She won't talk to me (short edition)

[ecojeanne]

Well, in about a month we'll be going again to a convention with some other friends for a few days. I hope I can take her aside there and speak with her.

ur still not gettin it! pleeeeeaaaasssse re-read all the feedback from everyone on here....comon r u a masochist? r u a person who enjoys misery? i can guarantee she will reject u and quite possibly make a show of u.....be sensible here....now i'm tryin to be as kind as possible based on ur age...u cant always get what u want...ur not a child anymore...chances r u are scaring this girl...do u really want to do that?

[Bundy]

Of course I don't want our current situation. But if we had had a better communication in the first place, it wouldn't have happened. Is it too late to try and amend things?

[ecojeanne]

Of course I don't want our current situation. But if we had had a better communication in the first place, it wouldn't have happened. Is it too late to try and amend things?

yes i would definitely think its too late...i kno this is really hard to take....but u kno deep down this situation will not be 'fixed' by u....another flaw some of us humans have is this overwhelming urge to 'fix' mistakes...to be honest its a lost cause....u kno life is for living...we all want to be happy right? stop dwelling and start living life to the full.

[shh!]

You aren't her friend. Friends don't try to interact romantically with one another.

[Arrow]

I think you stuffed it when you told her you loved her. And yes, I have read the other thread, mainly because I like trying to figure out solutions for difficult problems without pointing at the easy "give up" escapist way.

The problem is, you can't expect a person who you have known for such a short time accept that you are in love with her, and, may I add, especially when that girl is only 17. It's too much for her and she may not even be prepared for a serious relationship.

I'm not really an experienced person but I can assure you that the way of getting a (good) woman is by slowly ensnaring her with a small compliment here, a gift there (women love the small but important details), but nothing big enough that will give away your feelings in a blatant way. Everytime, and I mean EVERYTIME I declared my feelings to a girl before the right opportunity showed, I lost it. Moreover, sometimes when you're too obviously flirting with her she will already know that you love her, and this is the moment when you can start to act indifferent towards her so you can puzzle her mind. If other girls are available you can try getting to them while she's watching. Make her feel unimportant, trust me people hate to feel unimportant. I know I hate lol.

I know it's hard to stay a little far away from the person you love. I know it because ATM I'm trying to do the same thing with a girl I like and it's not easy, especially when there were some random events which got us closer to each other and made me believe it was all ok between us. The day after she was sick and apparently the only person she felt a bit unconfortable with was me, but then again I already gave her chocolates, class notes, offered a lift... Well, she pretty much knows I like her AND she likes me too (if not she wouldn't have told me secrets, talked to me on MSN, acted like a mad girl when she nearly ran me over on the street... only thing not clear is HOW MUCH she likes me) but it's difficult since she broke up with her boyfriend recently and she wants to have some fun. But you won't get anything by circling her and there are some girls (the independent types) who really hate it. Too much of a good thing is also bad.

I think the ideal situation for a man is to have a few girls in sight. Girls are like job interviews, you must NEVER count in only one of them. Since you haven't had a sexual relationship before it would be best to know different people so you can also gain confidence by training social contact which will be invaluable. If she knows you have a better offer from the competition, and if she, deep down, wants you to be alongside her, it's expected that she'll come. If by then you already found someone else who's better (not really better but more "suitable") you can then tell her to cry you a river OR prepare a move on her but do so carefully of course.

In conclusion, keep in mind that you CAN date her. You can date pretty much anyone within the age group you belong. The thing you have to nail is the approach, and bombarding her with love won't work.

[ecojeanne]

fantastic response Arrow!

[Bundy]

I did try changing the approach. First I try to talk her into talking with me, but it didn't work. Then I try to be more friendly, and I've been watching some really funny Married with Children scenes, so I find them on Youtube and I mail a link to her. I expected a reply saying that she liked them, or thanking me for sending them, but I never got any... So, back to the phoning approach, even if she banned it. She answered, and I pretty much blew it stupidly, but it's not like I got any cooperation from her in the first place. And back to the emails, which don't work... I just don't know what to try anymore...

I will also add that I saw her this Friday in the cinema, we and some friends went to watch Get Smart. No interaction what so ever... Pretty discouraging...

[ecojeanne]

i give up!

[Arrow]

fantastic response Arrow!

