres even more people telling them how good they are. And thats really is confidence - knowing who you are and staying unaffected by other people negativity. Celebrities had to do a lot of work to become who they became and to evolve as an artists etc. Thats what gave them confidence aswell.

[basilandthyme]

PC - exactly right. Confidence is about doing things that you're good at.

I've always found that it's important to find what you're good at - because it will be these things which give you confidence. Heck, I suck at a lot of things and I don't have confidence there, but its the areas where I do well which make up for it. And in those areas where you do have talent, it's about not being afraid to enjoy your skill...and to accept compliments graciously when they arrive.

Not to say that it's always easy: I also have many areas where I feel sorely lacking - but confidence is about deflecting from the areas where you feel you're lacking and enjoying what you're good at.

I had a down patch recently and spent my time sewing. Which I'm good at. Made a terrific Victorian corset for myself and a bed quilt. Best therapy ever....and then I blogged about them and was able share with other kindred spirits

[YoungCosmo]

Y.C,

Are you flippin kidding? Your line, "if he's not attractive to girls, why should he have confidence".. Hhmm. Well I suppose there's many variables there but if he's a nice man, thoughtful and sweet, what's not to be confident about? His looks? Your assuming that most women are rather superficial in this no? Forgive if i'm off base but your wrong..

"A genetic failure" Wow, good grief man, that's pretty harsh. I hope your not talking about yourself here for if you are, come on, smarten up; your being highly unfair and assuming a good woman only goes for so called superficially attractive men; again, wrong.....

Well, no I wasn't trying to sound superficial. Back when I was a misogynist I'd have probably gone down that road but let me reiterate: Caring, funny and loyal should be the minimum in a guy. But it sounds like, whether it's true or not, that a lot of girls aren't seeing those in a lot of guys today (like I said before, that's only one side of the story and I'm skeptical on this). If true it would mean guys like that would have more value.But rather than think one gender is better than the other, I'm going to say that there are a lot more guys like that than not. So that affects my premises in this way:

All the things that should make for a good guy should really be the least expected out of one. So how do these guys stand out? They have to be physically attractive on top of it. But not all guys can be. So then it seems like those guys who are good but not physically attractive don't have a chance because they don't have anything else to offer to put them over the top.

And yeah, I do think of myself as a genetic failure. Which is why it's a good thing no girl will settle down with me and pass on faulty genes. Gotta think of the future, eh!

- - - Updated - - -

I've never given "be confident" as advice. Not only is it terrible advice, it can be dangerous.

If you lack confidence or you feel like shit about yourself, that's your ID telling you that something in your world isn't right and it needs to be changed. Nobody lacks confidence in things they are good at. If you're the shit at math you will be far more confident in any math-related competition than someone who sucks at it, no matter what either of you tell yourselves going into the competition.

If you think "be confident" is useful advice then you have been mislead by the self-esteem movement. Said movement was perpetuated by people using super confident people like Michael Jordon as examples, saying that he was as great as he was because of his confidence, but they got it backwards, he was as confident as he was because of how great he was. The result of the self-esteem movement is a lot of people who's confidence is dangerously disproportionate to their abilities who don't understand how hard it is to be great at anything and think they are entitled to being treated/spoken to as if they are great when really they are mediocre or even terrible.

People who think "be confident" is the answer and telling themselves they are the shit or whatever is going to help are the same people who after 20 years of doing this still need constant reassurance from all of their friends that they don't suck at life, they're not fat, they're beautiful, they're strong, they're not stupid, they're confident, etc.

You're finding out the hard way that changing yourself for the better is actually really hard and simply "becoming confident" out of nowhere or because you or people close to you tell you certain things is a joke.

Such is life.

PC - exactly right. Confidence is about doing things that you're good at.

I've always found that it's important to find what you're good at - because it will be these things which give you confidence. Heck, I suck at a lot of things and I don't have confidence there, but its the areas where I do well which make up for it. And in those areas where you do have talent, it's about not being afraid to enjoy your skill...and to accept compliments graciously when they arrive.

Not to say that it's always easy: I also have many areas where I feel sorely lacking - but confidence is about deflecting from the areas where you feel you're lacking and enjoying what you're good at.

I had a down patch recently and spent my time sewing. Which I'm good at. Made a terrific Victorian corset for myself and a bed quilt. Best therapy ever....and then I blogged about them and was able share with other kindred spirits

Both posts are a hell of a lot more helpful than "get confidence."

[pcmaster]

Well man its not about genes or confidence. Everyone have a matching second half on this world. If you think you are not attractive then find a girl in your league. Dont look at hotest girls but just find one you find acceptable. But dont look at ugly ones because it wont work - because if you are not attracted to her she wont like you either. Besides sometimes these ugly girls surprisingly have hot boyfriends.

Okay maybe you are not best looking guy on the block but you cant think of yourself as failure. You still can do a lot things to compensate your faults. Besides its never too late to accept and love yourself as you are.