Finished, or not? You decide.........

[clarabellew]

Not a particularly length thread, but would really appreciate your thoughts.

In a nutshell, I'm married, but my husband separated from me and moved out of our home in October. At the moment, we don't know what the future holds; I want to try and resolve our problems and make the marriage work (BUT wouldn't fall apart if that didn't happen), he is unsure and currently says he needs time and needs to sort his own head out. I wanted to put the current factors to you to see if you thought it was definitely over, or if he may in time consider coming back and trying to resolve things..

So...

He's moved out of our matrimonal home and is renting a house.
He has stopped paying half of my mortgage (I bought the home in my name).
He has our daughter three nights a week (so she is with me with me for the greater amount of four).

He still pays half of the monthly payments on a loan I took out for us both.
He still pays my TV Licence.
He still has the majority of his post sent to my house.
He still has a lot of his belongings at my house (and has not asked to collect them).
He is still registered and actively visiting my local doctors (instead of registering at one closer to where he is currently living).
He has sought legal advice regarding divorce but has not pursued this, as yet (although threatened it over a month ago).
He has not put his relationship on Facebook as single or separated.
He has not removed any of the photos of me, us or our wedding last year from Facebook.
He very often enquires with my Mum as to what I'm doing, where I go, who with, etc.
He will not say that he no longer loves me.
He wants as few people as absolutely possible to know.
We are now starting to get along with each other quite well, better than we have in a while.

So, what do you think?

[michelle23]

I think as long as you keep waiting, hoping, clinging on and having sex with him-he has all the power.

Be civil, polite and only talk to him regarding your daughter. Stop waiting and get on with your life. If he comes back-you tell him its all or nothing and don't let him worm his way back in so easily. If he really wants you-he will chase you. You have already chased him for long enough and he thinks you'll always be there when he feels like a quick shag or if he makes up his mind and decides there's nobody else better for him out there. Your husband is playing you and your letting him.

Are you sure hes not seeing someone else?

[clarabellew]

I'm not having sex with him now, nor letting him come to the house, or stay over, etc. You're right, he has got to do the chasing, and a lot would have to change from his side too. I don't even contact him any more, unless I have to. I am getting on with my life, and he can see that, which he doesn't overly like.

I'm pretty certain that there is no one else involved. Right now, he is not a happy person; surely he would be if he had met someone else? Also, he's kind of let himself go a bit at the moment, again, surely he would be trying to look good for a new interest? And if he had met someone else, would he not be doing more to finalise us being over? Like, collect his stuff, stop paying things he doesn't have to, etc.?

I just wondered what everyone's thoughts are on the list of fors and against, so to speak, in my original post?

[michelle23]

I meant are you sure he didn't meet someone else around the time he left you. Its crazy that he walked out after a year of marriage and a young child without trying to make it work. Most men would not give up that easily. They would fight to save what they have even if it means marriage counselling (which many men are terrified of)

I think you are doing the right thing. Stay strong and let him do what he likes. I think too much has happened really and I don't think he would have moved out for a whole year if he was planning to come back.

But he may in time realize it was a mistake.

You could tell him you are going to start divorce proceedings coz if he doesn't want you-you will find someone else who does. If that doesn't shock him into making changes, nothing will and you will know then you are fighting a losing battle.

You need to put you first. I know its hard to let go especially with a child involved but you have to be strong and do what is best for you coz staying in limbo not knowing whether you are coming or going is stressful and you wont really start to grieve the loss until you can accept its really over.

[bearz]

He's had time since October. How much more time does he need? 5 months should be plenty of time don't you think? Especially when you are married and have a child. I don't think he realizes how much is actually at stake and how unfair it is to you and your daughter to just let you wait around. It shouldn't take that long for him to figure all of this out. You definitely have to take the next step because he clearly won't.

[Boisdevie]

So, what do you think?

It's irrelevant what I think. What do YOU want?

[basilandthyme]

I'd rattle the cage a bit if I were you. He says he doesn't want people to know and hasn't mentioned it on Facebook. Are YOU happy keeping this charade up? If not, I'd stop going along with all the things he wants.

Change your FB status to 'single'. Something as small as this may trigger him into making a decision either way.

