Well, so much for love.....

[Wakeup]

So basically when it comes to dating, sex, relationships, marriage, involvement. I can't, I won't, I shouldn't.

Great. That's settled then. Next!

[basilandthyme]

I won't take meds. They mask the issue instead of solving it. They don't teach you how to deal with things.

However, you're right. Everything you've said is right. I think that's probably the bulk of my problem. Admitting that these traits are 'problems' has always been tough for me. I never wanted to think of anything I had as being a problem or ailmemt or something that needed fixing.

Even if you choose to be single for the rest of your life, that doesn't mean that you have to be sad and depressed for the rest of your life. There are still so many great facets of life which can be enjoyed.

Meds are your choice. And you can do the work without them. But let me tell you that they can lift the cloud so that you gain sufficient clarity to do the work required to fix the problem. When that dark cloud is down, it's really, really hard to see things objectively.

You're so young and have your whole life in front of you. Don't you think you owe it to yourself to start learning how to have a new outlook and enjoy life? (And I'm a shitload older than you, so give me none of this rubbish about being too old to change)

[pcmaster]

Meds gives that stable good mood that anyone need to function normally in life. Sure you can reach that point without meds but then again they give that extra push. Basically they are best used together with therapy and when you actually do something about your life.If you choose to do nothing but still take meds it still would make life more bearable.

Man you are talking about them like you actually knew something. But here are real people talking who have experience and know difference with them and without them.
The real problem is that you are not ready for change. Often option to be able to change is more appealing to people that the change itself. It looks like you lack energy to change thats why you are not taking people advices. Thats a sign of depression. Lack of motivation might come from lack of positive experiences in life. You might be lacking positive interactions with people. You at least should be able to imagine or see how great your life could be in order to start do something about it. But looks like at this point you just dont believe in your future. I can tell you one thing. Where is life there is hope. That means as long as you are alive there is still hope.

[IndiReloaded]

You seem intelligent. Channel your self-pity and go make yourself a lot of money. Have you seen the women that rich, ugly guys get?

[tampitump]

You seem intelligent. Channel your self-pity and go make yourself a lot of money. Have you seen the women that rich, ugly guys get?

Money and status mean shit to me. I just want enough money to not worry about it. But happiness is much more important to me. Most people long for the day they'll be making big money. I long for the day I'll be fully content with myself and free from depression and worry.

[basilandthyme]

Money and status mean shit to me. I just want enough money to not worry about it. But happiness is much more important to me. Most people long for the day they'll be making big money. I long for the day I'll be fully content with myself and free from depression and worry.

I think you may have missed that Indi was teasing a little

Very few of the people I know long for the day they are making big money. Most are far more concerned with having quality time to spend with friends, family and on personal interests - so you're not that different.

It's good that you long for the day you're free of depression and worry - now go take that first step of seeking professional help.

[tampitump]

There's nothing a "professional" could do for me. Make me guess at those retarded inkblot tests to kill half the session then prescribe pills. I'm sorry, but I just won't take drugs to fix my problems. I'm a bad pill taker anyway. I always forget to take them.

If you think about it, there's nothing a psychologist could actually do for you unless they were able to invisibly watch your every move over the course of one or more years. You can't meet with someone for 30 mins to 1 hour and expect them to know a damn thing about you. For all they know, you could be giving them misguided information. How can they possibly treat you correctly?

Sorry, no meds or therapists for me.

[solarion]

There's nothing a "professional" could do for me. Make me guess at those retarded inkblot tests to kill half the session then prescribe pills. I'm sorry, but I just won't take drugs to fix my problems. I'm a bad pill taker anyway. I always forget to take them.

If you think about it, there's nothing a psychologist could actually do for you unless they were able to invisibly watch your every move over the course of one or more years. You can't meet with someone for 30 mins to 1 hour and expect them to know a damn thing about you. For all they know, you could be giving them misguided information. How can they possibly treat you correctly?

Sorry, no meds or therapists for me.

If you knew what you were talking about then you'd know psychologists cannot prescribe meds, save in very limited circumstances and in very few states. Psychiatrists do that...often wrongly imo.

A skilled therapist/psychologist/psychiatrist can draw accurate conclusions from things you say; do not say; posture; body language; inflection; tone; etc that reveal things about you even when you've no idea you're revealing them. In short, it's not easy to fool a qualified therapist by feeding them data you believe they want to hear, because they're trained to detect it. That's the point actually.

You're going way too far out of your way to convince others you don't need help to be credible. People that are happily wallowing in their misery and have truly given up hope...don't talk about it.

[TheEvilJester]

A lot was said since I was last back here to read this thread, but this part particularly resonated with me:

I don't have the energy to take an interest in my life anymore. I sometimes wonder why people like me are born. I mean really, what's the point of having duds? I guess we have to have losers to know winners, right? I guess that's possibly a way my life has purpose.

