Asking a shy girl out

[bnme90]

We'll call this the bus situation lol.

So we coincidentally met at the bus stop after lecture yesterday. Not surprisingly, she was with her friend. I see her whispering to her friend asking if it's me. So we board the bus and I stood next to them since all the seats had been taken, and here's where it gets interesting lol. She boarded first, which meant her friend stood in the middle between us. Her friend then gave her this look and grabs and pulls her to switch spots, so that we would be able to talk. This, to me, shines a new light on this whole dynamic, because now it's clear her friend knows I'm trying to talk to her. And by giving us space, it shows that she's not a barrier and purposely trying to complicate things, but rather, it just so happens that they're always together.

Anyway, so we talk on the bus, but I wasn't gonna ask for her number there, since I was gonna get off the bus in like 2 stops. So we just made some small talk, I asked about her weekend and she said she didn't do much except read and stay home. The more I talk to her, the more I'm beginning to feel like she can be pretty ditzy at times.

[MENTION=71386]TheEvilJester[/MENTION] to your point, I don't think she's purposely not giving me the chance, I think it's more so that she's not assertive enough to do so, case in point, this bus situation yesterday, where her friend seems to know more of what's going on than her lol. I'm starting to feel like she's just as unassertive and clueless like I am lol...

So, yeah, that's all the updates thus far. Apologies if not much progress has been made, but since we've all decided it's best to take the slow approach, this is probably gonna be the rate at which any updates come in. So given this update, what do you guys think? Am I on the right track as far as making my intentions clear? Do I continue to make small talk like this and wait for the right opportunity to strike? Or perhaps start creating opportunities? I've been brainstorming so much lately, of things I can do to try and make some progress, such as maybe writing her a note and asking for her number that way since her friends are always around, is that a good idea?

[TheEvilJester]

See, that IS entirely possible. Her just being kind of clueless. I didn't think so at first.... until you shared the details of how you asked her out that one time. Me personally, if I were her I could easily have misinterpreted that as you were asking her AND her friend to go out as friends. Hell, I'm pretty clueless with that sort of thing myself. A girl could probably ask me out and if she wasn't beat me over the head obvious about it I wouldn't get it. Not like that would ever happen, but... you know... hypothetically speaking. LOL!

So, yeah, could very well be that she just doesn't realize (or maybe suspects it but isn't sure) that you like her.

Heck, the bus situation isn't enough to really tell.... but it is at least evidence in the pro column. Because A) you and her were able to exchange some pleasant chit chat and B) her friend apparently made it a point to move aside to actually allow you two to talk. That may not mean anything.... or it could. So, not really enough to go by but at least definitely seems good.

I hope there are others still following along with your story because I will confess I am not 100% sure about the note idea. I sort of lean towards thinking better just to actually ask her, even if it does mean having to do so in front of her friend/friends. I feel like a note seems a little grade school, so to speak. Then again, I don't know. Maybe it could come across as a cute/funny way to get around the issue of never being able to talk to her one on one.

So, hopefully somebody else has thoughts on that because I am kind of on the fence myself.

[PRW]

Anyway, so we talk on the bus, but I wasn't gonna ask for her number there

Waiting for a green light to start flashing on top her head before you get her number?

Open your phone up to a new blank "contact",...hand her the phone and tell her to put her contact info in there. Notice how I didn't frame it as a question. After she puts the information in (which she will), take your phone back and say "thanks",...and then shut up about it. Talk about something else. She's smart enough to know if she gave you the info that you will probably use it,...without you telling her you will.

Text your information back to her an hour or so later,...not while you are standing in front of her.

Later in a separate text,...just ask her out with a specific date,...specific time/day/place,...for several days in the future. After you do that put down the phone. Do not contact her till she replies or says something "in person" the next time you run across her. If she never replies,...consider that your answer, and treat it like it never happened the next time you bump into her,...cornering her, or confronting her will never end in a positive way.

[pcmaster]

A good strategy to get a phone number.

[itina]

Ask for her number, if you get it without hesitation, great!, but if you don't or she hesitates,..."Oh well,...next!" Make the date, she accepts, great!,..."maybe she won't be that bad". Maybe you'll get a second date after, maybe not,...oh well. If she declines the date,..."Oh well,...next!"

I agree with you

[PRW]

A good strategy to get a phone number.

It has worked 99% of the time for me. In 4 years I only had one "play dumb" and act like she didn't know what I wanted,...she put her first name in it with nothing else. Found out later she had a boyfriend, so it's obvious why she didn't want to give it to me but she didn't know how to decline "gracefully". So I didn't hold it against her,...hence she'd still be friendly and say "Hello" if we bump into each other. She might be available in the future, you never know,...I try to never burn bridges.

[TheEvilJester]

Open your phone up to a new blank "contact",...hand her the phone and tell her to put her contact info in there. Notice how I didn't frame it as a question. After she puts the information in (which she will), take your phone back and say "thanks",...and then shut up about it. Talk about something else. She's smart enough to know if she gave you the info that you will probably use it,...without you telling her you will.

