Girlfriend no longer interested in sex. At my wit's end.

[Gigabitch]

I don't know your girlfriend, but I know something about relationships and male/ female dynamics, and there's something I just have to say:

I am not an uber-aggressive, all-conquering hero, but rather a thoughtful, contemplative, artistic fellow who sometimes feels overwhelmed by life and just wants to get laid so her can forget about it for a while.

Okay, first of all, you might want to sprinkle a little of the uber-aggressive hero on top of that milquetoast Mr. Sensitive Ponytail Man or you may never get laid again.

I'm sorry if that offends you, but you should know it's coming off as more Ned Flanders and less Mr. Cool. Ever since you agreed to just wait until May when she had "time" for you, I've thought this. If she has time to go out drinking, she sure as hell has time to go to counseling.

She made out with somebody for two hours and you didn't even raise your voice to her? What the **** is wrong with you, man? Do you understand what kind of message that sends? Were you facilitating an encounter group last night or having a pivotal confrontation with this woman? Are you the kind of guy who goes to a men's drum circle once a week? Do you listen to Kenny G? You've GOT to look at the possibility that some part of her lack of interest in sex with you might be about you, not just her. With her history, I think it's a distinct possibility that she responds to alpha-types (and responds very enthusiastically, too). You're acting like a beta. You calmly told her what you were feeling? Jesus, that turns ME off, and I wasn't even in the room.

Yuck, yuck, yuck. Demand to know who this mother****er was who decided to make out with your woman. Give her hell for blowing off not only yourself but a bunch of your friends. Tell her that her waffling around is annoying as hell. Grow a pair and ACT LIKE A MAN. I'm not telling you to be an asshole, I'm telling you to act like a human being. You're acting like some yogi or something. I see enough of that crap living in Santa Fe. It's ridiculous.

[SirWagginston]

I already told you. Everyone already told you. Not giving you any was reason enough, but not giving you any, attributing it to a low sex drive, and then making sexual contact with someone else? This is obviously unforgivable. You gave her multiple chances to tell you if she needed out, and she chose to string you along, instead.

You're more than your job. You shouldn't stop being who you are when you take off your suit. Dump the ho and find someone whose love is not so conditional.

[Incognito]

Hmmm. I rubbed my head as I read this, then massaged the bridge of my nose a little while I thought about it. I, of course, am NOT you. However, putting myself in your shoes I arrived at a few possible conclusions/solutions/courses of action........if I were you. I am saying that because I don't want to explicitly suggest any of these, but simply lay them out as if I were in your shoes. Here are my random thoughts on the matter:

1.You could do the counseling and perhaps she will turn herself around, resulting in a huge leap toward restoring your relationship to its former glory.

You could do the counseling, have the problem resolved, and end up right back here again. Don't write off the possibility that 2.she'll leave one day too, or that you'll leave because so much damage has been done.

3.You could go through the motions, feigning interest in the counseling and then totally, unequivocally piss on her entire existence before dumping her because she put you through all of this and lied, and made out with some guy for two hours in a bar (which I'm still not entirely sure you should believe......2 hours?......in a bar? Sounds more like she just hasn't got the balls to tell you that she had sex with him)

4.If she is THIS weak of a person that she has to be with another man and have such an extreme scenario unfold in order to do something as simple as be open and honest only worse things will happen in the future.

5.How do you know she isn't doing all of this just to keep you near because she has abandonment issues? If that is the case you WILL repeat this scenario.

At this pointit would be 90% #3 and 10% #1. I would be more in favor of crushing her and moving on because it would make ME/YOU feel good. Obviously your feelings were not considered for a long long time, and I think that would make up for it. Harsh? Maybe. Uncalled for or unexpected? Not at all. Sometimes when a car is in a bad enough accident, or has enough problems you just have to stop wasting time/money and get rid of it. Same logic applies here.

