Mind vs Body

[Indignant]

I got a chance to watch AstroBoy this weekend and basically it's about a kid dying and his father making a robot with the boy's mind that he got from the kid's DNA. and then realizing the robot somehow took on his own personality he banishes him.

What really makes us? our minds or our bodies? we get recognized by our appearance. but we also have our own unique minds and personalities. or are the later really unique? we all follow the same instincts, have the same flaws as many others. so is it our body after all? could it really be that the most important aspect of US is our appearance?

[NeoSeminole]

Mind 100%

our brains make up who we are and allow us to communicate with and appreciate our surroundings. If we damage our brains, we lose a part of ourselves (e.g. stroke patients). However, damage our bodies and we're still the same person (e.g. fracture a bone or cut your finger).

[Only-virgins]

My mind is who I am. My body is the machine that I use to power and sustain my mind every day.

[Mish]

I remember there was a science fiction book on this subject, I don't remember the name. This guy is hired as a body double for a dictator and taught to mimic the dictators actions, posture, speech, everything. When the dictator is shot through the head, his body remains intact and the body double's body is burnt beyond recognition. Scientists under orders do a brain transplant of the body double's brain into the body of the dictator. When he wakes up the first thing he notices is differences in perception, touch, smell, taste are all different to what he was used to. Later on he started to experience strange cravings, which through the course of the book turned him into an even more bloodthirsty dictator than the other one was.

Anyway, when it comes to science fiction, anything is possible.

[IndiReloaded]

I read a book as a youth with an almost identical subject. The Soul of Anna Klein (Klane)? Something like. The only difference in that story was the scientist had a daughter instead of a son.

Lois McMaster Bujold (a far better author) writes about a planet where humans are deliberately cloned & raised to become hosts for their progenitor's brain. Their younger self is taught to believe in the 'great sacrifice' they are making. Creepy. Not sure if its an oblique comment re: suicide bombers, but the similarity in mindset is striking.

[doppelgaenger]

What makes us who we are is neither our mind nor body, but everything around us.

[Lipp]

Your body is just a vessel.

[Junket]

The mind is just as fragile as the body.

Nothing matters.

We have no souls.

[NeoSeminole]

doppelgaenger says:

"What makes us who we are is neither our mind nor body, but everything around us."

clarify what you mean. To me, it just sounds like a vague comment that's trying too hard to sound profound.

[Sanctuary]

This discussion is irrelevant because your mind (neurons firing back and forth in your brain) is part of your body.

Unless you believe in the mind body duality, then in which case I'd have to say the mind of course.

could it really be that the most important aspect of US is our appearance?

No, because who we are is also what we are in the minds of others. Appearance is just an aspect of us, but our words and actions also affect who we are.

[Sonrisa]

No, because who we are is also what we are in the minds of others. Appearance is just an aspect of us, but our words and actions also affect who we are.

right, but our appearance makes a huge impact on the minds of others. most of the time people will accept our mental flaws in exchange for our bodies. physical attraction is seems to be the most popular topic for all males or females. we have discussed many times that we wouldn't date obese or ugly people. but we do date cheaters and abusers if they are good looking.

[doppelgaenger]

doppelgaenger says:

"What makes us who we are is neither our mind nor body, but everything around us."

clarify what you mean. To me, it just sounds like a vague comment that's trying too hard to sound profound.

I didn't think it needed clarification.

Everything we experience is part of the world around us, and that is how our mind and body develop. Physical strength and endurance are a result of gravity. Without it, there would be muscular atrophy. Our bodies developed to suit our needs in this world, that's why we are vagrant beings with developed minds and respiratory systems. A human in a vacuum wouldn't have such a developed mind as a civilized person from postmodern culture; you'd find that they share primal psychological development with animals and not much further. Our thought process, cognition, and our personality all develop dependent to the world around us.

Of course, this isn't some zen shit, as if we are one with the earth or something like that. I am saying that without experience, you are nothing. Without thoughts, the mind is useless. Without forces of the earth, the body serves little purpose.

[doppelgaenger]

right, but our appearance makes a huge impact on the minds of others. most of the time people will accept our mental flaws in exchange for our bodies. physical attraction is seems to be the most popular topic for all males or females. we have discussed many times that we wouldn't date obese or ugly people. but we do date cheaters and abusers if they are good looking.

I'd say that when it comes to relations, appearance is a big factor. In developing who we are, I'd say it's a pretty significant variable; what we think of our appearance and how others perceive us. I can see what you're saying, and I agree in the sense that you mean, but I don't think it really makes us who we are.

[NeoSeminole]

doppelgaenger says:

"Everything we experience is part of the world around us, and that is how our mind and body develop. Physical strength and endurance are a result of gravity. Without it, there would be muscular atrophy. Our bodies developed to suit our needs in this world, that's why we are vagrant beings with developed minds and respiratory systems. A human in a vacuum wouldn't have such a developed mind as a civilized person from postmodern culture; you'd find that they share primal psychological development with animals and not much further. Our thought process, cognition, and our personality all develop dependent to the world around us.

Of course, this isn't some zen shit, as if we are one with the earth or something like that. I am saying that without experience, you are nothing. Without thoughts, the mind is useless. Without forces of the earth, the body serves little purpose."

you're still trying too hard. Our surroundings influence our mental and physical development, but it's our brains which are ultimately responsible for determining who we are. Take a person from one environment and put him in another, and he still retains a sense of individuality. This has been demonstrated in case studies involving identical twins who are reunited after several years only to find they share many similar qualities. However, remove a portion of your brain and you essentially change who you are all-together. A book was written by a neuroanatomist in which she describes her path to recovery after a severe stroke left her crippled. In it, she asks "don't hold me to being the person I was before. I have a different brain now."

[Indignant]

I am saying that without experience, you are nothing. Without thoughts, the mind is useless. Without forces of the earth, the body serves little purpose.

but isn't our mind useless as is? we spent years convicing ourselves and others of some truth that we find to be logical and rational, just to have it crushed in less than 5 minutes by someone else.

for example let's take girl's problem. she has spent years convincing herself and her boyfriend that watching porn is logically and rationally wrong. and then she has a bunch of people telling her that what she thought all those years is wrong, and it is actually her mind is her biggest flaw.

that points out that mind is useless and everchanging, but her appearance is what people will know and accept her by.