Hehe that's cool but it would be even better if I myself followed my own advice, which is not always mine because there's a collection of things I learned through friends, therapy and own experience.

I'm also having terrible issues but I'm trying to finally break away and become a man (I'm 21 and I should've when I was 18, maybe 16) and you don't do that if your only reaction to things is not a clever one. Yesterday I tried to approach a girl at a club and, well, things didn't work out because for the moment I suck at talking to girls at clubs unless they're drunk or something (which she wasn't). Moments later the guitarist of the band that played at the club snatched her. I was so pissed off that I wanted to brutalise him right there but there were plenty of security there and amazingly the alcohol helped me not give a damn about it and there were some other girls I was interested in too.

But the idea is that if you have a set goal you should go for it, however wars aren't won by overpowering the enemy anymore. Things have changed since Sparta.

BTW ecojeanne I see you're Irish, that automatically makes you 10 times cooler.

I did try changing the approach. First I try to talk her into talking with me, but it didn't work. Then I try to be more friendly, and I've been watching some really funny Married with Children scenes, so I find them on Youtube and I mail a link to her. I expected a reply saying that she liked them, or thanking me for sending them, but I never got any... So, back to the phoning approach, even if she banned it. She answered, and I pretty much blew it stupidly, but it's not like I got any cooperation from her in the first place. And back to the emails, which don't work... I just don't know what to try anymore...

I will also add that I saw her this Friday in the cinema, we and some friends went to watch Get Smart. No interaction what so ever... Pretty discouraging...

Cut contact IMMEDIATELY and try being more sociable, especially with other girls (NOT with her but glancing sometimes is allowed), and you'll get one step closer to making her pay attention in you. Even if she acts like "how stupid of him, trying to make me jealous" it's a small gain because she will already have thought about you and it will bother her a little bit that her loyal puppy decided to become a dobermann and hound other stuff.

There's this girl in college, I did the exact same thing you did but things went differently because from my 19-year-old explosive hormones' point of view it seemed a good idea to tell her to **** off through email. Well of course she didn't help herself by claiming I was such an inexperienced boy and didn't have "chemistry" with her. This case was worse because she was involved in a long relationship already and she came from the countryside, and in the countryside people tend to think that the first person they meet is the love of their life (at least in my country it seems so). So I cut contact for 8 months, then tried to reapproach her but she was adamant even though I pretended I wanted to just be friends with her. Some weeks later I made a joke about sending a kiss to a colleague and unexpectedly in my inbox there was an email from her bashing me, saying I was so full of myself for giving stupid examples during classes and sending kisses to people I had no business doing that to. I had already moved away from her (I had another girl in mind by then) but she claimed I was ridiculous for not giving up until she was married to the guy. And today I notice she makes a huge effort to avoid me, to the point of embarrasing herself by calling only my friend's name when she greeted us, and she feels insanely uncomfortable around me. I'm of the opinion that if she broke away from him (and she really should - he's being prosecuted for stealing public goods) and I was already with someone she'd be lost because her little castle of cards would have folded. While she lives that delusion of hers I buy a car, get a job as trainee, find friends and invest on other girls (so far without success but I now have plenty of alternatives ) while IMO her current life is leading nowhere. She's 24 but acts more like 20 or even 18. I still like her (it's like an ex thing) because she seems perfectly tailored for my tastes (sex would be a complete blast) but she's stupid, immature and not worth having a serious relationship with. I seek level-headed, classy women not Alice In Wonderland.

In your case, however, there's a much bigger chance of it working because she's still single and you haven't acted like crap towards her yet. I told that story above because even though I'm not with her (and have no intention of being unless it was only a physical thing), the things I told you to do worked in my case, just a little bit differently because of my particular situation. We don't forget those who we were related to and she WILL be bothered. Besides you both still have college ahead of you so there's plenty of time for stuff to happen. Think about it: you at least have her phone number. My current crush denied me of that privilege unless I showed myself wearing sleep clothes on MSN, which I didn't do because I had no webcam...

Another thing I advise you to do is to seek therapy, it has done me wonders. If you do so keep in mind the therapist ALWAYS has the final word. If he says "no" it means NO. But of course you are the person who sets your goals and he'll have to act in accordance with what you want to do, unless it's something absolutely stupid or impossible. Just be careful with overly pessimistic professionals because those tend to carry over their frustrations in life to their patients and that's the worst thing a therapist could do IMO. Surround yourself with open-minded people and you'll win, trust me.

