How to leave a relationship when you love them but they're too selfish?

[jdog]

Hi,
Background:

im in a relationship atm but the girl Im seeing is just too selfish I think and has too many problems. i dont think its really a case of the Knight syndrome thing cos her insecurities put me off if anything. i dont feel like Im there to make her better. I just want her to be able to be a normal girlfriend...

When I first met her I didnt fancy her and she really liked me. I just went along with it cos i thought she was beautiful and it was nice seeing someone...but now I actually love her so its so hard to leave her.

She seems to be insecure about her past relationships and I think she may have some depression. She always finds it hard to get close to me. She has told me that the more she likes me, the more she gets scared that she will get hurt so she pulls herself aways from me. Like she wont be as affectionate etc. and it feels like she doesnt care, but apparently the opposite is true.

Anyway....

yesterday she heard from her friend that her ex-boyfriend is gong out with the girl he was seeing before he was in a relationship with my current girlfriend. This has made my girlfriend feel really depressed because she feels that her relationship with him was a lie and that he fancied his ex all the time they were going out.

I think its fair enough that she feels like this....But what I dont like is that she has never felt like this about me even tho we have split up a few times. Right now she is so depressed about her ex..even tho our relationship is on the rocks

Also, she said that she is worried about everything atm....I asked he if she is worried about us because we recently split up and then decided to give it another go...our relationship has been on the rocks for a while now and there's not a lot of hope that we will work out. Anyway, she said that she is not worried about our relationship....

To me that would be because the relationship is either fine, or because she doesnt care. since the relationship is definately not fine I have to conclude that she doesnt care. This is obviously getting me down and I just want reassurance from her that she does still care...

I was texting her to ask about this, and she said she does worry about us but she puts it out of her mind. When I asked her why she cant put the other stuff out her mind she didnt know what to say. I said that if someone can put one thing out of their mind but not other things, then they must care less about that one thing. She said she disagrees with me but didnt say why...no reassurance that she still cares or anything....and she said that I am making her feel worse right nor for talking about it!!!

i was texting her quite a lot before she said that i was making her feel down...so I dont know why she couldnt have just explained why Im wrong and reassure me that she does care about us.

Ok so when she feels down I try to cheer her up even tho Im worrying about stuff too. But when I am feeling down, AND she is the one that made me feel like this (from saying she isnt worried about our relationship) I am in the wrong for talking about it cos it makes her feel upset!!!??? This is what makes me think she is selfish. I am clearly feeling down about this and all she has to do is tell me why am wrong in thinking that she doesnt care (If I am actually wrong of course)

I can't handle her selfishness anymore, and her not being close to me. Also we argue all the time and I cant be bothered anymore. I need to leave this relationship but keep finding myself going back cos I miss her and love her.

What to do?

Jonny

[RdHrshyKss]

sounds like your gf has a lot of insecurities, suffers depression, and has a horrible habit of always playing the victim. you've tried talking to her about things and she tries to avoid it because she thinks that avoiding conversation will avoid the negative feelings associated with it. but what she doesn't understand is by avoiding, she is allowing the problem to persist and get worse. she needs to see a therapist. it sounds like she has so much going wrong with her that she'd need a professional to help her get off the path she persists on taking.

i'm sure she's partly selfish. but i wouldn't blame selfishness as the only reason she is behaving like this. i think her insecurities and her depression are the major culprits here. she does what she does to make herself feel like she has at least some control of her emotions. and playing the victim all the time, always thinking in terms of being ****ed over by others, will obviously just exacerbate those negative feelings. but in doing so, she hopes that she'll get a little bit of sympathy from you. it's her irrational way of getting affections from you...but it's obviously the wrong way to go.

i think you need to set a time to talk to her. don't just try to start a conversation randomly, because she'll just do the same old stuff she's always done...avoid. if you set a time in advance, and say "look, we need to talk about this relationship, and every time i bring it up, you try to dodge it. dodging it is making things worse and is leaving me more and more unhappy/unsatisfied. if you love me like you say you do, you will take the time to sit down and have an open discussion about our relationship and what we are going to do going forward." this conversation will be your time to tell her all the things you posted here. tell her how you are feeling and give her the opportunity to respond. in the end, she is the one who needs to do something. she can't keep playing the victim all the time because all it does is create more stress on herself. and if these habits are really old, it will probably be very difficult for her to change within the kind of time frame you are looking for (which is why i suggest she seek professional help).

