Longing to be loved

[Hooo!]

again:
you have no exclusive right to her vagina whatsoever.

Please dont treat sex like its the end of the world or a rare good.

People like intimacy. I see no reason for them not to have it

and i see no reason for you to take it away from other people.


You are very stubborn concerning this. Regarding people who have sex as "unclean"
Thats just wrong. They are just mature about it.

[TheEvilJester]

Again, pc, I definitely understand how you feel. Heck, I agree with you in many ways. I just don't necessarily agree that there is anything wrong with her for having any FWB type relationships, or anything wrong if she treats sex more casually. I don't personally consider sex that casual, and obviously that seems to be one way in which you and I very much agree. But, that doesn't mean we are right and others are wrong. That doesn't mean others are right and we are wrong. That means that is what works for US, whereas other arrangements work for others. To each his/her own.

Personally, I don't think sex should wait for marriage per se.... but I would want my gal and I to at least feel we are in a serious relationship, and that we are both headed towards the same goal, before it does happen. In other words, I don't want to just casually have sex with any woman who will let me.... I want to have it with my GIRLFRIEND. Since I don't have one right now, I'd rather just not have it. So, I most definitely understand your view point on this one.... it's just I can understand hers as well even if I perhaps do not share it.

Frankly, I think you should chalk this up to this probably still not being the right gal for you. It might be different if you two weren't exactly the same in this regard, but were at least close. It sounds to me like your ideals on this are too far apart. I fail to see how that would work for you both, so you may be best just to move on. But, that is, of course, your decision. I do somewhat agree with the notion that perhaps you are putting sex "on a pedestal" a little bit, so it may help you to relax in that nature just a little. There is nothing wrong with thinking it should be special. I agree with you on that. It's just, it doesn't have to be SO special, if you know what I mean. I don't know, I don't quite know how to articulate what I mean on that so hopefully you basically get my jist.

Anyways, just as ANYBODY would, you deserve somebody who will make you happy. If somebody does not seem to match with you in this profound a way, they are probably not going to be that person. You deserve somebody who will make you happy and, frankly, so do they.

Good luck to you either way.

[pcmaster]

Thanks for insights Jester. Hooo I own her pussy cause I paid for the last date.

I see where you going Jester. I been thinking on endings things too. Really first time I been considering it seriously. Ussualy dont even think about it when it comes ti girls.

Anyway I dont give up until things are complety fcked up. Until she responds I wont give up. We still talk on the pho e and chat. I know it takes long time like few months to get lucky a d find a new girl.
Yes might seem that Im in scarecity cause down want to start from ground zero. But I dont give up until I get what I want. Not giving up is absolute key of sucsess. I didnt gave up with previous girl and it e ded with many sweet moments and hours in her bed.

[TheEvilJester]

Not giving up CAN be a good trait to have..... but there are also times when giving up on something is the right course of action. Refusal to give up on a situation that is obviously not going to work is only bringing yourself and others undue pain. Just food for thought. Also, the notion that you "own her" in ANY way is one you really should cease to have. Even when you eventually find "THE one" and get married, you do not OWN her. Nor does she OWN you. You should remain faithful to each other, but you are also still your own individual people. You own your own selves, not each other.

But, instead of talking about "owning" somebody, let's talk about being exclusive.... You've been on two dates with her so far. You shouldn't expect exclusivity at this point, no matter if you paid for the last date or not. The guy paying is just the gentlemanly thing to do, it does not obligate you to anything.

I say this all, PC, as much because I'd like to see you happy. You aren't going to be happy if you waste your time on woman who are so obviously not your right match. I know starting over sucks, but you'll find somebody. I've said this many times on this board, but it applies here too. You'd be better by yourself anyway then you would stuck with the wrong person just so you can have SOMEBODY. Good luck to you.

[pcmaster]

Well thanks for your thoughts Jester. But I want third date. Actually I want to make out properly. 2 times she wanted me to stay night at her place. If those were weekends U would agree. Anyway I want cake before I leave her. I deserve this little piece of untouched cake by me. Too many hours spend talking, too much days spend chatting, too much pictures taken together to leave now without having a desert. Not talking about sex here but about some fun for sure. After all only reason why I first messaged her on tinder was her big boobs. Now when I get to know her better I understand I was right. Its not worth it to complicate things.

Also she have told me cause begining with me was easy cause I didnt wanted anything serious.

[Hooo!]

I own her pussy cause I paid for the last date.

not sure if serious
or just trolling


also you talk about her like she was some thing.
You talk about you at least want to have sex because you have SPEND so much (time money energy...) on her.

