Turned down or not? What does she want me to do?

[Shinto]

Hi everyone,
I'm 21 and student and have been interested in this girl for some months. I haven't had a single girlfriend in my life so I'm totally unexperienced. I always get extremely nervous around her and I have a hard time being being myself and finding the words when talking to girls I'm interested in.

Even though I never noticed her looking at me more than two or three times, there were a few situations that got me thinking. Let me tell you I'm pretty sure that before this happened, she already noticed that I was behaving different around her and that I have been looking at her every now and then..
So 2 weeks ago; We were boarding the same subway, I was in front of her, entered and sat down. When turning around I noticed she was right behind me, and she sat down right in front of me. If she didn't know me at all that wouldn't have meant anything, but I think she knew I was acting different around her; cause there were a few occasions when I was looking at her and she was looking back in a way that told me "I noticed you".

So as experience from the past I knew that if I didn't approach her, nothing was going to happen. So I took all my courage and talked to her last Wednesday. It was near the subway station where only a few people were around, though on the way I passed my female friend and showed her a strange reaction when she asked what was up, but that later.

Her friends were not around so I started the "conversation";
"Hi, umm.. do you have a moment?"
"Yea, but I do want to get the next subway"
"Okay, umm.. I've noticed you a couple of times and I'm interested in you. Would you mind... not right now, but maybe in vacations?"
"Rather not"
"Hm.. okay.. (hiatus). By the way, I've noticed you drawing a couple of times; I've always wanted to learn to draw too. Have you been doing that for a longer time?"
"(short, quiet laugh) Yea, I started some years ago."
"I see.. (hiatus..) But you don't want to.."
"Rather not"
"Okay.."

Well yeah, that was pretty much it. As I said I was extremely nervous and she probably noticed that. The words failed me and I didn't really talk about what I wanted to. Also notice how I didn't really ask her anything about if she wanted to get to know me/meet some time. Though she answered "rather not" on this unspoken question.
So I thought I got turned down and was all depressed the rest of the day.


Now comes what totally confuses me:
Information beforehand: Tuesday, Thursday and Friday we usually take the same subway in the morning.
On the next day, last Thursday, when I was boarding the subway in the morning, she was sitting near the door, reading as usually, and she noticed me, looked at me and smiled. My reaction was kind of bad, I didn't smile back, turned away and stood with my back turned to her for the rest of the ride.
Before the lecture began, I though I'd try and sit down one seat in front of where she usually sits (she did not enter the room yet). A bit later she entered, her friends were not there this day, so she was alone. I heard her stop before she sat down. She probably didn't know what to do either, when she saw me sit right before where she usually does; but then she sat down right behind me anyway. The room was still almost empty at the time, but I didn't think much of it, because as I said, it's where she always sits.
So after the lecture was over we both had about 1:15 hours break, which we usually spend at the cafe with our friends. I thought she wouldn't come to the cafe this day though, because she never did when her friends were not present.
So I sat down at the corner of a table at the corner of the cafe, facing the wall, so I didn't see any other tables, just that single empty seat right beside me, which was less than 1 meter away. That female friend I mentioned before who noticed my strange behavior was sitting beside me.
So all of a sudden I see her to my right and she sat down on exactly that only seat which I could see in the whole cafe, her back halfwards turned towards me, and started reading her book. Now there's about 10 tables in the cafe, of which 6 were completely empty at the time, with 5 of them outside my field of vision.
So I was totally confused and started asking myself "why is she sitting like right beside me when she turned me down yesterday?"

Then I had a conversation with this female friend of mine, part of which she could probably hear, as she was sitting pretty close.
So my female friend started asking me about why I was acting so strange yesterday and started guessing

"You didn't like confess to a girl yesterday and got turned down did you?"
I was silent for a short time but then answered "Yea.."
"Ohh.. So I wasn't wrong! Could it be she's sitting somewhere around here?"
So I pointed at her.
"I knew it! You like ignored me yesterday and started talking to her and I was all confused what was up."
And she pretty much confirmed my thoughts:
"But did you notice? The cafe is almost empty, so why is she sitting like right beside you? And didn't she sit behind you at the lecture where almost all of the seats around were empty too?"
The start of this conversation was a bit louder, later on we started talking a bit more quiet.
The break was eventually over but she sat there reading, doing some homework, then reading again for the whole 1:15 hours.
Then we went to different lectures and I didn't see her since. Not on Friday either, because I had an exam for the whole day somewhere else.
Next time I'll see her will be on Tuesday. We both have the same exam on Thursday and starting one week later there'll be 7 weeks of vacation where I won't see her if nothing else happens.