i'm not sure if clinging onto this relationship is good for either of you. and i think the only reason you end up going back to her is because you miss the companionship...not necessarily because you are in love with her. i'm not saying you don't love her. i'm sure you do. i love my bf too, but i know that we are just not compatible. after 4 years we've come to the conclusion that we'd both be better off ending the relationship. it's going to be hard, but in the end, we'll both be better off this way. i've gone through a lot of the stuff your gf has gone through, and it did take me awhile to come to grips with how i was derailing my own life. her way of coping with her own issues is by projecting them onto everyone else. she needs to own them before she can expect anything to change.

i think you should have a discussion with her about this. if she refuses to do so, at least you've tried. leaving her will be hard, but it'll be the healthiest thing for you to do.

[Take2]

It sounds to me like both of you are being somewhat selfish and insecure. You know she is feeling horrible, suffering. So you ask her to reassure you and help you feel better about yourself? I promise you that is a recipe for disaster.

You need to spend some time figuring out what you need and want, set some time up to talk with her, find out what she needs and wants. Then you need to have a serious discussion about how and whether you guys can meet each other's needs. If not, it will be better for both of you to admit it is over.

However, I would encourage you to stop assigning your logic to her emotions and then getting mad at her about your misguided conclusions. Her emotions are what they are, and since they have no responsibility to follow your logic, it does not necessarily follow that if thing A makes her sadder than thing B, she must care more about thing A. Insisting that her emotions must mean something in particular no matter what she thinks they mean is somewhat insulting, and also unlikely to lead to any worthwhile conversation or aid in healing a troubled relationship.

[RdHrshyKss]

^^^good points

[jdog]

It sounds to me like both of you are being somewhat selfish and insecure. You know she is feeling horrible, suffering. So you ask her to reassure you and help you feel better about yourself? I promise you that is a recipe for disaster.

The difference is that I have tried to make her feel better about her ex. I have listened to this problem and others on the phone, and have said that I think her ex must have cared to stay with her etc. This is all I can do, and cannot correct the problem. And I have my own problems too (depression, ADHD, worried about mine and her relationship, setting up my own business etc.)

However, when it comes to me, she CAN correct the problem by reassuring me that I am wrong to think that she doesnt care. This is the difference. She CAN completely eradicate my feeling of upset and worry, but she doesnt....if I had the power to do this for her worries then I would, even tho I have my own shit to deal with.....and what's more is that she is the one that has made me worry about it in the first instance....and now she doesn't even want to hear me talk about it....

You need to spend some time figuring out what you need and want, set some time up to talk with her, find out what she needs and wants. Then you need to have a serious discussion about how and whether you guys can meet each other's needs. If not, it will be better for both of you to admit it is over.

i have tried....she shuts off and tells me to stop talking and that Im making her feel bad. She does this with anything that actually matters....I've said before so many times that if she could actually talk about things rather than pretending they dont exist she would have gotten over many of her insecurities already...I made the analogy of someone going to a funeral and mourning rather than just pretending it's not happening when someone dies...

"it does not necessarily follow that if thing A makes her sadder than thing B, she must care more about thing A"

I think that the intensity of peoples emotional states ARE correlated to how important those things are to them....If someone they know dies then they will be sadder than if a random person dies. If they dont get a job they wanted they will be more upset about that job they didnt really want.....Am I wrong? But if you are upset about one thing and not another then it means that the first thing matters more to you...


Jonny

[Take2]

Have you told her what you need and why in a non-confrontational way? "Please reassure me that your response doesn't mean you don't care about us at all. When you say things like X, it really hurts my pride."

