60 day he-tox

Thank you Haxan; I believe you have nailed it. I've actually said as much to him, and of course, he vehemently denies it, but I know in my heart it must be true.

Indi - pity you don't live closer.

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Originally Posted by IndiReloaded [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

No, there was just something about him that triggered your buttons. Figure out which ones, say 'thank you' for the learning experience.

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I'm pretty sure I started going over the deep end when my daughter had her surgery. I was really too numb with grief and fear about the surgery to care one way or the other about him before that, and even for a while afterwards. As you know, part of the reason I separated from my ex was that he was emotionally unavailable to lean on when serious things happened, and here was a man who wanted to help me. He was the only non-family person who maintained sustained interest, calling me several times a day, dropping things off to me, etc. After she recovered, I thought a lot about how he stood by me, and was grateful, but I wasn't in all the way yet. That happened when he nursed me after I broke my foot and ankle. I interpreted his involvement as strength and caring.

In retrospect, he probably hung around so much during my daughter's event out of morbid curiosity (not many people have that sort of surgery, especially pretty, young girls), and during my foot out out of guilt (I was making him a birthday dinner when I broke it). Plus, I think he gets off on getting to play the hero (yet another way to boost his ego).

I am a sucker for acts of strength and kindness at times when I am needy. I am sick of always having to be strong on my own. :(

As I read through all this, I see that he does care for you, and he did give it his best shot to be strong for you BUT, it may have scared him off being there to see what you have to deal with on a daily basis would wear him and the relationship down. I feel he didn't want to admit how weak he really is, even though on the outside you saw strength and kindness. In reality he isn't the man you thought he was. He has run away like a coward, not even to be able to be honest with you about how he feels and given you a chance to work out a compromise/adjustment/or have some space. I know you will say things about how ungrateful he is, shallow, ego maniac, etc I truly think he feels a lot of guilt for bailing on you and how this has left you, he didn't want to further the damage by telling you straight up. He couldn't admit that he couldn't handle the stresses in this relationship.

People would rather hide, that just talk....talking is so easy, why do people have such a hard time with it?

Vashti you didn't get sucked in, and you didn't fail, he failed you.

vashhh you are so beautiful and awesome. you deserve a guy who will give you time and space for thinking and who will be there for you during really hard times and i know 100% that he is exists.

i don't believe that you are a pity fest at all. he is LUCKY to be hanging out with you.

i KNOW of at least one person in this forum alone who would be glad to sit by your side at a time of need. if he is your man, then he's going to do that be it thick or thin.

[Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

<3 vashti. i say a little prayyyyer for youuuuuuuu.

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Originally Posted by misombra [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

he is LUCKY to be hanging out with you.

i KNOW of at least one person in this forum alone who would be glad to sit by your side at a time of need. if he is your man, then he's going to do that be it thick or thin.

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This^ 1000x.

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Originally Posted by misombra [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

vashhh you are so beautiful and awesome. You deserve a guy who will give you time and space for thinking and who will be there for you during really hard times and i know 100% that he is exists.

I don't believe that you are a pity fest at all. He is lucky to be hanging out with you.

I know of at least one person in this forum alone who would be glad to sit by your side at a time of need. If he is your man, then he's going to do that be it thick or thin.

[Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

<3 vashti. I say a little prayyyyer for youuuuuuuu.

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cam ?

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Originally Posted by smackie9 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

As I read through all this, I see that he does care for you, and he did give it his best shot to be strong for you BUT, it may have scared him off being there to see what you have to deal with on a daily basis would wear him and the relationship down.

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This thought has definitely occurred to me, though to be fair to myself, I never asked for anything, not from him or anyone else. I do not want to be seen as needy (even when I feel it), and I definitely don't want my daughter to be seen as a burden, so I never whine out loud. Too prideful, I guess. Thanks for your perspective.

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Originally Posted by TheSaint [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

cam ?

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No, silly. YOU. lol

Misombra - I <3 you. We should plan another get-together.
Indi - I likewise do not see you as a failure AT ALL. You tried to make something whole with a bunch of broken pieces, and you stuck it out for longer than most people would have done. You have nothing to feel bad about.

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Originally Posted by IndiReloaded [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

He married someone who was pretty, not terribly responsible and sounds shallow. No kids, I'm guessing. Men often marry these types for their own egos. Are you sure he loved her, and not how she *made him feel*?

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I was thinking about this today, and I remembered hearing at some point that men don't really fall in love with women; they fall in love with the way a woman makes them feel. If that is the case, then I see what went wrong; he was always feeling like an asshole when it came to dealing with me (not that he didn't deserve to).

