Am I passive aggressive?

[chipottle]

Hi everyone, this is my first post on here, hope someone can help. I'm having some relationship difficulties at the moment which I think might (or might not) be terminal - the whole thing is pretty much going down the pan - and its got to the point where I would leave in a heartbeat were it not for our two wonderful children.

I will try to be honest. I frequently respond to what I perceive to be poor treatment from my wife (which are largely matters of disrespect, contempt for my feelings or not putting as much effort into our shared domestic workload) with anger and silence. I also feel a need to be apologised to (which never happens) - and this seems to escalate things. The trouble for me is that when I find myself in that frame of mind (in response to whatever triggering incident), I withdraw for sometimes considerable periods of time. My wife thinks I do this to punish her and that I'm passive aggressive but I'm not sure I am (she bought me a book about it - it really pissed me off!!!).

My feeling is that passive aggression is pre-meditated behaviour to achieve some sort of goal whereas my frame of mind in that situation is more akin with feelings of anger, hopelessness, frustration and despair. I'm no psychologist, but is it possible that becoming withdrawn as a result of being hurt by the actions (or inactions) of someone is not being passive aggressive but is in fact a protective response to guard against a more immediate (and potentially relationship ending) verbal response? In a nutshell, is tongue-biting passive aggression?

Am I passive aggressive?

[HeartIsAching]

Yes, you're passive-aggressive.

You're lapsing into angry silence and expecting her to know:

1) Something is wrong.
2) What exactly IS wrong.
3) What you expect her to do about it.
4) Why you feel you're justified in punishing her with your silence.

...all without communicating your wants and needs to her.

I suggest you start trying to use "I statements" in your future communications. http://www.humanpotentialcenter.org/Articles/IStatements.html

And some couples counseling wouldn't be off base.

[IndiReloaded]

My feeling is that passive aggression is pre-meditated behaviour to achieve some sort of goal whereas my frame of mind in that situation is more akin with feelings of anger, hopelessness, frustration and despair. I'm no psychologist, but is it possible that becoming withdrawn as a result of being hurt by the actions (or inactions) of someone is not being passive aggressive but is in fact a protective response to guard against a more immediate (and potentially relationship ending) verbal response? In a nutshell, is tongue-biting passive aggression?

Am I passive aggressive?

Bump for HIA, who knows more about how to overcome this than I. But that said, my ex was very PA, so I can relate to your post somewhat.

Passive aggressive men (mostly men) have problems dealing with anger, conflict or negative emotions in a direct manner. Most of them grew up in high-conflict or conflict-avoidant homes. Signs of being PA are: inability or difficulty expressing directly what is bothering you, denying there is a problem, guilting or avoiding your partner or others when they bring up an issue or conflict arises, and engaging in behaviours to 'stick it to them' in very covert, stealthy ways.

Withdrawl by itself can be an appropriate response but if you find you are still avoiding the issue, then yes, you may be PA.

Hope this helps.

[HeartIsAching]

LOL, beat ya to it!

[IndiReloaded]

Great, now I'm off the hook. Correct me if I got anything wrong, please.

[HeartIsAching]

Nah, you did mostly ok. Only thing I saw was that you say "mostly men", when PA crap is pretty universal.

[CoolStoryBro]

Cock-fest, yawn.

[chipottle]

Thanks for the replies. Please bear with me - I'm trying to be objective about this and remain open to the prospect of being confronted with an uncomfortable truth. However, I have to say I'm not yet entirely convinced, and I have a sense that PA is wrongly used to categorise and oversimplify behaviours whose motives are not as self-centred as PA seems to be.

Not sure if the following helps to elaborate on the particulars of my situation, but does anything change about my diagnosis if I say I have communicated my wants and needs and have found them (consistently) disregarded to the extent that I frequently find myself in a state of emotional exhaustion? And I really don't think I'm punishing her with my silence - the state of mind is more akin to a need to remove myself from her which is rarely possible in a physical sense. Now I come to think about it, I guess I want to leave and never return, but am trapped because I can't abandon the children. Where else is there to go? I feel like a POW with no hope of repatriation.