[ecojeanne]

Yesterday I tried to approach a girl at a club and, well, things didn't work out because for the moment I suck at talking to girls at clubs unless they're drunk or something (which she wasn't).

well Arrow i have somthin u shld try....hehe its my secret....ive had really good responses from guys...to the point i had to tell the guys (friends of mine!) to go away until they cool down....im still in the middle of testing...but really even if its a placebo effect its so cool!....check out [url]http://www.love-scent.com/[/url]

i use the SOE and i tell ya i find such a great difference especially with girls ...they are less threatened....i used T/E but the girls scattered very fast..and i didnt see much of an effect with the guys with that one.

hehe have fun researching because i certainly am

[Bundy]

You really think nothing of what I did was acting like crap? I mean, I myself doubt that everything I did was right. I never had bad intentions, but I did plenty of things I'd do anything to change.

Being sociable, and especially to other girls, is extremely hard on me. I don't even have common interests with most. But I'll keep your advice in mind, it makes perfect sense. From the last 2 times I was near her, things between us have become very awkward and uncomfortable. And every time I feel that way, I put twice the effort to fix it, and just like everyone here says, it just doesn't work.

And I do go to a psychologist, although not very much. She didn't give it much importance though. She's more like "if it's meant to happen, it will, and if not, it won't". I guess next time I go I'll try to talk with her about this again.

And it seems like our future paths don't diverge much. It's very probable we'll end up in the same university (in my country there's no college), and who knows, maybe something WILL come out of all this. But every time I watch a movie, every time I play something on the computer, every time I wake up, I end up thinking of how much I'd like to have her there with me, above absolutely anything else... And just the thought of her being with someone else gives me the shivers.

Thanks for all the advice so far!

[Arrow]

well Arrow i have somthin u shld try....hehe its my secret....ive had really good responses from guys...to the point i had to tell the guys (friends of mine!) to go away until they cool down....im still in the middle of testing...but really even if its a placebo effect its so cool!....check out

i use the SOE and i tell ya i find such a great difference especially with girls ...they are less threatened....i used T/E but the girls scattered very fast..and i didnt see much of an effect with the guys with that one.

hehe have fun researching because i certainly am

Haha did you know at some point I wanted to write a story about a guy who didn't produce pheromones? Sometimes I feel like that. But a fragrance should help. I was going to look into that this weekend... Yesterday I was smelling only my natural smell and some deodorant leftovers.

You really think nothing of what I did was acting like crap? I mean, I myself doubt that everything I did was right. I never had bad intentions, but I did plenty of things I'd do anything to change.

Being sociable, and especially to other girls, is extremely hard on me. I don't even have common interests with most. But I'll keep your advice in mind, it makes perfect sense. From the last 2 times I was near her, things between us have become very awkward and uncomfortable. And every time I feel that way, I put twice the effort to fix it, and just like everyone here says, it just doesn't work.

And I do go to a psychologist, although not very much. She didn't give it much importance though. She's more like "if it's meant to happen, it will, and if not, it won't". I guess next time I go I'll try to talk with her about this again.

And it seems like our future paths don't diverge much. It's very probable we'll end up in the same university (in my country there's no college), and who knows, maybe something WILL come out of all this. But every time I watch a movie, every time I play something on the computer, every time I wake up, I end up thinking of how much I'd like to have her there with me, above absolutely anything else... And just the thought of her being with someone else gives me the shivers.

Thanks for all the advice so far!

You're not alone, don't worry. What I meant by acting like crap was insulting her like I did with my girl. So far you've only been a little too suffocating unless you both had fights but then again I and that girl I told you about had had some fights prior to the separation. She wanted to boss me around and use me for things her boyfriend wasn't able to do, but I got it quickly because I'm born under the Leo sign myself and the last thing Leo people want is to be bossed around... BTW she was an Aries girl - very difficult to control since Aries women love to think they're men.