Botched it, remorseful, I need a babysitter.

Back at day 2, and semi-drunk. :(

he's good :)

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Originally Posted by asdfg789 [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

he's good :)

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That sounds insensitive..

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Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Botched it, remorseful, I need a babysitter.

Back at day 2, and semi-drunk. :(

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Stay away from the mirror :P


If it makes you feel any better, people who do the right/rational thing in affairs of the heart during a breakup are like outlaw bikers, 1% 'ers.

You're going to have to get it right soon though..

Three things immediately come to mind.

1. You can't stop smoking if you keep having a drag off a cigarette

2. You may think it's therapeutic to come here and vent. I think all it's doing is keeping him and your struggle forefront in your mind.

My advice.. get some Nicorette for the heart (that would be something unique to you that will keep your mind off of him) and then delete this thread.

3. You resign to the fact that you're addicted to him, stop chastising yourself for not being happy with what he can give you and just enjoy. There's really no point in being unhappy when you're with him and when you're not. So pick a stance and be strong.

Peace, Vashti.

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Originally Posted by Wakeup [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

3. You resign to the fact that you're addicted to him, stop chastising yourself for not being happy with what he can give you and just enjoy. There's really no point in being unhappy when you're with him and when you're not.

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^^ I'm thinking this

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Originally Posted by Wakeup [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Three things immediately come to mind.

1. You can't stop smoking if you keep having a drag off a cigarette

2. You may think it's therapeutic to come here and vent. I think all it's doing is keeping him and your struggle forefront in your mind.

My advice.. get some Nicorette for the heart (that would be something unique to you that will keep your mind off of him) and then delete this thread.

3. You resign to the fact that you're addicted to him, stop chastising yourself for not being happy with what he can give you and just enjoy. There's really no point in being unhappy when you're with him and when you're not. So pick a stance and be strong.

Peace, Vashti.

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Thanks.

Re: your point number 2 - I don't think it's primarily therapeutic. I've been posting here instead of contacting him.

Re: number 3 - I wish I knew how to make peace with what he is willing to offer. That would be a ideal. Sex ruined everything... pity a woman's vagina is tied to her heart (or maybe that's just mine?)... if I hadn't ever slept with him, I wouldn't have become so emotionally attached.

So tell me: do you know how I can learn to be happy with settling for less? (This is a genuine question, and not intended to be snarky.)

I haven't read the entire thread so I apologize if this was said already but have you talked to him about this? If he can't offer more, it might be worth it to ask him to keep his distance for your sake. I suppose I got lucky with "my" guy in that he was already hard to keep in touch with so over time, even though it still hurts and I think of him almost every day, I've gotten a bit more indifferent.

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Originally Posted by Hotaru [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

I haven't read the entire thread so I apologize if this was said already but have you talked to him about this? If he can't offer more, it might be worth it to ask him to keep his distance for your sake. I suppose I got lucky with "my" guy in that he was already hard to keep in touch with so over time, even though it still hurts and I think of him almost every day, I've gotten a bit more indifferent.

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Yes, I think I've mentioned before that I've talked to him about this to the point that even *I* am sick of it. I told him I needed 60 days. The thing is, I miss him, and he doesn't WANT me to become indifferent... he wants me to be happy with what he is willing to give.

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Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

he wants me to be happy with what he is willing to give.

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As you told me: what YOU want matters. You need to distance yourself. This isn't going to work for you. :hugs:

I am going through a breakup because my ex boyfriend don't want to take things to the next level (don't want to commit) too although in a different sort of way than yours. The more I think about it and as time goes by since the breakup, the more I thought the decision to leave him was a good choice. Although, there are moments of weakness when I really want to convince myself that I should stay and just be happy with the emotional scraps he was giving me, I know I just wouldn't be happy with it in the long run. When there are very different level of love between two people, it won't work out. IF you ALSO want/ is fine with something casual then things are cool. But that is not what you want because your love for him make you want a committed relationship with him. It is like in the Notebook (if you watched that move). Noah associated with two women primarily. Allie is Noah's real love (he would do everything for her) but Sara is a woman Noah just keeps on the side to fulfill his moments of lonliness. When men want to keep a woman but don't want to commit and give her everything he has, she is just his side piece. It is your choice. You want to be Allie or Sara? You probably have it even worse than Sara because at least she is cool with the casual arrangement because her real love is her ex-husband (who died in the war).

