Why does the ex hang around?

[CAM]

Mmmm...cat poop. Well, it is awkward but its life I suppose.

@Mis. I'm pretty certain that she likes me and I like her. And, we both expressed love to one another and we even discussed marriage. Our lovemaking was true love making; it wasn't just sex. So, those emotions have been "put out there." Those things don't just disappear into the ethers.

Now, there's distance, emotionally, between us because of the split. I don't "reach out" because she is still likely to use the opportunity to play immature manipulative games. And, it is not right--when she calls it quits, then I have to respect that--and she did for the right reasons. I'm very nice to to her, very polite. I make her laugh and smile and she often sits next to me in meetings.

She still likes me. I still like her. I'm dating other people. I'm sure that she will date other people. We might, one day, return to each other or we might not. Probably, I am too old for her; but in many ways we work very well together. She was a very important part of my life.

I find it easy to meet other very high quality, intelligent, and attractive women. If one thing is true, the women I've met recently have shown complete appreciation for my qualities--and that is a nice change from the ex-gf's often immature treatment of me. That said, I don't feel any drive to get with the new women physically because once one has made love to a women, the idea of just having sex is not overly appealing. I don't even feel the drive to start over in finding a mate.

I show no emotional response to the loss of the ex-gf. My friends say, "You sure took the loss of the ex-gf suprisingly well, Cameron." But deep inside there is this sense that something was torn from me. I invested so much emotion into our relationship (more than she invested in me, I think, but the point is irrelevant) that I just don't find that I have the interest in starting over. But, I will start over because being alone forever is needless self-punishment. Doing nothing is not an option.

[CAM]

she likes you. she may even love you. you didn't do anything bad to her. that's hard to find. and sometimes a girl is too young and not ready for such a nice guy.

It reminds me...one time, I said something mildly rude to her, because I was upset. She was shocked, but didn't cry or say anything. I pulled the car into a parking lot, turned to her and said, "I'm very sorry for my rudeness. You don't deserve to be treated that way. It was uncalled for and it won't happen again." I think that shocked her even more. At that point, a single tear rolled down her cheek. You know, I never said another rude thing to her ever again, never even raised my voice. I may have expressed frustration with her at times, but never a rude word passed my lips.

Your comment about being a "nice guy"--I think I fit the mold.

[misombra]

I think you do too.

[CAM]

Maybe she isn't totally decided to end it, even if she ended it. Some times women do so. Or maybe she is ''following up'' on you, to see how you have been doing, and, lol, even maybe to see why aren't you interested in her? Someone said earlier: women do hate to be unpopular. They need to feed their ego with your pain, kind of. Weird.

I've heard of this before--the ego-feeding thing. Never experienced it. In the past, I was soo way out of relationships...when I called it quits, it was the rare exception that I ever saw or heard from the person ever again. I suppose there's a first time for everything.

I think you do too.

Thanks, Mis.


So, I'm spending several hours with a new young woman (this time, only ten years younger than me). Just like my former gf, she's Asian. Going to get my beauty sleep tonight--need it after the week.

[iamaninnocentma]

You really should stop saying things like "lovemaking". Most women dont appreciate that kind of talk. It sounds a bit fannified.

[smackie9]

This is why I always say, don't dip you pen in the company ink. Dating someone from work can suck ass, because you are faced with the reality they are there every frickin day and after a break up things can get nasty....usually you become the office gossip too because when you date at work it becomes everyone business whether you like it or not....you are just lucky she didn't turn into a psycho and accuse you of sexual harassment to get you fired......but then again nothing like seeing a cat fight over by the copier lol.

[CAM]

This is why I always say, don't dip you pen in the company ink. Dating someone from work can suck ass, because you are faced with the reality they are there every frickin day and after a break up things can get nasty....usually you become the office gossip too because when you date at work it becomes everyone business whether you like it or not....you are just lucky she didn't turn into a psycho and accuse you of sexual harassment to get you fired......but then again nothing like seeing a cat fight over by the copier lol.

To reiterate...she didn't work in the same building until AFTER we broke up. After we broke up, she came to work in my building. Get it? After...after...after.

She's odd. I mean, how many women break up with their boyfriend and then change jobs (it was not a promotion for her) and end up seeing their now ex-boyfriend more often than when she'd dated him? That's a bit odd.

And, as Indi said earlier...it is a pain in the neck that I'll have to live with for about 2 or 3 years.

[IndiReloaded]

I find it easy to meet other very high quality, intelligent, and attractive women.