And yes, you may be wrong about the emotional response thing. Emotions are not always cut and dry, not always predictable, not always logical. What we think about something is not always what we feel about something. And sometimes thing B that happens triggers feelings about some other thing X, Y and Z and intensifies the response. Also, sometimes we can't talk about our feelings easily, and her statement that she is not worried about your relationship may be wishful thinking on her part rather than reality. You telling her that her feelings are wrong is not exactly likely to encourage her to open up more about conflicting emotions she might be feeling right now.

[trouble_sleepin]

Hey Jonny, your relationship sounds a bit like something I'd been through recently. In my case, I was the girl with the insecurities, so I hope that this will be a little helpful.

It seems like your girlfriend is going through a lot. It seems as if she cared for her ex a great deal and she probably never fully dealt with the break-up. I think that, while she genuinely cares for you, it's best for you both to get some breathing room. Relationships need time to heal and people need to really understand each other before trying to start all over again. You know what I mean?
I think that you guys keep going on and off because even though you have these problems, you genuinely care for each other and want to be together. My advice (that even I'm trying to follow through on) is to spend some time apart and get some perspective. After spending some time apart, who knows? That could be for the best.

I believe things happen for a reason. Whether you guys will work out or just end up as friends, I wish the best for you! I hope I be of some help.

Good luck!

[RdHrshyKss]

i've been through these kind of feelings. where i've been stressed out by other things, and my relationship was something i took for granted and put on the backburner. wishful thinking i guess you could call it like Take mentioned. but when my bf would approach me and point out how wrong i was in the relationship too, it would just make me feel horrible...first reaction would be to defend myself, or blame other things for my faults. i'm not saying this because i think it's right...because i don't at all. i think it's completely selfish in a way, and is just prolonging the strain. it took me awhile to mature enough to see the errors in my ways.

and i agree with trouble_sleepin in getting breathing room. sounds like things are just a little too hot and heavy in the tension department for either of you to be able to approach things the right way. sounds like she has some issues that she needs to work on before she can add on the pressures of a relationship. and the same to you.

[trouble_sleepin]

i've been through these kind of feelings. where i've been stressed out by other things, and my relationship was something i took for granted and put on the backburner. wishful thinking i guess you could call it like Take mentioned. but when my bf would approach me and point out how wrong i was in the relationship too, it would just make me feel horrible...first reaction would be to defend myself, or blame other things for my faults. i'm not saying this because i think it's right...because i don't at all. i think it's completely selfish in a way, and is just prolonging the strain. it took me awhile to mature enough to see the errors in my ways.

and i agree with trouble_sleepin in getting breathing room. sounds like things are just a little too hot and heavy in the tension department for either of you to be able to approach things the right way. sounds like she has some issues that she needs to work on before she can add on the pressures of a relationship. and the same to you.

Well said!

[jdog]

Thanks for all the replies guys, really appreciate the help.

her statement that she is not worried about your relationship may be wishful thinking on her part rather than reality. You telling her that her feelings are wrong is not exactly likely to encourage her to open up more about conflicting emotions she might be feeling right now.

Well she did say that she IS worried but she puts it to the back of her mind...but why put our relationship to the back of her mind and not the other things? Again, it looks like it's because the other things are more important to her.

I never said her feelings are wrong, I simply said to her that it seems that she cares less about our relationship than what her ex thought of her...in fact I sent her a text saying "I'm not trying to make you feel bad and Im not blaming you for how you feel since emotions are uncontrollable. If you are more concerned about your ex than our relationship then I am not blaming you for this. I am simply asking for the truth either way...and if you do still care about our relationship then just reassure me by explaining why you are able to put it out of your mind but not other worries that you have."

Have you told her what you need and why in a non-confrontational way? "Please reassure me that your response doesn't mean you don't care about us at all. When you say things like X, it really hurts my pride."

when my bf would approach me and point out how wrong i was in the relationship too, it would just make me feel horrible...first reaction would be to defend myself, or blame other things for my faults.

I started off talking to her calmly just saying that I was worried that she didnt care after her comment that she isnt worried about our relationship. But as soon as I start talking about it she says things like "you always have to make it about you" or "you know how bad your making me feel. You know I already am upset"....