Actually that disgusts me a little

women are not just things that you spend your resources on and then you grab em by the pussy(tm)
Woman are beautiful creatures that deserve your attention, your dedication and your time. You can enjoy their company and SHARE some intimacy with each other. They deserve to be seduced and dominated and let go of, because they enjoy it. And making them enjoy your company is half the deal.
Good sex is just a byproduct of that.

If you just want to own a pussy then why not go to a prostitute? There you can buy pussy for small resources, if you want that...
And actually it would help you to get over the notion that sex is so important.
It is important and vital to most any relationship, but outside of that it is not that important.
Its really great yes - and all the better when you share it with someone who is actually feeling something for and with you. But is not something you can or should own.

[TheEvilJester]

Well, as I will often say here, you have to do what feels right to you. So, if you want to continue to pursue it, I just wish you the best of luck. Though, I do agree that you need to forget this notion that she (or any girl) "owes" you anything. Believe me, I can understand and empathize with your frustration. It's just, I don't see why to bother wasting your time with somebody who seems so different from what you are looking to find. She doesn't owe you anything, nor do you owe her anything. If you're not ready for sex, then you shouldn't force yourself. If you are and she's not, then she shouldn't have to either. That goes for really ANYTHING, even just kissing and/or making out.

Again, though, you have to do what you think is right. Within reason, of course. Good luck to you either way.

[pcmaster]

You are right guys. I been thinking about it at work and yeah I kinda been too pushy and direct. Dont want to become like those guys on dating sites who only push for sex and dont give a girl time.

She said shes not ready for kissing. I really want to meet her again. Even if its just a date somewhere in public place. Been to impatient and needy. Should give her space. She said we need a brake. Will let her be the first who message me.

[pcmaster]

So been on a third date today. She picked up me from my home and I gave her a big p white blush bear cause I said I have a valentines day gift for her and we met only now after valentines day. Jesterday we kinda talked about going to sea but today she just drove to a nearby town and we walked in a castle remains. Then I suggested to go to a restaurant to warm up. She took only latte and cheescake. I took a proper meal and couldnt finish it cause it was only breakfast time but it was like real lunch. She again talked about her exes. That made me feel like Im not there as a guy, like she dont see me as a guy but as gay and dont respect my presence.

Anyway back to the point. I tried to held her hand and put my arm around her but she didnt let me and didnt wanted it. That made me feel alone like Im walking with a stranger.
After date I gave her peck on a cheek and left. Then he messaged me - Thanks for a bear but I understood that we can be only friends.

She kinda said that I have no experience at all and she feels with me like with a teenager. That shes not right girl for me. I kinda found out a lot of bad things that I dont like about her either but was willing to give it another date to see more clearly. Still its always the girl who ends it. I dont end things until everything is completly messed up and girl dont responds to me for a while.

So yeah its cool. I dont feel sad or anything. Just a little angry and frustated.

Message another girl today and will see how it goes. Shes working in a local phone store so its only a mile away from my home. Could aswell go and talk to her now cause shes working right now.

[Hooo!]

By being so rigid when it comes towards body contact and sex you are not setting the right frame. It is a straining experience for you. Since women usually have high levels of empathy (meaning they feel a little of what the people around them feel) it becomes straining and difficult for them too.

Also if you do not touch women (because that (in your mind) is something that you only do occasionally, women will know and notice that. Then as it is unusual behavior it gets akward.

While I understand that you are angry and frustrated (and i have been there too!) a girl will also notice that.
Being frustrated is not sexy. If you surpress that - a girl will likely sense something is wrong. This may make things akward again.

At the moment you behave like a tank. You want something? you go there in a straight line at a relatively low speed and then shoot everything you have.
Instead i'd advise you to be like the sun. Just share and give freely.
Give your bodycontact. Share your insecurities and intentions. Treat people with respect. See them naked at the same time.
And enjoy yourself. More important: make them enjoy your company - but also your physical presence.
Dont talk about yourself. Only if you are asked. Instead: be curious about the women. About what they like and want. And about how they want it ;-)
If you dont want a relationship, but only want to literally **** around - then dont hide it. Make her enjoy it and enjoy your presence. If you imagine ****ing her - then look her into the eye while doing so.
Thats nothing to be ashamed about - because you know she will enjoy it.


I am pretty sure that you still have issues with your attitudes towards women - which is the main thing stopping you. It has nothing to do with technique (as in how to approach women or the like)

[TheEvilJester]

That stinks, pc. I am sorry to hear that. I guess the only good thing is at least you found this out now rather than after spending more time with her. As always, good luck to you. I hope you find the right gal for you. I definitely do agree with Hooo that it never hurts to examine things about yourself on which you may want to work to improve. Personal growth is always a great goal. Only, though, if they are things you wish to change about yourself anyway. You should never have to change FOR somebody (within reason, anyway). If you had to change for somebody in order to be right for them, then maybe they weren't right for YOU anyway.