I often get to the point where I just don't want to live anymore. I don't want to wake up another day. I just want to lay down, go to sleep, never wake up, and forget this life ever happened.

Trust me. I know just how you feel. I've been there.... many times. I was there recently. Sometimes it can be SO exhausting. Sometimes it can seem so impossible to see the point. I know that from experience. I've learned that for guys like us, I think the point is for us to create our own meaning. In other words, find what helps you to be happy. Find what helps you to keep going on. It won't be easy. There will be good times, and there will be bad times. Life is a frigging roller coaster. Trust me, I know how it can feel to be at your lowest. To feel like your very soul is shredded and bleeding. I know what it can feel like to feel ripped into a million pieces and yet you don't die.

I think the point many of us are trying to make is that you shouldn't have to feel that way. You don't deserve that. Nobody does. You HAVE to find your way to start to dig your way out of that. If you just give up, nothing will get better. I've said this many times in this thread, but I understand that is so much easier said than done. It's the truth, though. If you can't see how to find that on your own, then a professional could possibly help.

I understand your aversion to therapy, but how can you give up on it if you haven't tried it? What if it could help? Equally, I also understand your reluctance to use medication. The thing is, it CAN be a bit of a process, but if you can find the right therapist and/or the right medicine for you, it can be the first step in finally digging yourself out of this horrible abyss. Yes, there are some medicines that will just leave you feeling worse, or will leave you feeling empty instead of making you feel any better. The trick is finding the right medication. Any good therapist won't just hurl medication at you, but they will help you to learn which actually works for you.

It is possible the medication will only be temporary. Just something to help you get over the general funk of it all so you can begin dealing with the underlying issues. Plus, here's the good news.... All of the things you complain about yourself.... your style of dress, your general physical appearance, your teeth, these things can all be fixed. See a dentist, maybe get braces. That could fix the "overbite" you describe. Find a new more fashionable style of dress that still makes you feel comfortable and feel you, but is perhaps a bit more polished. Get yourself into a gym routine. That actually helped me a little bit recently. I generally feel a little better about myself from it, which becomes a spiraling thing where those good feelings inspire me to do more good things for myself, which inspire more good feelings, which inspire me to do more good things for myself, and so on. That's the same kind of thing you need to do for yourself.

Venting definitely helps, so I think it is good you are allowing yourself somewhere to get your frustrations out. That is a good start. All we are saying is don't give up on yourself. I think it is about time that life OWES you some happiness. So, don't wait for it to happen to you. TAKE it. Again, I've said it a million times over... I know it is easier said than done, but it is worth it.

Good luck to you. I've been where you are. I often feel like I live every day of my life in danger of going back there. But, it is worth it to keep fighting. I didn't deserve to have to suffer through all of that crap, nor would anybody else..... and nor do YOU.

[basilandthyme]

There's nothing a "professional" could do for me. Make me guess at those retarded inkblot tests to kill half the session then prescribe pills. I'm sorry, but I just won't take drugs to fix my problems. I'm a bad pill taker anyway. I always forget to take them.

If you think about it, there's nothing a psychologist could actually do for you unless they were able to invisibly watch your every move over the course of one or more years. You can't meet with someone for 30 mins to 1 hour and expect them to know a damn thing about you. For all they know, you could be giving them misguided information. How can they possibly treat you correctly?

Sorry, no meds or therapists for me.

And this ^^^ attitude is yet another reason no woman will date you.

From your description of a psychologist, it's clear that you have no idea of what a psychologist does. And then you get attitude and mouth off with ill informed assumptions. Are you aware of how belligerent you are appearing?

Here is a link to how a psychologist can help depression. You will notice that ink blots are not on the list.

[url]https://www.beyondblue.org.au/the-facts/depression/treatments-for-depression/psychological-treatments-for-depression[/url]

- - - Updated - - -

And may I add that I am Australian - and I do not recommend therapy lightly. Aussies avoid therapists like the plague...and we are bemused about the therapy culture in the US. But there IS a time and place for getting professional help. And that time and place is when our issues stop us from living as we wish to live.

It's also important to realise that when taking on a psychologist, the first person you see may not be a perfect fit. If this is the case, try another - don't give up.

[tampitump]

I'm not going to go see a therapist. For one, I don't even have the money for that. Two, I already know it will be a waste of my time. Even if they do diagnose my problems and offer a solution, I know myself well enough to know that I'd never follow through with their instructions or get it right. I don't have an attitude, I've just already decided I will NOT go to a therapist. Trust me, I've been suffering from depression and suicidal thoughts for the entitety of my teenage to adult life and not once have I ever had the slightest desire to see a therapist. I'm not going to start now.

