Me too...Quote:
Originally Posted by girl68 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
How the heck she can squirm out of this one, I don't know.
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Me too...Quote:
Originally Posted by girl68 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
How the heck she can squirm out of this one, I don't know.
This prove's she is crazy.Quote:
Originally Posted by VincenzoG91 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
Dealing with this issue via texts is what cowards do.
If you want that closure and didn't take to my post: you need to confront her.
She has a right to defend herself even if it sounds like an O.J. type of defense.
She is bringing the keys over tomorrow night and we're going to talk, face-to-face. I promised that I wouldn't be scary if she promised that she would be honest. She said okay.
About the only possible way I could see taking her back is if she showed me a restraining order against this guy because he was some kind of stalker creep. Realistically, I think that she's going to confess and hope that I can forgive her someday.
A friend suggested that I wrote down everything that I want to say and want to ask. I have tried, but I'm so tired right now that I can't focus.
I sincerely hope you don't forgive her... that's exactly how and why she can continue to such such things...
[Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
dedicated to you.
I'll tell you how: he loves her despite what she's done which borders on impossible in his mind.Quote:
Originally Posted by xxazurexx [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
I don't understand how this kind of relationship functions but then again since 05 and up she's possibly been lying to him
and only because he was "told" about it did he stumble upon the truth...He didn't suspect a thing. -Love is blind- I guess?
This is terrible.
I wish you nothing but the best. I couldn't imagine the pain you're feeling. Please contact and talk to us on this forum. We want you to get through this in one peace.
You could probably use a lot of what you already wrote here.Quote:
Originally Posted by VincenzoG91 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
So sorry that happened to you. I don't know what to say.
There was a specific incident in spring of 2004 that set off alarms in my head. She was living with me temporarily at the time while looking for a new apartment, and she came home at 3:30 AM without calling or answering my calls. We had an inconclusive fight, and she promised that she would call next time if she was going to be out late. She said that she was up late cramming for a test with a friend.Quote:
Originally Posted by SelflessnHumble [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
The next night, she did text me to say that she would be out late again, so I called her but got no answer. I tried to sleep, ended up surfing online for some porn, because sometimes an orgasm helps me get to sleep. So, being a reasonably normal guy, I was googling up lesbian porn. You know how firefox defaults to showing you previous internet searches as you are typing in a new search? Instead of lesbian porn sites, my browser was suggesting lesbian dating sites, and several of them were showing a slightly different color, indicating that these sights had been visited recently by my computer. So I poked around in those sites and found Amy's profile on one. It looked remarkably similar to her profile at the heterosexual dating site where we met. I was stunned.
It was really late, like 4 AM, and the only person I knew who would be awake at that hour was my previous girlfriend, who had gotten out of prison just months earlier. We talked for an hour about the situation, and she gave me some okay advice. Then Amy got home, wearing a very short miniskirt and very high heels, reeking of perfume, at 5:30 AM. We had another big fight, and I called her the c-word. However, she happened to have a great alibi. We drove to a nearby hospital, where a half dozen friends of hers were camped out in the waiting room because a friend was in ER. They verified that Amy had been there with them all night.
In hindsight, I think that both things happened. I think that she was out late on lesbian dates, and her friend did end up in the Emergency Room with appendicitis, and Amy rushed to be there. Anyway, the important thing is that I knew that I had trust issues from previous relationship with a criminal, and the ER alibi made me believe that I was being paranoid and that I just needed to trust Amy. So even when there were all kinds of warning signs over the years, I rationalized them away with trust. I never got to see her friends and family anymore, because she's ashamed of the age difference. I never got to visit her at her current apartment this last year, because she was living with her cousin Julia, who never liked me. Big stuff like that. Now I know that she was hiding a whole second life from me.
Bringing the keys tomorrow night to talk? If I was her in this situation, I'd have returned to talk to you much sooner than that and if I was looking to prove my innocence and this is not what it seemed. Gives her time and to think about and to plan some story I guess. If she's lied since you first met, what makes her think you will believe her crap now and why should you? Once they lie, you can't trust another word they say. Don't be too quick to believe what she says.
I absolutely agree. She's lied all this time about so much she probably doesn't even know how to be truthful.
She waited until mid-afternoon to contact me yesterday, and she had a work shift in the evening. And her fiance, if he's still in the picture, probably has a low tolerance for her getting home late these days. So last night wouldn't have worked.
Speaking of the fiance, I'm willing to bet that they still get married. He will tell himself that she chose him, because she turned down my proposal and accepted his. Their new house is nearly finished, and there are wedding arrangements and lots of friends and family who know them as a couple. This momentum will take them to the altar and into marriage. But we all know the saying, once a cheater, always a cheater. And he knows for a fact now that she is a cheater. So the marriage is doomed from the start.