[SirWagginston]

She made out with somebody for two hours and you didn't even raise your voice to her? What the **** is wrong with you, man? Do you understand what kind of message that sends? Were you facilitating an encounter group last night or having a pivotal confrontation with this woman? Are you the kind of guy who goes to a men's drum circle once a week? Do you listen to Kenny G? You've GOT to look at the possibility that some part of her lack of interest in sex with you might be about you, not just her. With her history, I think it's a distinct possibility that she responds to alpha-types (and responds very enthusiastically, too). You're acting like a beta. You calmly told her what you were feeling? Jesus, that turns ME off, and I wasn't even in the room.

Yuck, yuck, yuck. Demand to know who this mother****er was who decided to make out with your woman. Give her hell for blowing off not only yourself but a bunch of your friends. Tell her that her waffling around is annoying as hell. Grow a pair and ACT LIKE A MAN. I'm not telling you to be an asshole, I'm telling you to act like a human being. You're acting like some yogi or something. I see enough of that crap living in Santa Fe. It's ridiculous.

Sorry to be changing the topic, but it seems as though you're implying that if instead of trying to understand her when problems arose, he instead reacted with rage, she may have changed her behavior such that their relationship could continue. I'm not trying to disagree; I'm just fascinated. Personally, I would never yell at my girlfriend. The only time I acted "like a man," as you say, was when I no longer wanted to be her boyfriend. And yet, if what you've said holds true, she may have begun liking me more at that point. I stopped being calm and reasonable so I could drive her away from me, not attract her closer!

[Gigabitch]

Sorry to be changing the topic, but it seems as though you're implying that if instead of trying to understand her when problems arose, he instead reacted with rage, she may have changed her behavior such that their relationship could continue. I'm not trying to disagree; I'm just fascinated. Personally, I would never yell at my girlfriend. The only time I acted "like a man," as you say, was when I no longer wanted to be her boyfriend. And yet, if what you've said holds true, she may have begun liking me more at that point. I stopped being calm and reasonable so I could drive her away from me, not attract her closer!

I don't think rage would have been appropriate. Rage is scary. I'm talking about having SOME kind of reaction, rather than this beatific, superior, I-channeled-the-Buddha approach. To me, that would look like he didn't give a shit, and I imagine it might look like that to her too.

"I can't be bothered to prioritize our relationship until May"

"Oh, okay dear."

"I'm not really interested in ****ing you any more but I want you to stick around to make me feel secure>"

"Oh, okay dear."

"Oh, I made out with someone else for hours and blew your ass off last night."

"Oh, okay dear."

[VincenzoG91]

I think that she is lying like crazy to you right now, and you're taking this way too passively. You might break up with her over this? The entire situation has become completely unacceptable by any normal human standards.

I bet she's been hooking up with this other guy for a while now, and by hooking up, I mean sex. Kissing for two hours? Where was she for the rest of the evening, while avoiding you and your friends? And how did her sex drive suddenly come back to life after all this time? And why just for a stranger? She is lying, and the truth would probably cause even you to dump her immediately.

[Incognito]

Damn, those are some good points. Please carefully consider those questions rtm. A lot of what she said just doesn't add up. Her all of a sudden having sex with you doesn't make sense either because YOU haven't changed. Just pack your stuff and leave while she's at work. I did that once and it was the best feeling ever. It was better than any physical orgasm I had ever had, it was like my soul had an orgasm. Once you rid yourself of her and her negativity, and her lying, and her insensitivity you will feel worlds better. Just be sure to cut all contact so that you aren't tempted to go back.

[ftm]

Okay, first of all, you might want to sprinkle a little of the uber-aggressive hero on top of that milquetoast Mr. Sensitive Ponytail Man or you may never get laid again.

One does not have to raise his voice in order to a) Gain the upper hand in an argument, b) Make himself understood, or c) Wound with words. I see no reason to raise my voice at her, any more than I think it would be productive to hit her in the face. I made my opinions about the situation extremely clear and that's enough for me. Aside from this one relationship, I haven't had a tremendous amount of trouble getting laid when I've set out for it, and I'vve no interest in being with a woman who gets off on being bullied.