What prompted me to create this thread was an experience I had a couple of months ago when I went out with my two best male friends for a night on the town. The whole night they were both getting looks from girls and getting phone numbers from them and everything else. The girls never even noticed me. They were just falling over my friends. I couldn't understand why, I was being sociable and I was dressed nice. I tried my best to be open to talk to them, but interested they weren't in the slightest. My two friends can snap a finger and have girls stuck on them like glue. This is not the first time this has happened to me either, there have been many instances of this very same scenario.

While we were eating dinner my two friends were talking back and forth about the girls they see regulary and were receiving texts from girls left and right and sharing them with each other. So I just kind of lowered my head and sat silent through the whole night. I mean, how can I compete with that? How can I offer anything to this conversation? I don't think a single human female has ever even seen me before.

One time I was at a wedding reception for my friend and I was trying to socialize with a group of people that included two girls and two other guys. I was trying to be outgoing and sociable. When I went to talk, one of the girls threw her hand up in my face and said "please don't" and they all walked off like I had done or said something terrible to them when I DIDN'T! The girl didn't even make eye contact with me. So yeah, this shit happens to me all the time.

For the past 10 months I've lived on my own out of state from where I'm originally from trying to turn my life around. I had a job that was proving to be a waste of time and all efforts to find a girlfriend or even just friends were 110% in vain. So now I'm back here at home living with my parents, jobless. This is where I belong I guess.

[Lilly328]

I can't believe some people can be that rude to throw a hand in your face like that. May I ask what type of atmosphere do you and your friends tend to hang around in? (Clubs, bar, etc) Maybe you were just trying to socialize with the wrong type of people.

[tampitump]

I can't believe some people can be that rude to throw a hand in your face like that. May I ask what type of atmosphere do you and your friends tend to hang around in? (Clubs, bar, etc) Maybe you were just trying to socialize with the wrong type of people.

Just normal gatherings. I don't know how else to decribe them. Definitely not bars or clubs. We went to dinner and the movies on this instance. The town we usually go to is a very popular place on the weekends. People everywhere on the strip no matter what area you're at or what store you're in.

Trust me, it puzzles me to no end. I wonder if sometimes maybe I'm mentally challenged or something and I'm just not seeing what everyone else is seeing/hearing. Or maybe my perception of reality is distorted somehow. I often don't get people, I don't inderstand why they do some of the things they do. It bothers me so much that I prefer to just stay alone and not go near other people. I'm afraid it will trigger all kinds of thoughts and worries.

Believe me, I wouldn't be here typing all this if this whole thing didn't puzzle and bother me so badly.

- - - Updated - - -

I've been ostracized and mistreated by girls and guys alike since childhood. I used to think it was just because of the small country town I lived in. I thought it would all change after high school was over, but wrong I was. I used to not be like this. I used to not think much of it actually. It's only been recently I've become like this. I realize now that there is something wrong with the relationship between myself and the rest of the world, where it started or how it got this way, I have no idea.

[dollhouse]

PeterSC is going to prostitutes so it cant be him. I think She mean Lovereject - YoungCosmio but that guy got slut too and had sex with normal people afterwards too.

This guy says he never kissed a girl.

OP I think you should save up 4 thousands and take on bootcamp. You know there are guys who are helping guys like to to open up socially and increase their change with girls by pushing you and killing your fears and insecurities. 24 is still a young age and you can still turn your life over.
Look up on internet and youtube guys like Sasha Daygame, Kezia Noble, SimplePickup- they have good forum too about pickup. And RSD - Real social dynamics. RSD Tyler and RSD Julien- Julien Blanc.

Basically what you have to do to be good with girls is work on yourself and be as good human being as you can be, be a better man. If you are trying and its not working then you have to stop and look on yourself and try something new. We all do mistakse but most important thing is not to repeat these mistakes.

Okay, thanks, pcmaster for clarifying things regarding the name I mentioned and tmpndmp lol Still see the same traits minus the constant support worker comments, you know more about people here than I.

[basilandthyme]

Trust me, it puzzles me to no end. I wonder if sometimes maybe I'm mentally challenged or something and I'm just not seeing what everyone else is seeing/hearing. Or maybe my perception of reality is distorted somehow. I often don't get people, I don't inderstand why they do some of the things they do. It bothers me so much that I prefer to just stay alone and not go near other people. I'm afraid it will trigger all kinds of thoughts and worries.

Earlier in this thread, someone gave you a self diagnosis link to Autism Spectrum Disorder (ASD). I've been avoiding suggesting it, but after reading this paragraph I strongly suggest you rule out Aspergers (which is on the ASD). What you wrote sounds classically Aspie. And please don't get offended - my son is ASD and my best friend is Aspie.

[url=http://www.betterhealth.vic.gov.au/bhcv2/bhcarticles.nsf/pages/asperger_syndrome_and_adults]Asperger syndrome and adults | Better Health Channel[/url]