That feels rude to me. But, nuts to me, I guess. I guess I'm wrong if it works 99% of the time for you. I just personally feel like there is a difference between being confident and being cocky. I think I've even said this in another thread before, but if I were a gal and a guy did something like that to me (handing me his phone and telling me to put my contact info in it) I think my personal gut reaction would be "F*** you, buddy!" I think that should still be a REQUEST you just have to request with confidence.

But, again, Hell... maybe I'm wrong if it works so well for you. Maybe bnme90 should just try that. I just know I personally wouldn't feel comfortable with that. I'm curious about something, though, PRW. So, you say about 99% of the time that works... but then how often does it actually wind up leading to them following up when you do try to reach out to them? Because, that's another part of why I wouldn't personally think that is the best approach. Something like that may cause more women to give you their number when maybe they wouldn't have otherwise... but I suspect not necessarily because they want to. I would guess many of them would maybe just not know how to politely decline. I would imagine that when you try to actually call/text them later it would rarely go anywhere. To me, it feels like that is one of the ways you gauge interest. If you ask for her number and she says yes you know there is at least a decent chance she's interested. If you ask for her number and she says no, you know not to waste any more of your time. With an approach like you'd suggest, I'd feel like you'd waste a lot more time with people who would have just said no to you right off the bat.

Let me just make clear, though, that I am not trying to be argumentative, so I hope I didn't come across that way. I am actually asking all this because I am 100% interested in the answers myself. Maybe I'm wrong and I really should try this sort of approach myself. I'm asking scientifically, so to speak.

Waiting for a green light to start flashing on top her head before you get her number?

All the above said... I 100% agree with this idea, though. Believe me, I know how you feel, bnme, but I agree with PRW. If you keep waiting for some sign, keep waiting for "the right time," it may never come. To some degree, your slow approach may be okay if it is what it takes you... but just don't wait too long. Eventually if you don't just go for it and ask her out, you may well lose the chance completely.

[PRW]

That feels rude to me. But, nuts to me, I guess. I guess I'm wrong if it works 99% of the time for you. I just personally feel like there is a difference between being confident and being cocky.

There is a difference, but this isn't it. I'm not slamming the phone down in front of her and demanding she give her number. I do it with the same friendly tone of voice as asking someone to "pass the salt". It is also done in the context of having a good conversation going with them and with me getting the impression from them that there is already an interest level that is at least noticeable.

Something like that may cause more women to give you their number when maybe they wouldn't have otherwise... but I suspect not necessarily because they want to. I would guess many of them would maybe just not know how to politely decline. I would imagine that when you try to actually call/text them later it would rarely go anywhere.

Doesn't happen that way. It took two years before I got my first "no" to a first date,...and it wasn't due to how I asked for her number. Yes,...it is intended to encourage them to give their number. Yes, it is a known fact that women will give their number just to get rid of the guy knowing that they will ignore him later,...the women already know this,...the men need to learn this, and to not be butt-hurt if she rejects him afterwards. It is just part of the "dance".

To me, it feels like that is one of the ways you gauge interest. If you ask for her number and she says yes you know there is at least a decent chance she's interested. If you ask for her number and she says no, you know not to waste any more of your time. With an approach like you'd suggest, I'd feel like you'd waste a lot more time with people who would have just said no to you right off the bat.

It doesn't waste any more time than waiting for a green light to start flashing on top their head. On the flip side I am not accepting it blindly, I am carefully watching their reaction and enthusiasm as they give me the number. I have sometimes decided to not contact them after if I thought they didn't really want to give it to me,...seem to be hesitant, or very lack-luster about it. I'm not doing it in a vacuum.

Let me just make clear, though, that I am not trying to be argumentative, so I hope I didn't come across that way. I am actually asking all this because I am 100% interested in the answers myself. Maybe I'm wrong and I really should try this sort of approach myself. I'm asking scientifically, so to speak.

I don't think you are argumentative, I think you are hearing something "different" than you are used to and are trying to figure it out.
I would say you need to be more bold. Women find boldness attractive. They are smart enough to know that their femininity will "tame" you somewhat later on, so they aren't going to be offended or afraid of the boldness as long as you aren't so excessive that you seem like a wack job. If you don't think women are using their version of similar feminine tactics (and "tests") on us to manipulate and get what they want,...it is time to wake up. Most of women's "tests" and tactics are meant to weed out the weak and timid,...and to expose the bold ones so they can try to conquer and tame them. Women want a challenge, and to feel like they had to put some effort into it. They don't want a guy that is just "putty".

[Hooo!]

Im with prw here
People who don’t wanna give you their number enter a false one or just don’t do it

If you feel pressured by someone handing you their phone and you cannot speak the words: „no I’m sorry I don’t know you and I’m not comfortable enough to share my phone number yet“ then it’s your problem
Not his

[TheEvilJester]

There is a difference, but this isn't it. I'm not slamming the phone down in front of her and demanding she give her number. I do it with the same friendly tone of voice as asking someone to "pass the salt". It is also done in the context of having a good conversation going with them and with me getting the impression from them that there is already an interest level that is at least noticeable.