I just feel that If she cared about my feeling then she would not say things like this...I'm genuinly worried that she doesnt care and she just dodges the question and makes out like I'm being a selfish pain in the ass for saying anything....I'm sorry but all it takes is some reassurance and for her to explain why I am wrong in thinking that she doesn't care...If it was a simple misunderstanding then she should clear this up straight away. Letter it linger around in my mind if it isn't true is cruel tbh. She acts like she doesnt have to think about anyone elses feeling cos she just found out that her ex from over a year ago is back with his ex...

If I was worried about something else that didnt relate to her or that she couldnt fix then I wouldnt even mention it to her at this time because I know she needs my support...but this is about the most important thing you can ask your girlfriend/boyfriend ("do you care about our relationship"), and all it takes is for her to reassure me and my worry is gone...plus she was the one that made me feel that she didnt care so if there was a misunderstanding I think its only fair that she clear this up now rather than let me suffer because she is upset about something else.

And yes, you may be wrong about the emotional response thing. Emotions are not always cut and dry, not always predictable, not always logical. What we think about something is not always what we feel about something. And sometimes thing B that happens triggers feelings about some other thing X, Y and Z and intensifies the response.

i'm finding it really hard to grasp this....I mean you can tell how much something bothers someone by their reaction...if they cry or if they are just sad, or if they go into a depression for months....I mean come on.

She is so upset about her ex that it's like the world has ended..she said that she thought about killing herself although she would never do it...To me that says that she cares a lot about what her ex thought/thinks.

About our relationship she simply said "i'm not worried", even tho our relationship is on the rocks....to me that says she doesnt care that much about it...

Jonny

[Take2]

Honestly to me it sounds like you are looking for a reason to be butt-hurt about her emotional response. I am telling you that sometimes emotional responses don't make logical sense or reflect what we think is important...thinking and feeling are two different things. If you are determined to read into it, then go ahead. But you can expect to run into issues like this time and again as long as you cling to the belief that your mate's emotional responses have to make sense to you and have to mean what you think they should mean. Have you really never had an emotional response that didn't make sense to you?

Also, you say that if she cared about your feelings she would tend to them. But she has told you that she feels the same way about how you are acting, and you don't seem to care. She feels that if you cared about her feelings, you would not say things she has told you make her feel worse. Why is it her job to comfort you, and not your job to comfort her? It doesn't really matter, if she is asking for more than you have to give, you have the right to call it quits. And vice versa.

[RdHrshyKss]

I never said her feelings are wrong, I simply said to her that it seems that she cares less about our relationship than what her ex thought of her...in fact I sent her a text saying "I'm not trying to make you feel bad and Im not blaming you for how you feel since emotions are uncontrollable. If you are more concerned about your ex than our relationship then I am not blaming you for this. I am simply asking for the truth either way...and if you do still care about our relationship then just reassure me by explaining why you are able to put it out of your mind but not other worries that you have."

what i feel might be happening is that by you pointing that out to her.. it's making her realize on her own that what she's doing is wrong, which makes her think negatively of herself (in addition to all the other things you mention are making her feel bad about herself, like the ex). you don't even have to say it to her directly, she'll convince herself that you are implying it. her way of coping with that is to push it out of her mind and try forcing herself to forget about it. irrational behavior. "maybe if i forget about it, it'll go away".

I started off talking to her calmly just saying that I was worried that she didnt care after her comment that she isnt worried about our relationship. But as soon as I start talking about it she says things like "you always have to make it about you" or "you know how bad your making me feel. You know I already am upset"....

I just feel that If she cared about my feeling then she would not say things like this...I'm genuinly worried that she doesnt care and she just dodges the question and makes out like I'm being a selfish pain in the ass for saying anything....

this is her stubborn way of projecting things onto you to cope with the stress...the stress of you bringing up things she KNOWS are wrong in the relationship. she deflects some of the fault onto you...convincing herself that you are "being a pain in the ass" about it. like you are being too demanding of her. that's how she excuses her behavior in her mind. she might still care about you, but she's only thinking about herself in these moments.

