Debate on friendships between opposite sexes.

[excowho]

My guy friends and I have always had this sort of long standing debate about women and being the best friend. That has over the years grown and come up over and over again thanks to real life experiences. So I come here to get the view of women on the matter, guys feel free to comment a well.

Alright, so the debate started out as a simple one about being stuck in the "friend zone"(I personally don't believe this exists as strictly as some others do, but that is a separate argument.) and grew into an almost complicated theory.

The "sides" of the debate are women "consciously" "use"("use" will be described further down, don't assume the meaning when replying please read the entire thread) the male support from a good male friend. Or they "unconsciously" "use" them.

Now before this turns into a sexist debate, we've talked about us doing the same, and for the most part came to the conclusion that we were aware whenever we were perhaps taking a friendship and using it for more/abusing it when it was convenient for us. We also came to the conclusion that we always felt bad after.

This will be a lengthy one as it does require some perspective.

I guess the easiest way to start this off is with an example; however this is not the only scenario where this takes effect. Say Jon and Jill are dating and have been for 4 years. Throughout this time and before Jon met Jill, Jill was friends with Mark. Jill and Mark have always been close and very good friends. Mark has in the past admitted or shown some signs of interest in Jill. Jill is not completely oblivious to this but doesn't worry about it.
So Jon and Jill end their relationship it wasn't the smoothest of break ups. And in effect Mark being a good friend(Disclaimer: yes friends should have a responsibility in such scenarios, and of course contact will increase between the two, but in this scenario Jill pushes it and uses Marks friendship beyond the expected and normally accepted bounds of friendship.), is there for Jill. Jill and Mark start talking more and doing more things together much more often, Jill begins calling Mark everyday routinely, if you were an outsider looking in, it would take some convincing to believe Jill and Mark weren't seeing each other. A few months pass of this continued behavior until Jill meets Jack and once Jacks in the picture, Mark begins to fade out to be back to their old routine of still being good friends but much less contact; back to how it was when Jill was with Jon. This leaves Mark who has become used to this routine, and who had started to inevitably feel more attached to Jill, somewhat upset and feeling "used".

The name we gave that scenario is the "temporary emotional boyfriend".
This is where the argument can take 1 of 3 sides.
Of course there's the obviousness that it also depends on the individual, but the argument is based on "for the most part women...".
Side A: Jill is completely aware that she was using Mark as an emotional crutch, beyond what is regularly expected of good friends, and using him to fill a void that left with Jon. Upon finding Jack she fazes Mark out, and makes herself as innocent as possible by either thanking Mark for being such a good friend or other "tricky" methods.

Side B: Jill inadvertently just took Mark's friendship and unknowingly/sub-consciously turned him into a significant other(without the physical side or title) to help fill the void/pain from the past relationship. And women being emotional this is just a natural way to temporarily patch up a wound until it is healed or being nurtured by Jack.

Side C: A little bit of both A and B. They realize that they are somewhat abusing the bounds of friendship, but they don't realize the extent to which they are doing it or the effect it has on Mark.

Remember that was only a single scenario out of infinite that we've experienced, been on the other end of, and seen happen to friends. As I'm sure is the same with women.

So the question becomes from your personal experiences or possibly friends, are women completely oblivious when this happens or are they well aware of their actions, in general?

TLDR: Use the back button on your browser.
I am looking for intelligent discussion on the matter.
Guys feel free to input your view on this as well.
Thanks.

[t0ri]

Interesting. I'm actually currently in the exact situation you described! If I had to choose one of those arguments listed, I'd go with A. Although, that is not exactly my intention.

I would not say I am using my "guy friend" as a temporary fill to a void I have, left by my ex. Nor would I say that I am using the friend for more than what would be expected from a good friend. However, I am aware that I am using him as an emotional crutch (along with my GIRLfriends!). I mostly have been taking advantage of his emotional support and comfort because it has been offered. I have made sure to tell him how appreciative I am of his reliable friendship. Unfortunately, I think this friend of mine IS stuck in the "friend zone." I don't see him as anything more than that. So if I began a new relationship, my guess would be that my friend would inevitably fade into the background (which is something I'm pretty sure he's aware of, but is choosing to be there for me regardless). I would still keep in touch with the friend while in a new relationship, but we probably wouldn't chill or talk as much. The friend and I talk a lot every day, but mostly at his discretion, and we hang out about once a week. So I wouldn't say I've subconsciously replaced my ex for him. I wouldn't take it to a level in which people would think we were dating or close to it.

I would definitely say that most women are NOT completely oblivious when this happens.

[Gigabitch]

This could be any of A, B or C, but the important point is that this is Mark's own fault for not keeping his boundaries clear.