I don't understand anything anymore. My first approach to her was kind of bad and I thought she'd turned me down, but then she smiles at me the next day and sits almost right beside me when half of the cafe was empty for 1:15 hours.

What am I supposed to do?
I feel tempted to try talking to her again, hopefully I won't lose the words and be that nervous again, so we can have a conversation. I was kind of ready to give up, but not when she's like giving me signals not to? We could have a chat but at the end I'd really like to tell her I want to get to know her and ask if she'd like to exchange numbers and meet in vacations.


I'd be really grateful for some advice.
A few female opinions would really help too.. any idea she would behave like that?

[carl1222]

First of all, don't ask her out again. She rejected you twice, so it would seem creepy. An experienced player might be able to pull it off, but you have nowhere near the level of necessary subtle skills yet to succeed.

So here's what you do. Have a conversation with her. Forget asking her out for the moment. Ask her about herself (it relieves the pressure by shifting the conversation to her). Look her in the eye when she is talking, and PAY ATTENTION to what she says so you can respond appropriately. When she starts talking about what blows her hair back, ask her about it. She'll appreciate your interest. If she asks you a question, answer it ... but don't go on and on.

Look, she's just a person, not a goddess nor a space alien. Treat her like one! After a few casual conversations, if things seem to be going well, ask her to do something with you ... be specific! Pick something that is in line with what she is interested in (see "PAY ATTENTION" above). If she has any attraction toward you, she just might say yes. If she is not attracted (or not available), then she's the wrong girl for you.

Good luck.

Carl.

[SelflessnHumble]

Don't listen to any nay sayer: it was significant what she did.
However, don't be boring, unassertive and boring.

Women love men who are: confident and who have high self esteem, not low.
The they want a man who knows what he wants, who is in control and who has a sense of humor + who is spontaneous.

She could be inferring that she wanted you to come to her again.
It could mean nothing. You only live life once: make the most of it.

[Shinto]

Some months later..
a few good things happened this last week. My female friend was talking to her one day when I arrived, and we 3 had a short chat. So I thought hey, now I have a (kind of) reason to talk to her "again" (we only exchanged like 5 words at that time);
So last Tuesday when I boarded the train luckily there was an empty seat in front of her, so I sat down there and said Hi, without very much hope at first, since it seemed like she didn't look at me/notice me at all these last weeks.
I was thinking "what the.." when she looked up with a smile, said Hi, and packed away the book she was reading in only a few seconds. There was some silence after that, then I asked her name, she asked back, and we had a short chat, also talked a bit about our hobbys and walked to university together. We still sat apart in the lecture though (we only have 2 lectures together, tuesday & thursday mornings).

So the thursday two days later I met her in the train again, we talked a bit more than before and this time she even started talking to me at university while her friends were there too. I took the chance this time and (very obviously, walking through two empty seat-rows) sat down beside her; she didn't mind and her friends didn't seem to be surprised.
It seemed really obvious she wanted to talk with me that day, she was also smiling a lot.

Then on friday, I met her again on the way home, waiting for the subway. She was together with her friends and some other groups of people out of her semester, none of which I really know. Well, we said Hi and exchanged a only a few words until the subway came; when we entered it seemed natural for me to sit down in front of her, her friends also sitting beside us. From there until I got off she was talking only to me, smiling, leaning forward, telling me what shes doing the rest of the day, talking about our hobby.
From the time we said Hi until I got off, we were standing/sitting in front of each other; her friends didn't say a word. When I got off, she told me to have a nice weekend, I replied the same; so..

wow ..was it not very obvious that she like me too? Since I 'confessed' to her 3 months ago, which she can't have forgotten so fast, there's no way she'd go smiling all the time and acting like that talking to me when she'd just think of me as another guy. Especially since we didn't talk to each other at all before last tuesday. I'm also not very good at talking a lot, so she probably wouldn't have started as many topics herself if she didn't care.