For them, this will just be a typical bad marriage story, nothing we haven't seen before here at LF. I feel like I ducked a bullet, but not really. No, I'm not getting married to a cheating sociopath who will end up with half my stuff after a messy divorce. But I wasted so many years on this deadend relationship. I'm 45, and that's pretty late to start over and still find time for marriage and kids. For medical reasons, my sister can't have kids either, so this is the end of the line for our family line.
VincenzoG91------No it is not too late to start all over again.Quote:
Originally Posted by VincenzoG91 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
She has hurt you now, don't let her ruin your future.
You deserve better.
There was a discussion here last summer, about the meaning of life. I agree with the existentialist notion that everybody has to have their own personal meaning of life. But at this point in my life, mine is a typical one: I want to get married and have kids and raise them to be good people. That's my personal meaning of life, to create more life and to nurture it. But I wasted 13 prime years of my life on two bad women. I will probably waste another few years on relationships sabotaged by paranoia. Then I'm close to 50, and it's just too late in the game to start a family.
For now, the meaning of my life is simpler. The reason I will get up tomorrow is to feed my cat. He's a really nice cat, and he loves me. The idea of him sniffing my dead body saddens me so much that I will force myself to live and get up every morning. The day he dies, I will be staring into an abyss of loneliness. Fortunately, he is a young cat, maybe 3 years old.
It's not too late for you. 45 year old men are in high demand, vincenzo, so long as you are willing to date women >30. Of course, you may have to be tolerant of women who already have kids. You could even date younger, since I seem to remember you having kept yourself in good shape, not that I suggest younger than 30. You are probably tired of having to raise them up.
45 isn't too old nowadays, keep in mind the life expectancy is getting higher and higher, nowadays women having kids int heir 40's isn't that strange, and women have a lot more trouble for that than men do... You just gotta take care of the paranoia and things will work out Vincenzo..
Yeah, I'm a fitness freak. 6'1", 190#, 34" waistline now. I don't have six-pack abs, but otherwise I'm built like a guy who is 20 years younger. I don't think that I could stand to date a young woman again, so 28 would probably be my absolute minimum. I was open to the idea of dating a woman with kids when I was younger, but it seems like that's a weak foundation for a relationship, to start out in second or third place in her affections. I would much rather raise kids that are my kids.
Vince never say never. Maybe you will meet a woman that wonderful ,thay even if she will have some kids on her own, it won't bother you at all. It's not that bad to be with a woman who has kids already. Do divorced women not deserve to get such a cookie like you? :) Well, as long as those kids aren't some freaking little devils, it's fine :) And maybe she will agree to let you install some of your genes in her belly as well LOL :D Or just go and get some hot 30 . Some sexy business woman or something :P
It's true that dealing with other people's children is much more complex, and I don't blame you for your hesitation. Life gets to be more complex as you get a bit older, doesn't it? Still, you have options, even if they are somewhat less ideal than you'd like. Be glad you aren't a woman at your age. it's much harder.Quote:
Originally Posted by VincenzoG91 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
My previous ex-girlfriend had kids, and there was never a moment when I doubted that her kids came first and I was third-place. They were great kids, I hung in there extra years just for their sake, but their mother was too much trouble for me to handle.
Yes, that is as it SHOULD be. It's very hard for people without kids to understand this.Quote:
Originally Posted by VincenzoG91 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
I think the problem you will have is that dating a woman who has kids (and is a good mother) renders your needs as being somewhat less important that theirs, and dating women without kids (in an age-bracket most appropriate for you) means she probably doesn't want any.
Of course, there are exceptions.
You aren't too old to meet someone else and go on to have kids.
My dad met my step mum when he was your age and after he and my mum split. She already had 2 kids to a previous marriage, but they went on to have 3 kids.
Exactly, this was my point. How this can allowed to be dragged on due to her uh "scheduling" seems out of this world to me.
This is why I've always been apprehensive about "online" dating in general. They can create a profile somewhere else, they can become someone else
and no one will be none the wiser...Of course good people would never pull this kind of crap on other people either.
It's not the online nature of meeting, nor is it online dating, that makes this a possibility. It is the conniving and dishonest nature of the person who does this crap. Well before there was an internet, people pulled this crap and had dual lives. Vince's girlfriend was doing it online AND in real life. Let's put the blame and the risk where they belong. Dishonest people are to blame for their dishonest actions, and they will find a way to be dishonest with whatever technology or methods are available where and when they live. We all risk being duped when we trust another person. We can look for warning signs and keep our eyes open, but trust is risk by its nature. Fortunately, most people are not nefariously dishonest, and most people have some level of integrity. People like the woman in this situation are seriously messed up, and exceedingly rare. That's why this is such a shock to read about, because it is rare.Quote:
Originally Posted by SelflessnHumble [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
Seriously bro, the age isn't the problem: it's her experiences but even more important is what she's learned (and applied) from them.
