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15-01-08, 02:10 PM
Mish

Quote:

Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Silly mish... the Native American Indians don't have access to healthcare because they won't come off the reservation to get it. They have traveling nurses who go do clinics on the reservation periodically.

This wasn't what Miso was saying

Miso was saying quote:

wow, the u.s. sure does treat us indigenous people pretty good as far as health care is concerned. unlike australia.

And I tore that incorrect assumption to shreds

Quote:

Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Now tell me: what are you doing about the nurses that are running away from your superior health care system?

Our health care system is not superior. But, I was there at the polling booth on the election day with my co-workers to bring about a change in government that created laws that made nurses run away. I also actively compaigned to bring an end to that government's regime.

And what have you done to bring about the universal health care system that would give more funding to the hospital where you work for free?
15-01-08, 02:12 PM
Mish

Quote:

Originally Posted by misombra [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

didn't you just read my post. i didn't have insurance. i was in the hospital, and it was paid for. i didn't have health insurance. get it? and it was still paid for. get it? taxes paid for it.

I read it. I showed you statistics that demonstrated that even though your bills were paid there are lots and lots of others who are not as fortunate as you.

Alrighty girls, i gtg

When I come back I wanna see a couple of pages worth of material for debunking ;)
15-01-08, 02:13 PM
vashti

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mishanya [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Please provide evidence to support this statement

Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples typically have the poorest health status of all Australians. Average life expectancy at birth is estimated to be 17 years lower than that of non-Indigenous people and the infant mortality rate is almost three times that of non-Indigenous infants.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mishanya [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

I applaud you for it. So having seen first hand what lack of universal health care does to hospitals would you vote it in or vote for the political party that aims to bring it?

No.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mishanya [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

You would rather die to be a burden to your children. What if you had no children? Would you die rather than be a burden to society? Would you recommend to people with no children to also do that?

No. I recommend they get health insurance.

Now tell me: what are you doing (that actually matters) about the nurses that are running away from your superior health care system?
15-01-08, 02:19 PM
Mish

Quote:

Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples typically have the poorest health status of all Australians. Average life expectancy at birth is estimated to be 17 years lower than that of non-Indigenous people and the infant mortality rate is almost three times that of non-Indigenous infants.

I asked you to support your statement how what I have done has brought about no good for these people not to repeat the same information you've already posted.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

No.

So in other words you don't have any plans to bring about change to the current state of health care in US and you don't support those who could make a change for the better?

Quote:

Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

No. I recommend they get health insurance.

Would you dedicate a little bit from your taxes to make sure they get it if they can't pay for it?
15-01-08, 02:26 PM
misombra

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mishanya [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

I read it. I showed you statistics that demonstrated that even though your bills were paid there are lots and lots of others who are not as fortunate as you.

no, you showed me numbers of native americans who did not have health insurance. those people would be just as lucky as me. probably more lucky as there are also some really nice hospitals for native americans where i live.

well, it's really a shame we can't discuss this further. i guess we can give you the night to think about what you're gonna say to sound right.

good luck!
15-01-08, 02:28 PM
IndiReloaded

The problem as I see it: Everyone would like to have 'superior' health care but not everyone can afford it. This means, somehow, resources are limited.

The argument you seem to be making, Mish, is that the US CAN afford UHC, but chooses (as a society) not to implement. So, assuming they believe in theory its a worthwhile goal (they may not--Vash seems to think everyone should just be productive & pay their own way via insurance); anyway, that means there is some belief there is no advantage for the affluent to supply this. That sharing of wealth is a zero-sum exercise. Given that humans are inherently self-serving (and that IS selected for), how to convince them of the potential advantages?

FYI, ppl thought the same thing about outsourcing IT service industry to India (that it would eliminate american jobs, instead of improving company efficiency) & look at them now.
15-01-08, 02:28 PM
misombra

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mishanya [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

And I tore that incorrect assumption to shreds

ummmmm no you just failed to see sarcasm and irony.
15-01-08, 02:40 PM
vashti

Quote:

Originally Posted by IndiReloaded [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

FYI, ppl thought the same thing about outsourcing IT service industry to India (that it would eliminate american jobs, instead of improving company efficiency) & look at them now.

I'm not sure it didn't do a little of both.
15-01-08, 02:56 PM
IndiReloaded

Quote:

Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

I'm not sure it didn't do a little of both.

Was that a statement or a question? No, it didn't have the 'doom & gloom' effect on the american IT economy that was predicted and it has vastly helped the Indian one. Oh, and they had to buy TONS of computer HARDWARE infrastructure (Apple made/is making a truckload of it) from, you guessed it, American companies.
15-01-08, 03:10 PM
vashti

It was meant more as a question. I am extremely unknowledgable about anything related to computers, but I have to say that the one time I called for help, I got an Indian guy with such a thick accent, I couldn't understand a word he was saying. I had my husband call later in the day... I'm not sure how efficient that was from a consumer's point of view. :D
15-01-08, 03:23 PM
IndiReloaded

Quote:

Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

It was meant more as a question. I am extremely unknowledgable about anything related to computers, but I have to say that the one time I called for help, I got an Indian guy with such a thick accent, I couldn't understand a word he was saying. I had my husband call later in the day... I'm not sure how efficient that was from a consumer's point of view. :D

Never had that experience, thankfully. But heard of it. I view it much like going into a clothes shop and actually expecting the young clerk to get off the phone with her friends to help you. Futile exercise.
15-01-08, 03:59 PM
TheSphinx

Quote:

Not everyone can just get up and go from poor to doing okay, some people just don't have the right genes/tools/circumstances.

Everyone I know today is in whatever position they currently find themselves because of the choices they made, and the consequences of those decisions, regardless of what base characteristics they started with.

Quote:

And what altruistic measures have you taken to correct the health care injustices in your country? Have you at least actively supported universal health care? Would you use your vote to bring it in?

Injustice? How is it not unjust that money could be taken from my pocket and distributed among the masses who's lifestyles I have no say in? It doesn't seem very "altruistic" to vote for an idea that other people are to pay for my lifestyle choices, either.

Quote:

You are going to kill yourself before you support the idea of a fair health system and more funding to the hospitals?

I can't see the fairness in it! Explain how being stripped of money I have worked for to cover another's medical expenses is "fair" to me?

~Sphinx
15-01-08, 10:51 PM
vashti

Sphinx - you should make a thread about you. You are still a mystery.
15-01-08, 11:59 PM
misombra

i know. i love sphinx's too.

anyway, i think indi and mish are just really good friends with michael moore and that's why they're pounding this in our faces. i have this picture as further evidence...
16-01-08, 12:17 AM
vashti

Thanks a lot. I have coffee all over my keyboard now! :D

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