I guess it's my story now...

[dutchdiosa]

Alright well, this is going to be long, so bear with me please because I need desperate help.

I was in a relationship for two years...he is from Pakistan and I am from America. We are both Muslim, but because of my "past" his family has always hated me and never even gave me a chance. They would say all nasty things about me such as I was a whore, dirty, disgusting, oh I could keep going. Anywho, last summer his sister sneaked into his computer and read things about my past, that frankly were none of her business...it was family stuff. Well, she turned it around and made me look awful. His parents were trying to force him to break up with me and well, he didn't want to, so we worked something out and stayed together.

In November he gave me an engagement ring, behind his parents back at first because well, his parents would have disowned him and he wanted to graduate college first. The relationship wasn't always easy because of him traveling, but as any one of our friends can attest, we had that relationship everyone always wanted. We fought like anyone does, but we were that "model couple." I guess at least. Alright so get into what has happened now...

He left in May after graduation to go on Umrah (Islamic retreat). He promised his grandfather he would go before he gets a job so that he can start his life on the right path. The day before he left, we spent an amazing day together and well, he looked me in the eyes and swore to Allah that he would NEVER leave me and that he would be back on July 4th to be with me forever. He swore to Allah that no one would ever take him away from me. Well, two days before Umrah he broke up with me because his father was sick and he couldn't do it anymore. Then, five days later he contacted me again and we were back together and talking and working through all his fears. His Mother was always saying that she was dying because of us and his father said he would kill him if his Mother died because of what he was doing. Well, in Makkah (Islam's Holy City) his parents asked him to pick either them or me, well, he picked me. His parents were angry and all this stuff and making more threats. Well, to a Muslim making any decision in Makkah, is making a decision in front of Allah, and it is very very very bad to break it...anyway.

So, then we were fine and I mean, there were arguments and I was getting sick and my parents were threatening to take me away for a while from him because the emotional stress was taking a toll on my health. So, he then told his parents, when he got back home in Pakistan that he made his decision and that he was staying with me. He told me that no matter what forms his parents wanted him to sign he would sign. So then, July 2nd comes around and I find out that his Dad cancelled his ticket to come back on July 4th and we were both upset and started discussing him coming back and buying a ticket. Everything was great, "I love you's" and all those beautiful things we say. Then...on July 4th, he sent me a message before talking to his Dad about getting a ticket and he was like, "I love you and I promise I will be right back, I love you baby and I cannot wait to see you." He admitted that his Dad was going to flip on him, they always do...however...something happened then.

He broke up with me and hour after what he said again...and we have been broken up every since. He told me that his Dad threatened to kill him again, and that wasn't why he did it, he couldn't hurt his family anymore...etc etc. However, when I talked to him afterward, he kept telling me that he didn't want to do this, that he would never love anyone else, that he would never forget me, but that he HAD to do this for his family even though he didn't want to. My health has plummeted down the drain and well, it hasn't been very nice. Anyway...he hasn't changed his bank passwords, he hasn't deleted my pictures (from ANY e-mail account), he bought himself sex toys (a month after being apart), he is the name on my cell phone bill and we also have a joint bank account together. I asked him, since he wanted to "end it," that we need to close the joint bank account and I wanted my things, and we needed to call the cell phone company. Well, he never responded to any of that, but he would respond to other things I said, and all of that stuff is still open. Also, when I send him e-mails...he still reads them, he still saves them all.

Many of our BEST friends all say that he just needs time to get away from his parents, that there is no way that he would leave me...however, I mean it is so weird, you know? I know he misses me, he "gave me up for his parents", and he is SUPPOSED to come back in September (which he didn't know until I told him I saw his electronic ticket)...and well, he hasn't closed the bank account, he hasn't changed a password to anything, he still saves all my pictures and e-mails...no matter what they are. We don't talk anymore but, he had said that the only way we can move on is to do that, not talk...however from the conversation he has had with a mutual friend...he still...misses me terribly and can't move on but is trying to force himself and convince himself that it is okay to put his feelings aside for his family.

So here is my question: Is our relationship really over, or is he just trying to get back to America so that he can feel safe and then continue on? If there is anything I can do...what is it?

