Obsessed or Normal?

[Mish]

Maybe I'm a romantic but I think "love" is uniquely human ... the ability to place the relationship above the lower animalistic "infatuation" or the even lower animalistic "sexual attraction."

Penguins and Swans instinctualy find a partner with which they form a monogamous relationship for life.

[url]http://dianechabs.blogspot.com/2006/05/monogamous-animals-and-random-useless.html[/url]

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swan[/url]


I think humans can learn a lot from our avian role models

[carl1222]

Penguins and Swans instinctualy find a partner with which they form a monogamous relationship for life.

[url]http://dianechabs.blogspot.com/2006/05/monogamous-animals-and-random-useless.html[/url]

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swan[/url]


I think humans can learn a lot from our avian role models

Birds are cool, Mishanya ... many are monogamous but I doubt they have the level of rational thought to decide to do so ... so maybe they feel something like human infatuation, or just an undefinable instinct ... but nothing like human love. Human love is work.

Carl.

[Mish]

Birds are cool, Mishanya ... many are monogamous but I doubt they have the level of rational thought to decide to do so ... so maybe they feel something like human infatuation, or just an undefinable instinct ... but nothing like human love. Human love is work.

Since when does love need rational thought? Compatibility and intimacy is usually all you need to get hooked. Rational thought comes afterwards or not at all

Well, we don't know, we are not them. All we have are results. They stay monogamous for life and many die when their partners die. It looks like love to me.

[carl1222]

Since when does love need rational thought? Compatibility and intimacy is usually all you need to get hooked. Rational thought comes afterwards or not at all

Well, we don't know, we are not them. All we have are results. They stay monogamous for life and many die when their partners die. It looks like love to me.

I guess we disagree on what love is, Mishanya. You see love as a feeling, I see it as a verb ... an action ... a rational choice to commit.

You get hooked on infatuation that lasts what ... maybe 3-5 years at best? ... far short of love that lasts maybe 60 years despite sagging breasts, flabby asses and wrinkles. Anything less is not love.

You are right ... bird love looks like love ... but I doubt it IS love.

Carl.

[Gribble]

WOW I joined this site for advice, not a judge and jury! If only life were as simple as falling in love conveniently, all you say is right but you can't just fall out of love when you have fallen for someone this hard!

Sorry to offend so many!

So you want us to tell you that having an emotional affair is okay? Do you want us to tell you it's okay to break your wife's heart? Do you have children? Should we tell you it's okay to put your desires above their needs?

Be a man. Grow some balls. Break off your absurd internet-fling. If you can't, at least have the courage to inform your wife so she can file for divorce. What you're doing is low and dirty and not a day goes by that you shouldn't be ashamed of yourself.

[Mish]

I guess we disagree on what love is, Mishanya. You see love as a feeling, I see it as a verb ... an action ... a rational choice to commit.

You get hooked on infatuation that lasts what ... maybe 3-5 years at best? ... far short of love that lasts maybe 60 years despite sagging breasts, flabby asses and wrinkles. Anything less is not love.

You are right ... bird love looks like love ... but I doubt it IS love.

The birds I mentioned stick with each other through flabby asses and wrinkles (maybe ruffled feathers) and not for 60 years but through entire lifetime. They commit to their partner and no one else (no other bird) from beginning to the end, even though they might be tempted by some feelings. I think they perfectly fit your definition of love.

I honestly don't understand what you disagree with.


Also, I didn't say that love is just a feeling. I said "Compatibility and intimacy is usually all you need to get hooked. Rational thought comes afterwards or not at all". Everyone has different definitions of love. For me it's Intimacy + passion + commitment. The 3rd coming into the picture a bit later than the first two. This perspective is entirely consistent with my other posts in this thread.

[Gribble]

Actually, I've read that is something of a myth that's recently begun to be deflated. Birds aren't as monogamous as we've been lead to believe.

[Mish]

Actually, I've read that is something of a myth that's recently begun to be deflated. Birds aren't as monogamous as we've been lead to believe.

I don't know about other birds, but there were studies that showed Swans and Penguins are. Ofcourse there are cases that defy the standard.

[Gribble]

"Swans have long been renowned as symbols of lifelong fidelity and devotion, but our recent work has shown that infidelity is rife among black swans," said Raoul Mulder from the University of Melbourne's zoology department.

He and colleagues tested the DNA of many cygnets and found that one in six is the product of an illicit encounter. Researchers now wonder how females manage to slip away from their over-protective partners, to mate on the side. To find out they are now attaching tracking devices on swans' tail feathers.

I also read about a certain species of black bird considered to be monogamous. This particular species was overrunning its habitat so scientists decided to give some of the male's vasectomies. To their surprise the females continued laying eggs.

[Mish]

Very interesting, thanks Gribble

There are some that deviate from standard, but majority are monogamous

[doppelgaenger]

Aren't horses "monogamous"?

[doppelgaenger]

Anyway, Love is just hormone addiction, PP. There is hard scientific evidence for this now.

Whoa whoa, wait a minute.

What in the **** is a hormone addiction? What the **** is that?

[IndiReloaded]

Its what I said, love is chemical. So is longterm attachment (for Carl), its just the changes for that are more permanent. Not completely tho.

For all you romantics out there, don't freak out. It doesn't make the experience of human love any less enjoyable or signficant, it just puts it in a different, more rational context. Like how understanding the mechanics of an orgasm doesn't decrease ones enjoyment of sex, or shouldn't.

Anyway, you should be telling your GF "I love you from the bottom of my brain", cause that's what it is.

[url]http://psychology.suite101.com/article.cfm/how_love_hormones_work[/url]

Oh and for Mish - I've read the same things Gribble has about birds & monogamy. While its true many birds mate for life, they are not monogamous. Read 'The Red Queen' if you like this topic. Its similar for humans too, I think. I forget the exact #s, but I think its around 25% of second children are not fathered by 'daddy'. Cuckolding is pretty common for humans too.

[IndiReloaded]

A few women I've loved have been far less than incredible specimens of the species ... some have been plain and a bit heavier than our culture values require ... yet they had qualities that made those superficialities less than important ... oh wait ... maybe those qualities DO make them incredible specimens of the species after all!!!

Oh this. Actually, Carl, we know that attraction in humans is actually based a lot on smell. Apparently human pheremones contain a signal that tells a potential partner about our immune system (which is genetically based) and whether they will complement each other. Complementary immune systems = healthier children = our selfish genes make it into the next century.

So, those 'less than incredible' females actually had that "certain something" that made them attractive to you. They 'got what u need'.

Look up sexual selection & immune system (MHC) if you want to read more.

Gosh, I'm sort of feeling like a parent telling their kids that Santa & the Easter Bunny doesn't exist. But it is nevertheless what we now know.

[doppelgaenger]

Its what I said, love is chemical. So is longterm attachment (for Carl), its just the changes for that are more permanent. Not completely tho.

For all you romantics out there, don't freak out. It doesn't make the experience of human love any less enjoyable or signficant, it just puts it in a different, more rational context. Like how understanding the mechanics of an orgasm doesn't decrease ones enjoyment of sex, or shouldn't.

Anyway, you should be telling your GF "I love you from the bottom of my brain", cause that's what it is.

[url]http://psychology.suite101.com/article.cfm/how_love_hormones_work[/url]

Oh and for Mish - I've read the same things Gribble has about birds & monogamy. While its true many birds mate for life, they are not monogamous. Read 'The Red Queen' if you like this topic. Its similar for humans too, I think. I forget the exact #s, but I think its around 25% of second children are not fathered by 'daddy'. Cuckolding is pretty common for humans too.

Love isn't chemical. Humans are.