Depending on who you meet: some women will put their own kids on the back burner: which isn't cool, while others make it known their priorities lie
with their children, but then again: they too have failed relationships under their belt for some reason. Sometimes, sure, they've made bad decisions...
With other women it is glaringly obvious why they are single, but it is almost next to impossible to superimpose what we've experienced and slab it onto people you know.
We can sniff out the behaviors as to what people do (and how they do it) but it is impossible to know the "why."
Your sig quote says it all, man.
Inside you: you KNOW what you want, what you deserve and you KNOW that how she treats you; that these seasonal and spontaneous gaps in your relationship (she initiates) are complete BS.
The best advice: is to always hear them out BUT time is of the essence. While I realize human emotions aren't akin to warfare: I've learned how to reveal the truth in these types of scenarios.
It almost takes a sneak to know one and it sucks when you're the nice guy in all this providing love, compassion and a supportive environment but give a mouse a cookie and he's gonna want some milk.
Not meeting her friends and family: is a red flag.
Even when a person she is "living" with hates you: this is too a red flag, the same with her being ashamed of your age gap.
How convenient the circumstances involved with how things end up: preclude you from being around her closest people in her life???? -this makes zero sense-
UNLESS she's lying to you. For whatever reason, a lie, is a lie -is a lie!
My ex did the very same thing to this older gent.
At the time she would come to me, and tell me how she did love him (but it was clear it wasn't passionate/physical love) it was
the kind of love that was was thankful for the security and support (and the money of course) BUT she came to me for sex
and since I was nuts myself (back then) -I never took into consideration his feelings at all.
I just don't understand why you aren't expediting this meet to NOW?
Why aren't you two speaking NOW, face to face in person on even ground?
Honestly dude, closure doesn't need her admissions of transgressions against you.
True closure happens when you look in the mirror, and realize that YOU did everything you possibly could for this relationship...
and that she didn't love you, respect you enough to be true to you OR have the fortitude to tell you to your face she didn't want to be exclusive with you anymore (whenever she felt it)
THIS ^^^ is the moment you begin to move on.
The hurt that you feel subsides when you KNOW that what you provide to a woman and who you are: is deserving of a true relationship chalk full of love, affection, respect and most of all
exclusivity in knowing that when she is out: she's either thinking of you or can't wait to come home to you. -This snake-bag of scum doesn't deserve you. It's time you realize the truth
whether or not her BS provides confirmation...
Truth be told: you've been subjected to think and feel this is "rare" but it isn't when it comes to online dating in my experience(s)
Of course this is solely on her: but these kinds of people HIDE from who they are correct? What better medium than an online dating site
emailing and "chatting" (back and forth) in order to create a false reality to hook the reader? My ex is currently locked up for attempted murder.
She had a huge group of friends who did the same as her: USED people for whatever means they could squeeze out their targets.
Some women who've been burned (in their case they were raped) move on. Others use other people to repair their internal hurt because it makes
them feel better about being who they are.
I've "been subjected to think," what does that even mean? My online dating experience is that it is a means to meet people, and once you meet it is no iddferent from meeting anywhere else. A person who wants to hide who he/she is can hook up in a bar or club or online or through a local pottery club. It makes no difference.Quote:
Originally Posted by SelflessnHumble [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
Hiding through online dating would only work if you never took it to real life and had a date. And yeah, I would assume that "relationships" where the parties never meet are far more likely to involve dishonest people than normal relationships.
And OK, you know of one group of dishonest people who use online dating as their trap and tried to use people they met that way. That doesn't mean that this is common. I've found online dating to return the exact same variety of people and motives and the same percentages of honesty and integrity and everything else as any other cross-section of humanity. Now, users are common. Humankind is fundamentally greedy and lazy, but most people have some limits they place on that sort of behavior that stops well before the kind of thing in the OP.
Oh please can I keep this as my signature as this is exactly how I feel except I don't even own a cat...:( ???Quote:
Originally Posted by VincenzoG91 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
I'm not understanding why you're not understanding this?
You have your opinion as I have mine.
Both are from experience. Do I have more experience, possibly.
A face to face meet means there aren't ANY sort of means where you can "set" up the meet
before hand with dialogue...Breaking the ice...whereas meeting face to face means (at least for me) no wing man:
who you are entirely either attracts women OR you go online for this reason, or because of a scheduling conflict/busy lifestyle or other reasons.
See a manipulating liar like Amy can say things to put inside his head to preface her future actions to be overlooked...
"I work long hours" or "sometimes I'm called into work at a moment's notice" or "I don't know why but my friends never like by BF's" or
"I choose to separate my life's friends/family with my BF's" "it's just the way I am, I guess" and other kinds of BS. Of course she could say this
in real life but it's easier to walk away when this is said up front, as opposed to her conditioning her ideal mate. She can even say:
"Sometimes, I just take off from work and go off by myself and enjoy life and myself." All of these are excuses if left unchecked will enable her to
further lie and cheat unimpeded with impunity or consequence.