I couldn't have imagined it'd turn out like this. Since I'm totally inexperienced, I'm wondering how slow or fast I should take next steps, and what would those be? There's one activity she mentioned multiple times and she seems to do the same each friday after university; I could ask if she'd mind me tagging along for instance. Or should I wait some weeks before advancing at all? Or maybe wait for her to take a step?

Thanks in advance for any advice; those last posts also really helped

[smackie9]

If you spend your life hesitating you will be one lonely dude. Step up the confidence and go full speed.

[Shinto]

So you're saying next time we meet I should ask about doing something together? It's not exactly (well some is, but not only) hesitation; I can hear/read here and there that women like to take it slower? I mean, if she'd ask me do to something together first (how many girls do that though) I'd say yes on the spot , but would she be as open if I did the same? I don't want to scare her or something..
I can imagine it'd be hard to decline a question like -
.. "I'm going there again now"
"You'd mind me tagging along?"

And it could end up as an awkward situation if she's not yet comfortable to be alone together.
Id looked like she was on friday, though.

Hm.. I've been told to stop thinking many times and I'm doing it again ~~
It's just after being completely single for 21 years it seems really really fast after only having talked with her for one week/three times.


Thanks for the advice; some more opinions would be nice - do you agree to go 'full speed'?

[robertdawson]

I probably won't be too much help as I haven't been awfully successful but a few things...

So you were talking with your friend about her when she was two seats away from you in the coffee shop? Why would you talk about someone as if they weren't there when you thought she could hear you?

Anyway, what she did sitting next to you a couple different times seems significant to me. However, I'm not totally sure why she would have turned you down twice. The one time she turned you down: "Rather not" sounds pretty rude to be honest. After two rejections I would have probably moved on. However, if you think she is warming up to you I'd say maybe try again.

My impression is that you are being way too shy/nervous when talking to this girl. Don't stumble over your words and act like you're scared to talk to her. You can ask her about doing the activity she likes, but personally I wouldn't say "can I tag along". That does not sound like a confident way to say it at all. I'd say just flat out ask her if she wants to do said activity with you.

You've got to end up making the final judgment call on all this though. You're seeing firsthand how she acts around you, while all I know is what you've posted.

[Shinto]

I think you made a little mistake with the date here =) (29.05.)
I got farther in a good way and just opened another thread.
Thanks for the effort anyway.

[smartguy]

Hi everyone,
I'm 21 and student and have been interested in this girl for some months. I haven't had a single girlfriend in my life so I'm totally unexperienced. I always get extremely nervous around her and I have a hard time being being myself and finding the words when talking to girls I'm interested in.

Even though I never noticed her looking at me more than two or three times, there were a few situations that got me thinking. Let me tell you I'm pretty sure that before this happened, she already noticed that I was behaving different around her and that I have been looking at her every now and then..
So 2 weeks ago; We were boarding the same subway, I was in front of her, entered and sat down. When turning around I noticed she was right behind me, and she sat down right in front of me. If she didn't know me at all that wouldn't have meant anything, but I think she knew I was acting different around her; cause there were a few occasions when I was looking at her and she was looking back in a way that told me "I noticed you".

So as experience from the past I knew that if I didn't approach her, nothing was going to happen. So I took all my courage and talked to her last Wednesday. It was near the subway station where only a few people were around, though on the way I passed my female friend and showed her a strange reaction when she asked what was up, but that later.

Her friends were not around so I started the "conversation";
"Hi, umm.. do you have a moment?"
"Yea, but I do want to get the next subway"
"Okay, umm.. I've noticed you a couple of times and I'm interested in you. Would you mind... not right now, but maybe in vacations?"
"Rather not"
"Hm.. okay.. (hiatus). By the way, I've noticed you drawing a couple of times; I've always wanted to learn to draw too. Have you been doing that for a longer time?"
"(short, quiet laugh) Yea, I started some years ago."
"I see.. (hiatus..) But you don't want to.."
"Rather not"
"Okay.."