I think you should definitely get a new therapist because, with all due respect, someone who leaves it in the hands of destiny isn't a good counsellor, and becoming more able to socialise with people is something that should be developed with professional help. You have no idea how hard it is to hear people saying it's easy to do things when you have a background of social isolation, because then you're afraid of doing everything, you think people are constantly looking and laughing at you... And it's worse if you are good-looking, excel at something or like to dress nicely - people are envious of things like that, which doesn't necessarily make them evil since in the end we still live in the jungle and that's how things were before civilisation. The only way you're going to change these premade impressions in your head is to seek help.

About interests, read the news (best is to read sports and pop culture and those kind of news everyone reads about like a presidential election or a big corruption scandal for example), find a musical genre you like and listen to it (I found myself in rock 'n' roll though people are going frenzy about hip hop these days), go to the movies... There's the kind of stuff people MUST know about even if they don't like it (lately everyone wanted to talk about the Olympics), and then there are the more personal interests which you can keep to yourself and occasionally bring up in a conversation if it's relevant to the subject. Most of the talks I have with people are about who won the football game last Sunday, or how the work is going, and in general what happens in life. No need for very special stuff. Also you can hint at something the person likes and talk about that too, although it works best when you at least have common knowledge about what you want to talk about.

Oh and in English college = university.

[Bundy]

Just for fun, I'm Leo, and she's Libra. Does it say anything to you?

We didn't have fights before, except you count the incident where I walked her home against her will, and even then we didn't shout or insult each other. I did become very EMO in front of her at occasions though, like one time I asked her about a subject she wrote in the messenger, and then she said it's not my business, and I told her it hurt me she said that... After all, I trusted her with lots of personal things myself, though I didn't mention that.

Well, I'm actually seeing a therapist because of another reason completely, and mostly because my father wants me to... It's nothing to do with social isolation. How should I go about asking her for help in that? Do I just tell her I've got a social isolation problem, and I want help correcting it?

And I do have my own interests, and lots of them I share with this girl. Even computers and math and anime (though she likes them less than me). I do have to read more newspaper though... I guess I have lots of work to do

[Arrow]

Just for fun, I'm Leo, and she's Libra. Does it say anything to you?

We didn't have fights before, except you count the incident where I walked her home against her will, and even then we didn't shout or insult each other. I did become very EMO in front of her at occasions though, like one time I asked her about a subject she wrote in the messenger, and then she said it's not my business, and I told her it hurt me she said that... After all, I trusted her with lots of personal things myself, though I didn't mention that.

Well, I'm actually seeing a therapist because of another reason completely, and mostly because my father wants me to... It's nothing to do with social isolation. How should I go about asking her for help in that? Do I just tell her I've got a social isolation problem, and I want help correcting it?

And I do have my own interests, and lots of them I share with this girl. Even computers and math and anime (though she likes them less than me). I do have to read more newspaper though... I guess I have lots of work to do

That's weird... I believe she's afraid of a relationship then. If you have lots of stuff in common you should be able to get along really well... Not much you can do than wait and try to act more adult and less romantic. I guess girls look for safety and a more level-headed guy provides them with that. And there are some people that only decide what to do when they look down the barrel of a gun at point-blank range...

Act more mature, take care of yourself, while giving her some breathing room. This is what I'm trying to do with my crush.

You should go to the therapist only if you feel like doing so, though. Letting family (your father) get in the way worsens things.

Leo and Libra usually get along, my best friend is Libra and my old best buddy from junior school was Libra too. Libra are supposed to be sensitive, delicate, charming and insightful. Not that astrology plays a huge role though, because it really depends on the person. My father for example was Aries and we really got along, however that girl was too difficult. I also tend to dislike Gemini if the person has a cocky personality since they talk too much, try to make every crap they put out of their mouth interesting and shift mood too often, but some of the best conversations I've ever had were with Gemini people, including my current crush. Capricorn is difficult too, they are unimaginative and work too much. Aquarius are fascinating, they tend to be very intelligent and different. My best experiences: Taurus, Leo, Libra, Sagittarius, Aquarius. Middleground: Aries, Gemini, Scorpio, Pisces. Big no-no: Cancer, Virgo, Capricorn. But it varies from people to people. An astral chart would come in handy.

Anyway, you're Leo, which means you must be intelligent, charismatic and good-looking, which is why people may tend to be wary of you, but that's normal and you shouldn't care. Just be careful not to manifest the overly possessive trait of our sign!!!