[clarabellew]

He wasn't seeing anyone prior to or around the time of leaving, I'm almost 100% sure of that. We lived together and work together (so travelled together), so there was no time that was ever questionable as to where he was or what he was doing. We always went to bed together and I could always see what he was doing on our laptop, etc. There were a number of things that pushed him almost to the point of a breakdown when he left, including the anniversary of his Mum's death, and stresses at work, and I think it tipped him over the edge and he lashed out at me. I know it was wrong and unfair on me, but things like that aren't always right, or black and white.

In terms of rattling his cage, I have kind of tried this already. About 6 weeks ago, I gave him an ultimatum - if I didn't heard from him within 24 hours to look at sorting things out (note, not come back and all is forgiven), then I would start divorce proceedings. It did not go down well. He does not react well to either being pushed (especially when he has already said he needs time to sort his head out) or to ultimatums - he detests ultimatums. My Mum managed to have a chat with him about it all and all he would say was that he needs to sort out his issues in his head, he will not be pushed into anything and will not be given ultimatums. He did not say there was no chance of sorting things out.

I think, if the issues were solely about me and our relationship, it would be much easier to stand my ground and walk away. But right now, he''s in a very fragile state due to other issues and I do feel he needs to work through them, and that there's only him that can do that. I know it shouldn't be like that, and it's not my fault, but there you go...

I just think, given the list of things in my original post, it just doesn't seem like he's sure it's over?

[michelle23]

I'm curious to no did all this happen too fast. How long were you together before you were married, living together, with a kid?

The thing is that all these issues hes having should bring you both closer. If you cant lean on each other during tough times-that is a very bad sign and normally means the relationship wont last. I get that he is going through a lot right now but that is life and shit happens. Dealing with it by pushing your spouse away is destructive and only complicates life further.

Its the hard times that show you how strong you are as a couple and how strong an individual he is/you are. If his response to difficult situations is to run away and hide in a shell and block everything out coz he cant handle it-then I would question whether he is really "husband and father material".

If you are committed to spending your life together and want to spend a lifetime as a couple (20, 30, 40years) then you have to expect rough patches, a few crisis's, difficult situations, child birth and rearing getting in the way sometimes, family illnesses, bereavement, work or financial difficulties etc.. The whole point of marriage is dealing with all life's crap as a team and being there for each other and not taking the easy way out.

If he cannot do that-then I think you should find yourself a stronger man who can.

[clarabellew]

We met in September 2009, started living together part time in April 2010, moved in fully when I bought our home in July 2011, had our daughter Madison in August 2011, got married in October 2011. I guess a lot of it happened in quick succession, but it seemed very right at the time.

I guess my husband, Neil, is a pretty complicated guy; I've certainly never met anyone like him. He's a very very giving and caring person. He (until recently) did a lot of volunteering work with an organisation called the Samaritans (they are a listening service for people in need that want to talk about their problems). He tries so hard to look after everyone else, except himself. He's always there for people to turn to for help and if he could, he would be the person that would take someone's pain away from them, suffer it so that they don't have to, if you see what I mean. I guess though every now and then, he hurts too, and this hurt comes to the surface and he doesn't know what to do with it. He has a surprising complete lack of self worth; in his eyes, he isn't worthy of anything in his life. That's why I know that something is really not right with him; he's just not that person at the moment. He has suffered from depression in the past, he has had a problem with alcohol and he has threatened and/or tried suicide (not whilst with me).

He's had this week off work as annual leave. On my route to/on and from/off campus, I can see the house where he's living. So when I've gone into work, gone off campus at lunch times and gone home at night, I have noticed he's been at the house every time. So, in other words, he hasn't got much of a social life if he's been at the house all week and not gone out much. Perhaps he's spending a lot of time at thinking about things? I don't know.

I also forgot to mention, when my Mum was talking to him, as well as saying we are getting along better but he won't be pushed and still has things to work through in his head, he also said that he gets scared now because whenever we do start to get closer, I start to really put the pressure on. How do I get round that one? At the moment, I am leaving well alone. But if that is the case, how can I encourage contact and start to try to bring us closer together again without him feeling I'm putting on the pressure and getting scared? Is it just going to take longer and be a more gradual process? (During which I will be living my life and doing what makes me happy!)

[Cerby]

What finally made him leave? What was his reason for moving out? People go through stress all the time, but to move away from someone you love means that something happened between you two. What AREN'T you telling us? In your 4 posts you talk alot about other things, but not about the actual event that resulted in him leaving.

