Philosophy: Existence of God

[Mish]

This is the way I heard it told, too.

This information contradicts the information I have just posted. Post #29. Follow the link.

[richardrli]

For those of you who do NOT believe in God: How do can you possibly explain the thousands of millions of species that exists or has existed? Or the wonderful balance of forces that holds the universe and especially this planet? How can life POSSIBLY, with all it's complexities start from inanimate matter? Added to the fact that there are enormous structural differences between all the living things on Earth. The chances of life 'evolving' from inanimate matter in the first place is 1 out of 10 to the power of 950, and I'm not joking about this, life simply could not have started out of 'nothing' by itself, it's like saying the stature of Liberty just happens to be there by itself without being built by humans. One of major and obvious problems with Darwin's theory is that it totally fails to explain how life started in the first place and how every single detail of the universe was created in perfection, allowing life to exist on this planet. This can only be the work of a Supreme Being, it's the truth. Science CANNOT explain this critical issue.

[NeoSeminole]

I searched online for the exact definition of the Big Bang Theory, but I could find none. So I will use Merriam-Webster's definition - "a theory in astronomy: the universe originated billions of years ago in an explosion from a single point of nearly infinite energy density." Since it's a scientific theory, I do not believe it would say time and space did not exist before the Big Bang. That's a conclusion. Scientific theories are based on observations. You are probably misunderstanding when physicists say time and space began after the origin of the universe. They use time and space in a practical sense. Afterall, it doesn't do us much good to debate these properties b/c we don't know what happened before the Big Bang. I suggest you look up quantum physics. You are hurting yourself by trying to explain Quantum Theory using the Big Bang Theory. It's like trying to describe abiogenesis using evolution. The two fields are unrelated.

[Only-virgins]

For those of you who do NOT believe in God: How do can you possibly explain the thousands of millions of species that exists or has existed? Or the wonderful balance of forces that holds the universe and especially this planet?

Actually, it is all explained, you just don't know it because you are probably a high school drop out or still in high school. You do know that evolution and biology goes beyond the basic crap they teach you in high school right?. If anything, the enormous amount of different species is only more proof of evolution and less for god.

Oh, and by the way, the world is not in your "wonderful balance", in-fact the world runs on chance and dis-order. Do you call natural selection a balance? the fact that a conscious mind has to die because it is weaker then another?

I searched online for the exact definition of the Big Bang Theory, but I could find none. So I will use Merriam-Webster's definition - "a theory in astronomy: the universe originated billions of years ago in an explosion from a single point of nearly infinite energy density." Since it's a scientific theory, I do not believe it would say time and space did not exist before the Big Bang. That's a conclusion. Scientific theories are based on observations. You are probably misunderstanding when physicists say time and space began after the origin of the universe. They use time and space in a practical sense. Afterall, it doesn't do us much good to debate these properties b/c we don't know what happened before the Big Bang. I suggest you look up quantum physics. You are hurting yourself by trying to explain Quantum Theory using the Big Bang Theory. It's like trying to describe abiogenesis using evolution. The two fields are unrelated.

Well said. I think what happened prior to the big bang would be explained through quantum physics and math it-self. I have never seen any proof of anything in the world breaking scientific laws of physics and math.

how do you prove anything exists?

Through observation. Unless you believe in Descarte and think we are in some matrix, lol.

-1 for trying to hard to be clever.

But Atom is matter
[/I]

Yes, and that atom ALWAYS existed.

it doesn't imply that the universe was made of nothing, it says it was made from an atom. can you imagine? one atom could give birth to all the gallaxies, stars, supernovas, black holes, planets...

One atom (split) can also destroy an entire city block so whats the suprise?

[NeoSeminole]

richardli, you cannot marvel how this universe sustains life b/c you don't know what a universe that doesn't sustain life would look like. What are you using to compare with?

[NeoSeminole]

Only-virgins says:

"-1 for trying to hard to be clever."

That's exactly what I thought

[Mish]

I searched online for the exact definition of the Big Bang Theory, but I could find none. So I will use Merriam-Webster's definition - "a theory in astronomy: the universe originated billions of years ago in an explosion from a single point of nearly infinite energy density."

This goes line in line with what I have posted from a different source, only worded differently. I.e. The Universe, which includes time, space, and everything in it, begins with the Big Bang 13.7 ± 0.2 billion years ago.

Once again the universe with all matter, space and time originates from an unknown source according to Science, before which nothing could have existed.

Since it's a scientific theory, I do not believe it would say time and space did not exist before the Big Bang.

But which ever information I read up on Big Bang theory, it says exactly that. Maybe it is done to make up for the fact that noone knows what existed prior to Big Bang.

That's a conclusion. Scientific theories are based on observations. You are probably misunderstanding when physicists say time and space began after the origin of the universe.They use time and space in a practical sense.

Not really, because there is a logic behind the Big Bang Theory. The origin of the universe must have a beginning to everything, otherwise it can not be classified as an origin (If it has no beginning), therefore it is only logical that scientists would create a beginning for time and space to coincide with the beginning of the universe to clasify it as beginning to everything. I understand that line of thought, what I don't understand is how everything could appear out of nothing? Because even if there is a slightest chance that something existed prior to big bang that already means that time, space and some form of energy or matter existed prior to Big Bang and universe was not created by the Big Bang but simply existed in another form.

Afterall, it doesn't do us much good to debate these properties b/c we don't know what happened before the Big Bang. I suggest you look up quantum physics. You are hurting yourself by trying to explain Quantum Theory using the Big Bang Theory. It's like trying to describe abiogenesis using evolution. The two fields are unrelated.