Vashti, It's all a matter of not needing to control and about knowing without a doubt that you only have control over yourself and your choices. The goal is to stop feeling out of control... that is when you will feel less angst about what you do have with him.

I'm not saying that being with him on his terms is the best option forever ~ rather that it maybe the best option for you until you're in a better position to be keep him out of your life. When your daughter is more independent for instance and you're actually open to meeting a man that is a good life-mate and partner. Perhaps sub-consciously, you're not ready to commit to anyone yourself, hence why you find him so hard to disengage from. He gives you everything you only need at this point. If he were to commit, it may not be the same. (????)

Damn it's hard, I get that. Thing is, we have to look at the big picture. If you keep him in your life then start being okay with it by slowly disengaging in any bonding rituals. No more cuddling after sex. (Save that for the man you end up sharing your life for real) No more initiating, make him do the work. No more sleep-overs. Keep it friendly and non-bonding, no more of anything that will keep you bonded. That is a slow way to wean you from his emotional grasp.

Keep in mind that you're not alone in being a woman who is hooked on a man that won't commit to her. Attitude has a lot to do with being okay with having a lover without commitment… Take back your power and you be the boss of this. Don’t always say yes when he wants to see you be genuinely too pre-occupied with other things like friends/hobbies/your life. Stop framing him as the prize. You're the prize and don't you forget it.

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The thing is, I miss him, and he doesn't WANT me to become indifferent

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To hell with what he wants at this point. If you keep doing this with him then You start being the boss of it. Leader up NOW. When you see that you really do have some control in this (with your own actions) you will lessen your heart-sick feelings.

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Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Yes, I think I've mentioned before that I've talked to him about this to the point that even *I* am sick of it. I told him I needed 60 days. The thing is, I miss him, and he doesn't WANT me to become indifferent... he wants me to be happy with what he is willing to give.

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Maybe this is the wrong angle to come from but think about that - he's hurting you. You're obviously not happy and he's the cause. You told him what you need and his response has twice been to deny you. First, he refused to commit. Then, he refused to back off. He's in control and he's not thinking of you, he's thinking of himself. He likes things how they are and doesn't give enough of a shit to help you, whether that be by committing or by backing off knowing he can't/doesn't want to give you more. I don't know about you, but that kind of behavior pisses me off when I see it. I don't even know this guy and it pisses me off. It's selfish and hurtful and a shit thing to do to someone you claim to care about.

Now, I've seen your posts around here and you are/can be a very feisty woman. Don't put up with that. He's not the only one who matters here. Maybe holding onto what I just said will help, I don't know. I, personally, tend to do better when I focus on the bad rather than the good and get a little anger going and you have every right to be furious with him at this point.

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Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

So tell me: do you know how I can learn to be happy with settling for less?

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I don't know you vash, but sense you bring a lot to the table. So the thing is, you'll never settle for less and don't deserve it. If someone that I was into wasn't all in with me, as soon as I got that vibe I would be out the door forever. Too many single, hot, professional women out there to waste my time with someone who gives half a shit, or just doesn't want me to have sex with anyone else.

Screw that :)

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Originally Posted by Wakeup [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Attitude has a lot to do with being okay with having a lover without commitment…

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I don't think I am of the right disposition for this type of arrangement, at least not with someone I care for.

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Originally Posted by Hotaru [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

I, personally, tend to do better when I focus on the bad rather than the good and get a little anger going and you have every right to be furious with him at this point.

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Originally Posted by fearoflove [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

there are moments of weakness when I really want to convince myself that I should stay and just be happy with the emotional scraps he was giving me

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I'm trying to stay focused on anger (rather than hurt). I am home with my daughter, who is doing 72 hours of continuous EEG monitoring this weekend. She won't even leave the house because her head is full of electrodes and wires, and wrapped with gauze. She looks like she did after her brain surgery. It's fairly awful to see your kid looking this way, and I started out the day being angry that I am having to handle the emotional toll of this alone, but by the end of the day, it just hurts. I know if I called and told Ivan what is going on, he would come and sit with us, and of course, it's so tempting.

Today was the first of three days off work for me, and I HATE having all this time on my hands. I can't wait for Monday.

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Originally Posted by Wakeup [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Perhaps sub-consciously, you're not ready to commit to anyone yourself, hence why you find him so hard to disengage from.

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Hmm.... I am trying not to immediately discount this thought, but I don't know. I prefer the security that comes with a stable relationship... it makes me think I have tolerated too much nonsense from this man in order to have some level of security, particularly since there are so many other areas of my life for which I have absolutely NO control.

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Originally Posted by haxan [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

I don't know you vash, but sense you bring a lot to the table.