Well yeah, that was pretty much it. As I said I was extremely nervous and she probably noticed that. The words failed me and I didn't really talk about what I wanted to. Also notice how I didn't really ask her anything about if she wanted to get to know me/meet some time. Though she answered "rather not" on this unspoken question.
So I thought I got turned down and was all depressed the rest of the day.


Now comes what totally confuses me:
Information beforehand: Tuesday, Thursday and Friday we usually take the same subway in the morning.
On the next day, last Thursday, when I was boarding the subway in the morning, she was sitting near the door, reading as usually, and she noticed me, looked at me and smiled. My reaction was kind of bad, I didn't smile back, turned away and stood with my back turned to her for the rest of the ride.
Before the lecture began, I though I'd try and sit down one seat in front of where she usually sits (she did not enter the room yet). A bit later she entered, her friends were not there this day, so she was alone. I heard her stop before she sat down. She probably didn't know what to do either, when she saw me sit right before where she usually does; but then she sat down right behind me anyway. The room was still almost empty at the time, but I didn't think much of it, because as I said, it's where she always sits.
So after the lecture was over we both had about 1:15 hours break, which we usually spend at the cafe with our friends. I thought she wouldn't come to the cafe this day though, because she never did when her friends were not present.
So I sat down at the corner of a table at the corner of the cafe, facing the wall, so I didn't see any other tables, just that single empty seat right beside me, which was less than 1 meter away. That female friend I mentioned before who noticed my strange behavior was sitting beside me.
So all of a sudden I see her to my right and she sat down on exactly that only seat which I could see in the whole cafe, her back halfwards turned towards me, and started reading her book. Now there's about 10 tables in the cafe, of which 6 were completely empty at the time, with 5 of them outside my field of vision.
So I was totally confused and started asking myself "why is she sitting like right beside me when she turned me down yesterday?"

Then I had a conversation with this female friend of mine, part of which she could probably hear, as she was sitting pretty close.
So my female friend started asking me about why I was acting so strange yesterday and started guessing

"You didn't like confess to a girl yesterday and got turned down did you?"
I was silent for a short time but then answered "Yea.."
"Ohh.. So I wasn't wrong! Could it be she's sitting somewhere around here?"
So I pointed at her.
"I knew it! You like ignored me yesterday and started talking to her and I was all confused what was up."
And she pretty much confirmed my thoughts:
"But did you notice? The cafe is almost empty, so why is she sitting like right beside you? And didn't she sit behind you at the lecture where almost all of the seats around were empty too?"
The start of this conversation was a bit louder, later on we started talking a bit more quiet.
The break was eventually over but she sat there reading, doing some homework, then reading again for the whole 1:15 hours.
Then we went to different lectures and I didn't see her since. Not on Friday either, because I had an exam for the whole day somewhere else.
Next time I'll see her will be on Tuesday. We both have the same exam on Thursday and starting one week later there'll be 7 weeks of vacation where I won't see her if nothing else happens.


I don't understand anything anymore. My first approach to her was kind of bad and I thought she'd turned me down, but then she smiles at me the next day and sits almost right beside me when half of the cafe was empty for 1:15 hours.

What am I supposed to do?
I feel tempted to try talking to her again, hopefully I won't lose the words and be that nervous again, so we can have a conversation. I was kind of ready to give up, but not when she's like giving me signals not to? We could have a chat but at the end I'd really like to tell her I want to get to know her and ask if she'd like to exchange numbers and meet in vacations.


I'd be really grateful for some advice.
A few female opinions would really help too.. any idea she would behave like that?

Champ...To be frank she might wander you or it should be Co-incidence...Dont fall into any trap...You dont look at her for a week and ask your friend to notice her reactions or leave it alone

[Shinto]

Champ...To be frank she might wander you or it should be Co-incidence...Dont fall into any trap...You dont look at her for a week and ask your friend to notice her reactions or leave it alone

Please at least read the last post =/. This thread is over 2 months old and over with. Luckily It wasn't coincidence.

If a mod would close this please =?