Dating can be very frustrating. It can take a lot of finding the wrong people to finally find the right one. Good luck in your journey.

[pcmaster]

Thanks for responses guys. Last months really been hard for me girls wise. Experience makes it only harder. Im used to get everything free and fast. First girl ruined it cause she was doing everything for me and I didnt had to do anything.
Now I have to do everything and girls dont do anything. Thats how its always been and its so much harder and made things impossible in past. Girls are such a mystery.

Jester indeed seems like thats real dating word. At the begining I realized I got incredibly lucky with first girl. Since then havent had same connection in chat or in bedroom with other girls. It was just so damn good.
I want to improve cause I want higher quality people in my life and have easier times with girls. Dont want to struggle. I say if things with girl is not easy then its not the right girl.

Yeah Hooo It seems like I been rushing too much with touching. Should wait for a better moments in future. Or at least dont touch girl until we are on sofa alone or in bed.

[Hooo!]

Yeah Hooo It seems like I been rushing too much with touching. Should wait for a better moments in future. Or at least dont touch girl until we are on sofa alone or in bed.

NOOOOOOOOO

please read again what i said. Its not that you are rushing.
What would you say if we talked all fine with each other. (no bodycontact). Then i get a little flirty and then i suddenly start beginning to touch you everywhere.
How would you feel?

Thats exactly how women feel about it.

If you are with women you should not be afraid to touch or to let your eyes "linger" a little longer. You should in fact do it ALL the TIME.
The problem is - if you dont do it and then suddenly start with it
its like your best guyfriend suddenly starts gay on you.
And your like "wtf? i didnt see that coming"
And that is part of the problem. A girl subconciously NEEDS to see it coming. Its not that you have to explicitly tell you that you are talking to her to get her into bed and **** her brains out. But it helps if she gets this vibe going. And if shes not interested in that - its fine. But if you turn that vibe on just out of the blue you get that "woha wait a moment. Im sorry but I dont see myself with you in such a way" response.

[pcmaster]

That makes sense Hooo. I really been touching out of the blue. That could be okay with good known girl with who I been making out already but not when theres no intimacy in our history.
So I should hit on girl with words and eyes first and see how she reacts before I touch her with hands.

I remember 5 years ago I was always sitting with this girl in a car when going to work and always touched her but never spoke with her. And she allowed me but had a bad mood after leaving car. Then she got used to me touching her but I started to like her and tried to talk with her. Well that didnt went so well so I stopped touching her cause it didnt felt right when we couldnt even talk normaly.

[Hooo!]

Akwardness comes from
suddenness, (social and other kinds of) inapropriateness, insecurity, unintentionally bringing attention to subliminal processes (better left alone), having secret intentions, having intentions against someone (trying to manipulate against their benefit), hiding thoughts and emotions

What i mean by this is: If you suddenly start talking or touching or communicating to a girl which you have not done so before that is akward. You suddenly change behaviour = unnatural= akward.
If you stand in an elevator in front of a girl - instead of at an angle or at the side that is socially inapropriate = unnatural = akward.
If you feel not sure about something and hesitate this will show itsself in various signs to the outside. Hesitating and insecurity are unnatural = akward.
If you touch her and she doesnt notice conciously thats fine. However if you overdo it and bring her to conciously think about that it will be inapropriate and possibly unnatural and akward.
If you have intentions lets say to talk her into sleeping with you then you are acting against her benefit. Women will notice this and they may possibly feel alarmed about it. That makes you dangerous. Paired with other signals (such as waiting and hesitating) you look like someone who is about to get out the choroform rag = creepy => akward
hiding your own desire or thinking that sex and touch are unnatural "things" and the like will also show => insecurity =>creepy =>akward

There is a difference between flirting and lingering eyecontact VS raping someone with the eyes or staring at them (in a disgusting/akward way)
There is a difference between intentionally touching a person VS it just happening all the time naturally
There is a difference between getting to know a women because you are interested in and fascinated by her VS talking to her because you want to **** her
There is a difference between getting to know a women because you want to **** her VS talking her into having sex with you
There is a difference between being entertaining and thus interesting VS talking about yourself all the time.
There is a difference between making someone enjoy your presence VS enjoying your own presence
There is a difference between enjoying yourself and having a good time VS paying attention if everyone else also enjoys a good time.
There is a difference between paying attention to your conversation partner, thinking about how and why they feel in what way and reality checking that VS just waiting for yourself to talk again.
There is a difference between what you think a thing or a person is like (map) and what they really are like (territory)
There is a difference between the map (model in your mind) and the territory (reality).