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Thanks. Most of the time, I actually believe I do, even though it probably isn't apparent in this thread. lol

Vash, he's inconsiderate of your needs. That kind of behaviour may fly in our early 20s, when we are still learning how to interact with others, but a man his age should know better. Many do. Let him be someone else's project, you've done your time.

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I don't think I am of the right disposition for this type of arrangement, at least not with someone I care for.

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Then you have your answer to: "There's no sense being unhappy when you're with him AND when you're not." Now comes the hard work and sticking to it to get you past your longing for him... because there's no sense being unhappy when he's with you and when he's not. Am I right in assuming that he sees other women as well as you?

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Originally Posted by Wakeup [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Am I right in assuming that he sees other women as well as you?

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I don't know. He says he doesn't, but he's a liar, and he clearly wants to retain this option.

You know, I feel I should clarify (with all this talk of commitment) that I am not asking for much, really. I do not want to marry again, and I won't live(unmarried) with a man while my children are at home. When I think of how little I am really asking for, I just get angry.

just remember that God never gives us more than we can handle. However, you need to rely on God for your strength instead of trying to handle everything on your own

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Originally Posted by Call Me Maybe [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

just remember that God never gives us more than we can handle. However, you need to rely on God for your strength instead of trying to handle everything on your own

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No offense, but STFU. When I die, I plan to kick god squarely in the balls as hard as I can on my daughter's behalf.

how sad to hear

If God never gives us more than we can handle, then explain suicide.

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Originally Posted by Call Me Maybe [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

how sad to hear

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Call Me - Not everyone takes comfort in the idea of a God. Many view this attitude as a foisting off of personal responsibility to a non-entity. If the idea of God brings you comfort, good for you. But respect Vash's POV that it does not.

Try something pragmatic. Or find another thread.

Also, by way of gentle warning, and I mean this in the nicest way: if you continue to post suggestions people find comfort in religion, you will find it very hard going on this forum. Thanks. :)

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Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

If God never gives us more than we can handle, then explain suicide.

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what is there to explain? Some people would rather kill themselves instead of dealing with a tough situation

Someone resurrected this thread and I found this old post. For you, Vash:

http://www.loveforum.net/threads/58122-great-Break-Up-Quotes?p=826363#post826363

Indi, I understand not everyone shares my religious beliefs but I wouldn't be honest with myself if I was afraid or ashamed to mention God. I don't care if that makes my experience here more difficult. Also, if I recall correctly, Vashti believes in God unless she changed her mind. Just b/c my post doesn't meet your criteria doesn't mean it's not practical advice

This isn't about you, and Vash posted already her thoughts clearly about this. The idea of God, in this situation doesn't bring her comfort.

Now **** off with your religious-based 'help'. You tried, it was rejected. Next.

^^^ the hubris of the atheist. Vashti, if this is who you look to for help instead of God, then I sincerely wish you the best of luck in your endeavors

Lets keep on track please, this is not a forum for religious debate.

Oh dear Lord, I'm tempted to respond but I won't...

No contact today vash, no contact! :D

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Originally Posted by Call Me Maybe [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Also, if I recall correctly, Vashti believes in God unless she changed her mind.

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I'm agnostic, but to be perfectly honest, if there IS a God, and if s/he is all-powerful and even remotely interested in humanity (as you seem to believe), s/he has a lot of explaining to do.

I am probably more religion-friendly than most on this forum, but I find cliche statements like "God never gives you more than you can handle" offensive, in light of the fact that I have a kid with a chronic medical condition that could kill her, and in light of the amount of suffering I see regularly at work.

If there IS a God, I do not believe s/he operates in the way you think, and if he does, I believe my wrath is justified. I am really okay with you taking comfort in your beliefs, and I agree that belief is a valuable tool for many people. I am just not one of them.

Peace.

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Originally Posted by Hotaru [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Oh dear Lord, I'm tempted to respond but I won't...

No contact today vash, no contact! :D

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No, I won't. Days are somehow easier, anyway. Nights are what I dread.

This is day 5, BTW.

Thanks for cheering me on.

Indi - I read that poem when it popped up this morning. It's lovely. Thanks.

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Originally Posted by Call Me Maybe [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

what is there to explain? Some people would rather kill themselves instead of dealing with a tough situation

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Nope. People that commit suicide aren't looking for a "way out". They truly believe that the world and their family would be better off if they were dead.

You sound incredibly naive, and like most, will say just about anything to defend insane beliefs that have no basis in reality.

It's like talking to someone from North Korea.