[IndiReloaded]

Thanks for the replies. Please bear with me - I'm trying to be objective about this and remain open to the prospect of being confronted with an uncomfortable truth. However, I have to say I'm not yet entirely convinced, and I have a sense that PA is wrongly used to categorise and oversimplify behaviours whose motives are not as self-centred as PA seems to be.

Honestly, this^ makes you sound like an emotionally detached jerk. Are you? I would find you very irritating if you were my H. Who cares about the label? Yes, 2 people here who don't even really know you say you sound PA. We aren't going to convince you of it. Either you are doing things that hurt your wife or you aren't. She says you are, so you need to own that. The next part is whether you actually care enough to do anything about it.

does anything change about my diagnosis if I say I have communicated my wants and needs and have found them (consistently) disregarded to the extent that I frequently find myself in a state of emotional exhaustion? And I really don't think I'm punishing her with my silence - the state of mind is more akin to a need to remove myself from her which is rarely possible in a physical sense.

How have you communicated your needs? Based on your previous posts, I bet you only *think* you have, but if we asked your wife she would say you haven't. By the way, if your "need" is to be 'left alone' then that's not fair to your wife. Let's do an empathy check: if you had to describe your wife's major issues with you, what are they?

I guess I want to leave and never return, but am trapped because I can't abandon the children. Where else is there to go? I feel like a POW with no hope of repatriation.

I bet you've never told her this either, in a polite respectful way that acknowledges her feelings. I suspect you want to leave, again, so that you can be 'left alone' and not have to deal with those uncomfortable issues your wife is raising. If you don't like the term PA, then here's another for you: emotionally avoidant. Do you have problems with conflict? Were you bullied as a child? Do you have some socialization issues?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avoidant_personality_disorder

The key to sorting out your marriage, assuming you want to, is to acknowledge your issues, discuss them with your wife, discuss *how your issues affects HER needs and feelings*--this part is IMPORTANT--and then figure out how to interact so you both feel good.

If you can't do this, then yes you should end your marriage for everyone's sake. But realize you will have these same problems with your next partner, and your wife has invested a lot in you and your relationship. Plus, your children will benefit from seeing how you manage your issues together. Good luck.

[IndiReloaded]

One other point about all this. There are plenty of people with the type of personality you describe who function just fine. Many are far worse, outright selfish, abusive, even sociopathic, and they manage. You have to want to improve for yourself. "Personal improvement" isn't a requirement for anyone and its just that: personal. So before you over think this, check your navel and decide if you really have a problem with yourself, or if its just your wife's nagging that is getting to you. Even if you are passive-aggressive, so what? If you are fundamentally happy with who you are, then don't bother trying to make changes b/c you'll only end up making everyone miserable. Just end your marriage fairly and move on. Find someone who isn't bothered by your more detached personality.

[Cerby]

I hate to push really old books, but about a year ago I read the "Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus" book that was updated for the 21st century. It addresses how to communicate in a relationship, which is an area you are clearly lacking in.

[IndiReloaded]

Not to be too contrary, but I never thought MMWV was a terribly good book. I don't think it resonates for people like the OP (it didn't with my ex). Plus that whole Mastadon dinner thing is just silly.

For a book recommendation, I would suggest Scott Halzman's book "Secrets of Happily Married Men".
http://www.secretsofmarriedmen.com/aboutbook.html

The POV is rather different than a typical self-help book and its written in a way that resonates with men, without making them feel emasculated, which a lot of these books tend to do. The trouble with the PA/EA types is that their behaviour is often mixed with strong ideas about how "men" behave, and most of these self-help books cater to a more female/emotional POV. SOFMM is quite different in its approach.