LOL! Well, your example is a bit extreme. It is more what I'd call deliberately cocky. You can be obliviously cocky as well, and I guess that is just how your actual/reasonable example makes me feel personally. Again, though, maybe that is just me. But it still to me personally just hits my ears wrong. Like, again, were I the gal in the situation my gut reaction/internal thought would be "Umm...excuse me, but when did I say I was giving you my number? Didn't we skip a step here?" If I were the gal, that could actually have the negative effect of making me think twice about somebody maybe I would have been interested in otherwise.

I think, and again this may just be me, that you can actually ASK for a girl's number yet still display confidence in doing so. I think you can bold yet still polite. I like to think I do my best to be a gentleman, and I guess I would just personally feel ungentlemanly not making this sound like a request no matter how confident I was. Again, though, admitting maybe that is just what is right for me personally. I don't know. Not like I've had much actual success as an example. LOL!

Doesn't happen that way. It took two years before I got my first "no" to a first date,...and it wasn't due to how I asked for her number. Yes,...it is intended to encourage them to give their number. Yes, it is a known fact that women will give their number just to get rid of the guy knowing that they will ignore him later,...the women already know this,...the men need to learn this, and to not be butt-hurt if she rejects him afterwards. It is just part of the "dance".

Oh yeah, agreed with everything there. Even if you DO ask, many women will give you a fake number, or even give you their actual number knowing they can just ignore you later and hope you take the hint. I'm just saying I would think you would get a lot more of those instances with that kind of approach, whereas many of them you would have avoided had you given them the opportunity just to say no immediately if they were going to anyway. But.... again.... it works for you and apparently very well. So, I can admit when perhaps I am wrong.

I don't think you are argumentative, I think you are hearing something "different" than you are used to and are trying to figure it out.
I would say you need to be more bold.

Oh, absolutely that applies to me. Or at least it always did in the past. I do think I could honestly be more bold these days given the opportunity. These days I merely lack the opportunity and the motivation. At least for me personally, I can't help but think that ship has sailed and that I'm so much better off just accepting that. It's done me well recently.

But, I could not echo this sentiment more as it relates to our OP bnme. I would completely agree with PRW that you do need to be more bold. ...And I do NOT mean that as a slight against you or mean any insult in it. I mean that as a guy who knows from experience. Who knows what it is like not to be bold and knows the consequences of that. Who knows what it is like to keep waiting for "the right moment" only for it to never come. Again, if you do need to take some time and kind of work yourself up to asking her out, I can understand that.... just don't wait forever. The more you convince yourself "Well.... I'll wait for XYZ and that will be the perfect time..." the easier it will get to just wait for next time.... and next time... and next time.... And before you know it she'll be out of your life. Or somebody else will ask her out. One way or another if you wait too long constantly hoping for the right moment you will eventually lose your chance.

So, don't lose your chance. If you get rejected, sure that will suck.... but at least then you will know and you can move on. You'll be stronger for it, you'll be more bold in the future with asking other women... and eventually somebody will say yes. Good luck to you!

[Hooo!]

There is a reason why openers like „ nice shoes, wanna ****?“ actually work

If you act decisively and in control and out of a position where you know that the girl is not going to regret Going out with you and it could be a lot worse for her then you can just go directly where you want to go from there
Even if that’s her bedroom
She will tell you to stop (which you obviously respect, as long as it ain’t a shittest) if she wants you to.

If you gave a girl whom you have met and whom you find attractive your phone along whatever line that suits you (mine would be that I finde her attractive and intriguing and I want to give us the opportunity to get to know each other) then I don’t think it’s rude to just let her give you the number

If she’s uncomfortable with that. Cool. Next time

If I got to know you personally jester and thought that we should meet up again because you are a cool guy
Id tell you
And you’d nod or anything and I’d give you my phone to enter your contact details
That’s not rude
It’s effective

[TheEvilJester]

Honestly.... I hadn't thought of it like that. You are kind of right. If another guy and I were talking and hit it off and thought we'd make good friends... and he did exactly that (the whole hand me the phone, tell me to add my contact info thing), I wouldn't even think twice. I would not think that rude in the slightest. I'm not sure why it hits me as slightly rude in the other scenario.

To be honest, though, I don't think I'd personally ever feel comfortable being THAT bold. I don't think I could personally pull that off, which in turn would have the negative effect of making me seem very non-confident. For me, what would work better is more so something like "Hey, this has been fun. Let me get your number so we can meet up again some time." It's still posed as a request, but is done with confidence. At least I think, anyway. Big difference, though, from asking with something like "Umm....uhh...so...hey...can I maybe get your number and call you some time? Like, I mean, totally no biggie if you aren't comfortable with that, but I was hoping maybe we could meet up again. You know, if you don't mind." (Makes no eye contact, head down, shuffling feet like a nervous cartoon character). LOL!

All the same, I can admit when I'm wrong. You guys have explained it very well and I can see how I was just misconstruing the scenario in my own mind. As long as it is done so in a polite and non-aggressive manner, I definitely see now how that can be seen as politely confident.

So, food for thought for our OP. That could work... but even if you are sort of in line with me where you don't think you could be bold enough to pull off a move like that... you can at least be MORE bold in your approach then you have been.