I guess I just know how to pick psychopaths, right? I could go on but this isn't about me or you.
It's about Vince getting closure AND then it's about him identifying potential psychopaths for him to pass by and avoid.
There are always signs ALWAYS.
And Vince: YOU AREN'T ALONE BRO!!!!
Not only do you have yourself (which should be enough) but you have the forum's support as well as your cats!
Stay positive.
To be honest, during my peak dating years, my friends and I used to joke about the damaged goods discount. Meaning, you could sometimes date a really hot woman who was out of your league if she had some serious issues. Unfortunately, I seem to have tendencies towards enabling behavior. I take care of things and make excuses for the damaged woman. Feeling needed makes me feel like a hero. Shining Knight syndrome.
Unfortunately, men like this often tend to get used by women.Quote:
Unfortunately, I seem to have tendencies towards enabling behavior. I take care of things and make excuses for the damaged woman. Feeling needed makes me feel like a hero. Shining Knight syndrome.
Used and while she wants your help....cast aside and when she's back on her feet again.
The 'leech' will keep you around, particularly if you are a man who has been generous with money and continue to take you for all they can.
I was surprised reading your description of your exes because I always pictured you with a well-together woman...maybe this shining Knight syndrome is what you need to get rid off to succeed in finding the right match for you...Quote:
Originally Posted by VincenzoG91 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
There are A LOT of trustworthy and available women out there maybe not as sassy or sexy as your exes or as needy but some other traits are attractive too: a kind heart/unselfishness and intelligence...
I think when you start dating again you should look for someone who is a giver rather than a taker...it should be the major trait you look for...
I get that, and at one point it fueled my very existence but consider this:
Helping other people with their problems (when you haven't faced yours) is a sort of deflection because
what you do and who you are should give you purpose, satisfaction and the feeling that you get from helping damaged people.
My ex who is an honest superficial 9 (exterior wise) damn near perfect did the same thing.
She looked for men to take "care" of her. Later, she became the hero, helping people: but she focused her help on her exes.
Sadly she's never learned, nearly 30, single and countless failed relationships. It never occurred to her -that her failures were due to her own choices.
Not to be off topic but since you really care about your cat...I'd really love it if you took a look at this site, k?
I too have a kitty and he's 15 -but acts like a healthy kitten...Cats are strict obligate carnivores, they NEED animal based protein,
not fortified fruits and veggies and grains! -Definitely not dry kibble- ever!
I plan on my cat living until he's 25-which is possible with a natural food/raw diet.
[url=http://www.catnutrition.org/index.php]Cat Nutrition.Org[/url]
Meeting delayed until Friday night. Her work and class schedule are in the way, and I'm exhausted from sleep deprivation. She is going to slide the keys under the door, so I can get those back to our landlord tomorrow.
I don't believe for 1 second she's actually telling you any sort of truth. But good to know we'll wait for Friday for your update.
Good suggestion. I still had trouble focusing, until I decided to work this out in chronological order. There were a few specific issues and questions from each year of our relationship that I want clarity on. If I can get those answers, I will be able to move on more quickly. I promised her that I wouldn't be angry or try to argue with her, but that I needed her to be honest. I also said that she would probably feel better, too, if she finally confessed to what happened. It's like this poster in my junior high guidance counselor's office: "The truth will set you free, but first it will make you miserable."Quote:
Originally Posted by MerryH [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
Wouldn't surprise me if this meeting doesn't come off at all.
Probably too ashamed to show her face.
I know that when me and the ex H split....he avoided me. His guilt was too overwhelming - plus he'd made up his mind to be with her, so why come and talk to me and explain anything. It was about 3 weeks later when he did finally show up. I received all the usual crap you hear from cheaters - how he hadn't been happy for a long time, he loved me, but wasn't in love with me anymore, blah, blah..
2 months after the split, was when he'd call me saying he wanted to come back to me, he'd made a mistake, etc, etc.
But I was having none of it.
You can expect all of the same shit to happen.
I won't be surprised if that's how it all plays out. Except that I still expect her to marry this guy this year. So I won't hear from her for at least a couple of years, until the marriage starts to go bad.Quote:
Originally Posted by xxazurexx [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]
And I won't take her back. I'm telling all of my friends and all of my family what happened. If she tries to come back to me, there will be a lot of hostility from everybody in my life.
If I don't get the keys back by tomorrow, I will just pay the landlord to change the locks.
If she cancels and re-schedules again, I'm just going to delete all her contact information and ignore her. Which is what I'm going to do anyway. But if I can't get closure now, I will just do without.