I even bought a copy for my ex should he ever pull his head out of his ass and start counselling.

[HeartIsAching]

Not to be too contrary, but I never thought MMWV was a terribly good book. I don't think it resonates for people like the OP (it didn't with my ex). Plus that whole Mastadon dinner thing is just silly.

For a book recommendation, I would suggest Scott Halzman's book "Secrets of Happily Married Men".
http://www.secretsofmarriedmen.com/aboutbook.html

The POV is rather different than a typical self-help book and its written in a way that resonates with men, without making them feel emasculated, which a lot of these books tend to do. The trouble with the PA/EA types is that their behaviour is often mixed with strong ideas about how "men" behave, and most of these self-help books cater to a more female/emotional POV. SOFMM is quite different in its approach.

I even bought a copy for my ex should he ever pull his head out of his ass and start counselling.

Oh, go ahead and be contrary - especially when you know you're right. MMWV is rubbish. I read it years ago and I had exactly the reaction you're talking about. I thought it was feminist crap that had nothing to do with me.

I'll have to try out SHMM... though I suspect I know the secrets now.

[CoolStoryBro]

HIA in kissing Indi's ass shocker. I hope thegaymod bans you both for making him look a twat.

[Wakeup]

Hi everyone, this is my first post on here, hope someone can help. I'm having some relationship difficulties at the moment which I think might (or might not) be terminal - the whole thing is pretty much going down the pan - and its got to the point where I would leave in a heartbeat were it not for our two wonderful children.

I will try to be honest. I frequently respond to what I perceive to be poor treatment from my wife (which are largely matters of disrespect, contempt for my feelings or not putting as much effort into our shared domestic workload) with anger and silence. I also feel a need to be apologised to (which never happens) - and this seems to escalate things. The trouble for me is that when I find myself in that frame of mind (in response to whatever triggering incident), I withdraw for sometimes considerable periods of time. My wife thinks I do this to punish her and that I'm passive aggressive but I'm not sure I am (she bought me a book about it - it really pissed me off!!!).

My feeling is that passive aggression is pre-meditated behaviour to achieve some sort of goal whereas my frame of mind in that situation is more akin with feelings of anger, hopelessness, frustration and despair. I'm no psychologist, but is it possible that becoming withdrawn as a result of being hurt by the actions (or inactions) of someone is not being passive aggressive but is in fact a protective response to guard against a more immediate (and potentially relationship ending) verbal response? In a nutshell, is tongue-biting passive aggression?

Am I passive aggressive?

Chip: Does is really matter if you are or you are'nt PA? The bottomline here is that your marriage is an unhappy one where your wife can quite easily let her dissatisfaction with you be known in no uncertain terms. This belittling and agression makes you retreat. That's the pattern that you both have to work on changing up. Councelling would be a good thing for the two of you to seriously consider but I think first, you have to convince your wife and more importantly, yourself that this marriage can be saved. You sound like you've given up (no wonder if she's bitching at you all the time and you never resolve a thing).

Do you think your wife would read a book with you that might help you to get your emotional connection back so that you're at least prepared and both willing to make this marriage a happy one before you go to councelling? No sense going if you're basically in a state of total dislike with one another.

Anyway.. the book I recommend is "Getting the Love You Want." Read it as a couple.

The newer version of Men Are From Mars ... well, it wouldn't hurt to read that one either.. Particularily for your wife so that she understands your need to "cave" sometimes. Any book that will help you two to reconnect and learn the art of conflict resolution wouldn't hurt.

You staying there while your children watch how you two DON'T get along is not a good reason to not leave either. Do your proactive best to learn how to resolve issues with your wife's co-operation and if you cant ever resolve, even after asking her to help you get back to a happy state with one another while working together to undo bad habits, then stop thinking you have to be a POW. You can still love your kids and live in a different house from them while they enjoy calm and loving visitations that are scheduled via mutual agreement and decree.