I'm sorry but all it takes is some reassurance and for her to explain why I am wrong in thinking that she doesn't care...If it was a simple misunderstanding then she should clear this up straight away. Letter it linger around in my mind if it isn't true is cruel tbh. She acts like she doesnt have to think about anyone elses feeling cos she just found out that her ex from over a year ago is back with his ex...

i just keep coming back to the point where i feel she has way too many personal issues that are preventing her from being able to put the energy necessary into a relationship. why is she concerning herself so much with this ex? 4.5 years is a really long time to be holding onto an old fling. i've been dating my current bf for over 4 years. i had a serious relationship before him to someone that i had even contemplated marrying. but my feelings for him are gone. i don't think about him anymore, as i'm sure he doesn't think of me. as a matter of fact, he just got engaged recently (we have mutual friends and i randomly found out). it doesn't bother me one bit...i respect him and hope he has a happy life with her. i've let go of whatever failure i might have felt when that relationship ended. it ended for a reason.

i feel like she is concerning herself with things outside of your relationship too much that point out faults in herself. she looks for things that might validate the low things she already believes of herself and dwells on them. to the point where she is neglecting the good things she has.

If I was worried about something else that didnt relate to her or that she couldnt fix then I wouldnt even mention it to her at this time because I know she needs my support...but this is about the most important thing you can ask your girlfriend/boyfriend ("do you care about our relationship"), and all it takes is for her to reassure me and my worry is gone...plus she was the one that made me feel that she didnt care so if there was a misunderstanding I think its only fair that she clear this up now rather than let me suffer because she is upset about something else.

maybe you should open up to her about some of the issues you are having as well...that don't involve her. communication is really important. and if you are only really having serious discussions when they are about her and what she is or isn't doing that bothers you...she is going to think that your only issues are with her. if you open up about what's going on with you, she won't feel like she's on the spot all the time.

that's how i felt in my relationship. my boyfriend would only really want to have serious discussions with me when it was when i was doing something that bothered him, or to point out my flawed way of thinking. it can be really draining sometimes. sometimes i want to hear that he isn't perfect and has some of his own issues he needs to talk about...and look to ME to support HIM.

and i still feel like you are only looking at what's going on from your own perspective and are being a bit selfish too (although i understand where you are coming from...4.5 years is a long time for habits like this to become difficult to get away from). try really hard to think from her perspective. you aren't going to get anywhere if you keep pointing fingers back at her. yes, she has issues, and she probably shouldn't be in a relationship until she can get them under control and be a little more self-aware. but you concentrating on the things you feel she is doing wrong, and not the things that you might be doing to make the lack of communication worse, is preventing you from really getting anywhere. it's just creating a vicious cycle.

i'm finding it really hard to grasp this....I mean you can tell how much something bothers someone by their reaction...if they cry or if they are just sad, or if they go into a depression for months....I mean come on.

She is so upset about her ex that it's like the world has ended..she said that she thought about killing herself although she would never do it...To me that says that she cares a lot about what her ex thought/thinks.

About our relationship she simply said "i'm not worried", even tho our relationship is on the rocks....to me that says she doesnt care that much about it...

i don't think she doesn't care. i just think that she's put it on the backburner. she's taking it for granted. and you don't have to accept that. in fact, you shouldn't. you are equally in this relationship and she needs to understand that you have wants and needs too, it's not all about her all the time (and it's equally not always about you either). it sounds like she is just not capable of giving you what you want right now. either she had strong feelings for this guy, or she has a pretty debilitating case of depression that she needs to seek help for. you can only go so far of trying, you know? again, i think what trouble_sleepin said makes a lot of sense. you would both probably get a lot of good from taking a breather. give yourself some space to allow her to go out and seek some help and figure her shit out. and give you some time away from all of that to get a clearer perspective for yourself.

but it sounds like this has happened a bunch of times already and i'm thinking that your history might just mean you aren't compatible. you care about each other, but it just isn't enough to make it work. it can be very difficult to find a balance when two people have enough issues of their own to deal with.

[RdHrshyKss]

wow i feel like Take pretty much summarized what i was thinking in about 1/100th of the amount of words hahaha. i'm such a rambler...