I am going to be who I am, and if that renders me, as you put it, "Ned Flanders," then so be it. Hi-diddly-ho.

I already told you. Everyone already told you. Not giving you any was reason enough, but not giving you any, attributing it to a low sex drive, and then making sexual contact with someone else? This is obviously unforgivable. You gave her multiple chances to tell you if she needed out, and she chose to string you along, instead.

You're more than your job. You shouldn't stop being who you are when you take off your suit. Dump the ho and find someone whose love is not so conditional.

I appreciate your sentiment here. Had I not made the counseling promise to her all the time ago, I'd probably be gone by now. But I'm going to do it because I am a man of my word and I am ultimately an optimist.

Hmmm. I rubbed my head as I read this, then massaged the bridge of my nose a little while I thought about it. I, of course, am NOT you. However, putting myself in your shoes I arrived at a few possible conclusions/solutions/courses of action........if I were you. I am saying that because I don't want to explicitly suggest any of these, but simply lay them out as if I were in your shoes. Here are my random thoughts on the matter:

1.You could do the counseling and perhaps she will turn herself around, resulting in a huge leap toward restoring your relationship to its former glory.

It's possible. I don't know what's going to happen. It's worth a try.

You could do the counseling, have the problem resolved, and end up right back here again. Don't write off the possibility that 2.she'll leave one day too, or that you'll leave because so much damage has been done.

It's possible. It's possible that no therapy is going to fix this. And, if so, I'm ready to leave. I hate the idea (and moving will be incredibly inconvenient, on top of it all) but I am ready for it.

3.You could go through the motions, feigning interest in the counseling and then totally, unequivocally piss on her entire existence before dumping her because she put you through all of this and lied, and made out with some guy for two hours in a bar (which I'm still not entirely sure you should believe......2 hours?......in a bar? Sounds more like she just hasn't got the balls to tell you that she had sex with him)

I have considered this. I really do think she's telling me the truth. I may keep harping on it to make sure, but I really don't think that happened. I have seen people make out for two hours in a bar before. It's not unheard of. According to her, it wasn't hot and heavy the whole time. Just a little here and a little there, interspersed with talking.

Frankly, if she did sleep with him, I don't think I could be any more mad at her than I am now. I'd feel just as betrayed. I told her this. Actually, the idea of making out for 2 hours (and thus having a zillion chances to put a stop to it) actually bothers me MORE than if it has been a quickie or something like that. Then at least there's a "heat of the moment" type thing. Not that it's any more forgivable. I'm just saying that I get exponentially more pissed off for every extra minute she was making out with this dude and not putting an end to it.

4.If she is THIS weak of a person that she has to be with another man and have such an extreme scenario unfold in order to do something as simple as be open and honest only worse things will happen in the future.

Yeah, I've thought about this. And I question whether I know her as well as I thought I did. This just wasn't like what I *thought* she was like. Ugh....

5.How do you know she isn't doing all of this just to keep you near because she has abandonment issues? If that is the case you WILL repeat this scenario.

At this rate there's going to have to be something amazing to keep me from leaving. I am not going to settle for more of the status quo. And, yeah, if she's keeping me around just because it's better than being alone, then that's a big problem. It's looking like that may be the case. We'll see what comes out in the coming days.

At this pointit would be 90% #3 and 10% #1. I would be more in favor of crushing her and moving on because it would make ME/YOU feel good. Obviously your feelings were not considered for a long long time, and I think that would make up for it. Harsh? Maybe. Uncalled for or unexpected? Not at all. Sometimes when a car is in a bad enough accident, or has enough problems you just have to stop wasting time/money and get rid of it. Same logic applies here.

If it ends, I won't end it spitefully. I am not going to tell our mutual friends what she did, nor my colleagues at work (who she is also friendly with.) Indeed, if this is to end, I want to walk out of it with my head held high, knowing I acted in as upstanding a fashion as I could. Of course, given what she did, it's made it pretty easy to come out looking better than her.

[VincenzoG91]

It could be worse than you're thinking. Maybe her "sex drive" dropped around the time she started dating this other guy. This cheating may have been going on for a while now.