[clarabellew]

It was an argument about getting a sofa through a doorway. He got nasty cause he insisted it wouldn't fit, I tried to be calm and reasonable and say it must go through somehow as it came in that way in the first place. Throughout the evening, it escalated, we both started starting nasty things. He threatened to go, I didn't react to it, so he started packing a bag and said if I didn't stop him and let him walk out of the door he wouldn't come back. Me being head strong, as is he, remained stubborn and didn't stop him. It was just an argument that got out of hand. Like I said before, under normal circumtances perhaps it wouldn't have happened, or at least he'd have come back (he did once before), but the stress he was under I think caused him to just snap.

[searock]

It was an argument about getting a sofa through a doorway. He got nasty cause he insisted it wouldn't fit, I tried to be calm and reasonable and say it must go through somehow as it came in that way in the first place. Throughout the evening, it escalated, we both started starting nasty things. He threatened to go, I didn't react to it, so he started packing a bag and said if I didn't stop him and let him walk out of the door he wouldn't come back. Me being head strong, as is he, remained stubborn and didn't stop him. It was just an argument that got out of hand. Like I said before, under normal circumtances perhaps it wouldn't have happened, or at least he'd have come back (he did once before), but the stress he was under I think caused him to just snap.

This argument was the straw that broke the camel's back, but what happened *before* it? Surely he can't have moved out from his wife and child's house just because of one petty argument. There have to be underlying issues that you aren't talking about for some reason.

[clarabellew]

I guess so. We are both very head strong people. Although we were generally a very normal and happy couple, we did sometimes argue and fight (nothing physical); sometimes it's been my fault, sometimes his. I can't imagine that it was that bad for him, as surely he'd have left before then, or at least brought it up in a serious manner? There have been occasions (not many though) where one of us has stormed off out of the house, but have always come back a few hours later. We'd talk about it and resolve it. He feels though that he was always the one that had to apologise and come to me to make up; that wasn't the case and I have tried to remind him of times when I made the first move. But regardless, I did then acknowledge, right or wrong, that he felt like that and so made more of an effort to make the first move going forward.

When he left in October, he said that I didn't treat him with respect, took him for granted and spoke to him like dirt. Again, looking back, perhaps I wasn't perfect in that respect, and I have been trying over the last couple of months to rectify that, although it's difficult given his somewhat fragile state of mind. I think the difference is, in the past, only once or twice and at the end of an argument, he has said this and I have told him I will change purely to tell him what he wants to hears to smooth the situation over. I have been honest and admitted this to him, and I have tried to assure him that that won't happen again because I have truly learnt from it.

I have been working hard at making myself a better person, but, whilst he knows this and we are starting to get on better, I will not tell him that I have changed. By trying to convince him that I've changed, what am I trying to achieve? Telling him would be an attempt to get him to come back (because I have changed) and that's about me, what I want, not him or what he wants. It would be selfish and would only serve to prove that I haven't changed at all. I think it would be better for him to take the time to see that I'm different; to be certain and trust in that.

I'm sorry, I know I've rambled in this one. :o) It's Friday; I'm tired and at a loss.

[michelle23]

I think a few petty arguments occasionally should not be enough to make him walk out on you and he is blaming you for everything and not accepting any responsibility for any of the issues you had.

It cant be all your fault just like it cant be all his.

I really think its time to move on with your life. You cant force him to come home and it sounds like hes enjoying keeping you at arms length and making you suffer. Its as if he wants you to beg but when you do-hell push you further away. You cant win here and hes holding all the power.

When he says "you come on too strong" that is ridiculous. You are not a bunch of teenagers who just started dating. You are married with a child and he should be willing to do whatever it takes to keep your family together.

I know your finding this whole situation difficult and it must be very upsetting but you cant stay stuck in limbo any longer. Its all or nothing. I think you should ask him to meet you for coffee (somewhere neutral-like a quiet coffee shop) and tell him you cant do this anymore. Its too confusing and you cant wait around forever. Tell him your not giving him an ultimatum and you understand at this point that he doesn't want to come home so you are going to start getting on with your life and your going to try and get over him. Tell him you need a man who is 100% sure about you and it hurts too much that he cant make up his mind so you are going to make up his mind for him. Its over. Tell him you have waited around for long enough and you feel as if you are just not good enough for him so what is the point.

If he really wants you he will fight for you and say please don't do this... If he doesn't try to protest, you need to accept its over and start divorce proceedings.