I am actually not trying to explain Quantum Theory using the Big Bang Theory. I am stating a fact that our modern science still can not explain the origins of the universe. So you either believe that everything came out of nothing or that everything came out from some unknown force that we yet do not know and do not understand. Which one is more logical or makes more sense is up to each individual.

[Only-virgins]

ROFL!, I feel sorry for you NeoSeminole. You have to put up with this guys pages and pages worth of nonsense he picked up at answers.com lol. Mishanya is looking for the creation of the universe, he won't ever face that the universe always was but in a different state. He wants the original creation but that is faulty logic because you show me god and with that logic I must ask "Who created god?"

[NeoSeminole]

okie-dokey Mishanya, whatever you say man. I'm tired of arguing with some 16 yr old kid who thinks he knows more than me about the origin of the universe. I realize that no matter what I say, you will try to "outdo" me with some reply even if it doesn't make any sense.

[Mish]

Yes, and that atom ALWAYS existed.

OV, thanks for the support

Here is a quote that I think you will find interesting Science tells us nothing about what happened from the time of the Big Bang until 10-43 seconds

At this point in time Science can not say anything in regards to what made Big Bang happen. It can neither proove nor disproove what caused the Big Bang. If anyone says that Big Bang was created by Pokemon or by an unknown mysterious force (Which can be called God) or Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, which you describe are living in your closet, Science can neither proove nor disproove those allegations.

So once again, this argument falls to each to his own becuase neither can be proven nor disproven for the lack of information. Those who choose to believe in God have a valid scientific reason for doing so, which is science can not provide an answer and may never be able to

[Mish]

okie-dokey Mishanya, whatever you say man. I'm tired of arguing with some 16 yr old kid who thinks he knows more than me about the origin of the universe. I realize that no matter what I say, you will try to "outdo" me with some reply even if it doesn't make any sense.

Oh, but you are not arguing with me, you are arguing with the Big Bang theory, I am just showing you the information it provides us. Plus you must first show me a reply that doesn't make any sense

Also, do you refer to anyone who doesn't agree with you as a 16 year old kid? Just out of curiosity?

[Only-virgins]

LoL, you believe god has a valid scietific reason? hahahaha...ok..I am done here, but the last thing though, the big bang was an event that cause an atom in a hot state to expand, prior to it you can either believe that the matter always was, or that god always was. LoL, but the choice is not a hard one if you have any sort of intelligence in you there. Not to mention at least quantum phsyics and laws of thermal dynamics support matters enternal existance through energy.

Oh, but you are not arguing with me, you are arguing with the Big Bang theory, I am just showing you the information it provides us. Plus you must first show me a reply that doesn't make any sense

Also, do you refer to anyone who doesn't agree with you as a 16 year old kid? Just out of curiosity?

No, your not even arguing with Neoseminole. A good argument stats its premises and then it shows its conclusion, your just trying to bore us to the point were we just agree with you lol. You keep saying the same shit but you seem to have the definition of the big bang confused so whats the point? You use other sites to defend you premises that have no value right after coming home from beginners algebra in high school lol.

[NeoSeminole]

I'm not arguing with the Big Bang Theory. I want to make that clear. I'm arguing with your misunderstanding of the theory. All your replies haven't made any sense. You keep trying to describe where matter came from using the Big Bang Theory even though it only explains how the universe originated from a single point. It's like trying to describe how life appeared using evolution. This is faulty thinking. I keep telling you to look up quantum physics but you don't listen. I do not refer to everyone who doesn't agree with me as a 16 yr old. You just happened to demonstrate the intellectual capacity of a 16 yr old to me.

[Mish]

ROFL!, I feel sorry for you NeoSeminole. You have to put up with this guys pages and pages worth of nonsense he picked up at answers.com lol.

Are you saying that information stated there is incorrect? Show me the link that shows Big Bang Timeline is otherwise than stated in the link I have posted

Mishanya is looking for the creation of the universe, he won't ever face that the universe always was but in a different state.

That's not true, show me where I said that? I am repeating the information provided by scientists that says time, matter, energy and space began with the Big Bang and before had no existance prior to Big Bang. I am not saying I agree or disagree with that. In fact, the only time I showed my real inclination in this thread was towards the fact that "We Do Not Yet Understand".

And the fact that you say that everything always existed without having any proof to back up that argument just shows how stupid, that's right STUPID you really are. Because guess what Science tells us nothing about what happened from the time of the Big Bang until 10-43 seconds So all you have for the basis of your argument that universe always existed is nothing but pure speculation that can not be proven in any way, shape or form. Once again I niether agree nor disagree with your argument to maintain my neutrality on the matter

He wants the original creation but that is faulty logic because you show me god and with that logic I must ask "Who created god?"

Who created God??? If there is a God then obviously God can not be created

[richardrli]

I want a clear and honest response to this question: Darwin never explained at any point in his 'theory' about how life began in the first place, he 'presumed' that it was inanimate matter coming together by coincidence. Now, let's do the maths, for all the atoms, amino acids and the rest of the biological matter to come together to form the simplest of living orgainisms is a chance of 1 out of 10 to the power of 950, again please do not take this as a joke, i'm being totally serious and honest. That is 1 out of 10 with 950 zeros behind it, in maths anything less than 1 out 10 to power of 50 is considered impossible.
Furthermore, that is only the simplest of beings, such as early forms of cells, whose structure is more complex than anything mankind has built. This is definitely NOT coincidence, and the universe also came out as the work of a Supreme Being, notice I deliberately omit the word 'God'. Lood up 'Harun Yahya' on Google, he is an author that has devoted almost his life to this issue, and came up with the conclusion that Darwin's theory is indeed fraudulent and Creationism was the correct explanation.