I invested so much emotion into our relationship (more than she invested in me, I think, but the point is irrelevant) that I just don't find that I have the interest in starting over.

There's something inconsistent about these statements, but I can't quite grok it. That the problem isn't meeting them, its keeping them? Or vice-versa?

Is it really that hard to find an intelligent, stable, decent mate? Really?

[CAM]

There's something inconsistent about these statements, but I can't quite grok it. That the problem isn't meeting them, its keeping them? Or vice-versa?

Is it really that hard to find an intelligent, stable, decent mate? Really?

Actually, it is easy to meet them, but difficult to "keep them." I find that many professional women, at least the ones I meet, are very independent and career oriented. They are here today, but then they move to another job. One woman I dated--and we were very close--finished her MD and then decided to traipse off to another university for a Ph.D. She said that she knew she'd be lonely, but that she was still young and wanted to get the second doctorate because, "I still want to learn." When asked what she was planning on doing after that, she said "I don't know. I'm not that interested in being a researcher. Maybe I'll just become G.P." Many claim to want to fall in love and settle down, but 9 times out of 10, their career comes first. I'm not condemning them for that, because that's their choice, their lives.

Answer to second question: Is it that difficult? Either I'm the exception to the rule or... yes, it has become that difficult. Obviously it isn't just me--take a look at the divorce rate (in the US). One of my male co-workers; married to a highly intelligent woman, they have a bright child, etc...she's divorcing him after 20 years of marriage because he's a nut-job. I'm sure she'd agree with my answer to your question!

[CAM]

The last two generations of American youth have been shuttled from piano lessons, to soccer, to ski-team, to test-prep classes, etc....parents of the highly gifted have told them their whole lives that it is about them and their accomplishment. Not all, but a sizeable chunk of these highly gifted folks (men and women) are inwardly-focused. What I've found is that many of them struggle with their emotions--it is very difficult for them to engage in a relationship. Spending too much energy on another person or relationship makes them feel guilty--like their are being distracted from their goals and wasting their time. If you engage them in an activity that they have been "trained" to do as part of career development, then they feel safer. Volunteer work is a great place to meet a mate because they are doing something that is useful to their resume and still spending time with you (the mate). They "spook easily," if they think things are getting serious. Sex doesn't spook them--it is sort of a natural bodily function that they need. You can compliment them on their performance and their body; but attach an emotion to it? Not a good idea--they often get spooked.

[CAM]

And, I've noticed that the highly successful of my generation...the married ones live almost separate lives within their marriage. They seem to cohabitate more than have a "family." The parents go their own way, the child is off at camp or going through the same drill as the parents did as children (soccer, math camp, test-prep, language classes). I live in a neighborhood where not having a doctorate is ththe rare exception. I watch the husbands and wives at neighborhood parties...almost emotionless with each other. They've all been in the lab 15 hours a day and all look tired. Yet, they go through the motions of skiing on the weekends, hiking in name-brand locale. For a group of people with their pedigree and vacation-locales you'd think you'd see a deeper and more sincere happiness and contentedness. They are all very nice people, very polite, very bright, and in good physical condition. What makes them happy is their routine, their labels and titles. They are human to a degree but not too deeply human. Does that makes sense? It might ring a bell (wink).

[CAM]

Things that spark interest in the women I date: 1) ask them about them and their careers; 2) discuss the exotic locales that either you or they have been (if they've been to every location that you've been, then you are no longer of interest); 3) discuss the size of the program in which you work and the big-names working in the program; 4) activities: where do you hike, ski, golf, etc?; 5) know thy equipment: what kind of outdoors equipment do you have and your vehicle; 6) volunteer work, global warming, etc; 7) cocktails and food. Never discussed: current events, politics, religion, etc. And avoid expressing any deep convictions...that really scares them off (unless you date women who like anarchists).

[CAM]

The past offers some insight. Pete Seegar's "Little Boxes" speaks volumes. Yeah, I know some folks are thinking "Old Pete doesn't look like contemporary folks, so he probably doesn't have anything to say to me." Well, just listen to the words

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=La21jYGIQ8k&feature=related

[IndiReloaded]

Cam, where do you find this stuff? Here's one of my favourites:

There's room at the top...

[CAM]

Good song Indi!

Where do I find this stuff ? I grew up listening to Pete Seeger! Yeah, a very conservative little boy from a very traditional family who grew up listening to socialist music, reading Karl Marx, and listening to Radio Moscow on a single sideband when he wasn't praying in Latin. If you don't hear both extreme positions and everything in between, you don't really understand the world.