(P.S. No one...no one that knows us believes that he is breaking up with me for good. Also, if there is something you are confused on...please let me know...I can explain more.) Thank you for everything everyone.

[IndiReloaded]

Hmmm, I don't have much experience w/this type of mindset. Perhaps BlueSum can help?

Bump.

[bluesummer]

Gosh, aren't his parents the dramatic ones? I doubt his father would actually kill him. I know that in your culture, parents can be VERY overly dramatic ("Oh, the stress of seeing you with that girl is causing me to have heart problems..." ""I will kill my son if he marries that girl..."). Usually they are empty threats. They might disown him - for awhile. But in the end, they are his parents and will forgive anything. Unless they're crazy. That said, I would be worried about what could happen to him while he's in Pakistan...the rules are different there. My ex husband, who was from India, was actually scared to go back to India because he really believed he'd be killed by his cousins (long story).

I can't tell you what's in your boyfriend's heart, though....how deep his family ties run. It sounds like he really tried to go against them for your sake so he must really love you. The family can make it very difficult on a relationship if they don't approve of it, and the stress of it may have really gotten to him. I think the only chance you have is if he comes to America and gets away from the influence of his parents. If that's not going to happen, you should probably forget about him. He's the one who has to be able to stand up to his family and fight for you.

[devilz advocate]

Nice story!
Very challenging!

If I were you girl, just give him time first to adjust, to convince his parents that you're now separated. Both of you knows that you love each other. So let it be for now.

I know he'll do his promise. Actually its somehow a trial to both of you, to test how strong the two of you. And for sure, you will pass this one...

[sine24]

what is your "past" anyway? maybe we can then put ourselves in his parents' shoes.

[Only-virgins]

Gosh

GOSH!
__________________

[dutchdiosa]

I posted something earlier, but it was removed. There is nothing horrible about my past. I was adopted (their biggest problem) and there is also something that happened when I was a child but it has no effect on them whatsoever.

[shh!]

If I am not mistaken, family honor is very important to the people of that region, no? Although I understand you are American-born, he is not, and therefore family honor may very well win out. Regardless, I think you should really consider objectively whether or not you are really interested in continuing on with a guy whose culture is so different from yours. I mean, when you marry someone, you marry their entire family, not just the object of your affection. Those people sound like they will make your life a living hell, and when the butterflies you feel in your stomach subside (and they will), you will be stuck with them for good, as will any children you may eventually have, who will likewise be ostracized by the people who are supposed to love them.


Here is something to read about family honor: [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honor_killing[/url]

"However, it should be noted that the term honor killing applies to killing of both males and females in cultures that practice it. For example, during the year 2002 in Pakistan, it is estimated that 245 women and 137 men were killed in the name of Karo-Kari in Sindh. These killings target women and men who choose to have relationships outside of their family's tribal affiliation and/or religious community."


I'm not saying it is likely either one of you may suffer in this way if you choose to ignore his family's wishes (although it is possible), but it is certainly worth considering that there are very significant cultural differences regarding the role of family where he comes from.

[dutchdiosa]

Actually I am going to have to disagree with you a tad. He was born here and raised here for most of his life and lived here alone for six years. Also, honor killing is more likely within the villages...he is among the millionaire families that live in the military defence regions in Lahore, where their children do not have issues with arranged marriages and may marry whom they please. It is an entirely different class of people though. Also, the culture doesn't bother me...I was raised much of the same way, I am a Muslim born female.

[shh!]

But his family was not born and raised in the west? This means there are still significant cultural differences with regards to the role of the family in their minds (not necessarily your westernized boyfriend's mind).

Perhaps my last post didn't make that clear?

Whether or not his family engages in honor killings (an I assume the vast majority of Pakistanis don't), they STILL come from a region that puts such emphasis on familial ties that this sort of thing is not unusual. In the west, it is extremely unusual because we value individuality and personal freedom over familial ties.

Does that make more sense?

Also, for clarity, I want to say that this (family honor) is not a "muslim" thing, but rather a cultural practice.

[dutchdiosa]

No I understand where you are coming from. His parents were raised there but went to college here and lived here for 15 years before they moved back. I do understand what you are saying. Thank you.