[Sonrisa]

ftm, what if you went out and kissed another woman? would you be able to forgive yourself and still stay with your girlfriend?

[SirWagginston]

I don't think rage would have been appropriate. Rage is scary. I'm talking about having SOME kind of reaction, rather than this beatific, superior, I-channeled-the-Buddha approach. To me, that would look like he didn't give a shit, and I imagine it might look like that to her too.

"I can't be bothered to prioritize our relationship until May"

"Oh, okay dear."

"I'm not really interested in ****ing you any more but I want you to stick around to make me feel secure>"

"Oh, okay dear."

"Oh, I made out with someone else for hours and blew your ass off last night."

"Oh, okay dear."

Well, when you put it like that, I have to admit, I would have started yelling, too. But still: is it wrong to communicate your points without raising your voice, if you can? I just see it as pointless, but if girls want me to raise my voice to them unnecessarily, I'll do it for 'em.

[Incognito]

I think telling people who weren't involved would be a bit much. I was thinking more along the lines of a verbally putting your foot in her ass until it comes out of her mouth, enjoying the ensuing emotional breakdown, then leaving. I try to be reasonable 99% of the time, but I reserve the last 1% for when I am going to give someone exactly what they deserve. I respect your decision to take the high road when this ends though. I obviously wouldn't be so gentle.

[Incognito]

Well, when you put it like that, I have to admit, I would have started yelling, too. But still: is it wrong to communicate your points without raising your voice, if you can? I just see it as pointless, but if girls want me to raise my voice to them unnecessarily, I'll do it for 'em.

Actually I make it a point to never raise my voice when arguing because everything can be communicated in a controlled tone. Choice of words is where I set the tone of the conversation. I think people who yell are showing a lack of self control. That's not to say that I never have in my life, but it happens rarely....extremely rarely.

[cmacattack1]

Reread the part below again.

I became distant from her. I had a serious of issues with myself (depression, low self esteem, you name it) and I didn't open up to her. She tried the hardest she could to keep things together and fight for us because that's how she was raised and how she believed love to be. I would always just throw some excuses at her (work is hard, long, difficult, boring) just to get her off my back. She made suggestions on how to make things work, just like you were, although giving me some space wasn't one of them (she was very dependent). I think that was what I needed though if I didn't communicate to her, how would she know? It's like you need to be out of the picture for them to appreciate you and want you back in it because they are so used to what you provide and take it for granted. It is also the sign of an immature relationship. If you work so hard towards something and they just don't care or give back the same effort, what are you working towards? It's a two person job and if you cannot possibly pick up the slack on her end. It's sinking and she's okay with it because you are keeping the boat afloat with everything you have.


I never wanted to cheat on my ex girlfriend and she knew that. However, if it continued going the way it had, I probably would have. It sounds like your girlfriend does have some issues on her end (as noted by years of therapy) but if she doesn't want to do anything about it, what can you do?

I hate to say I told you so.....no matter how strong she is, to continue on in this situation without any progress would lead to this happening.



As for all her groveling and her NOW wanting to do things immediately and as quickly as possible, doesn't that raise some red flags? Is this panic in her voice because she committed the cardinal sin of dating? Does she really want to do this because she feels for you or because she feels guilty and wants some reprieve? Is she losing her cushion?

[VincenzoG91]

I don't think that she's into you anymore, ftm. Otherwise, the sudden reversal of her sex drive problem is simply inexplicable, since it allegedly happened in mere hours with a perfect stranger. Unless he is some kind of amazing dude or you really suck (probably neither), it just doesn't make sense that her libido would be gone for so long and then suddenly return. I really think that she has been lying to you for some time now. And during that passionate make-up sex, she was probably thinking about that other guy.

And that timeline for the other night doesn't make sense. She completely missed out on meeting up with your group, then hooked up with random stranger guy at the bar? No, because skipping your deal was going on for several hours... that isn't oops, I lost track of time, that's pretty deliberate on her part. Ask her what really happened. I think it was a date.