Thoughts About Having Children...

I never had the inclination to want children. When I was a kid, I didn't play with dolls.. I was too busy playing outside to care about such things. As I became a teenager, there was talk of other girls wanting to be 'mommies' someday... while I was more worried about my school work and what to plan for the weekend. Shortly after highschool... all of my female friends and most of my male friends had children, which more or less left me in shock. All I could think about was why would they choose now? It didn't make any sense to me... and my feelings towards children were somewhat indifferent. As I became a young adult, I found that I was very good around children, capable of getting them to listen even when they didn't listen to their parents (have no idea why that is). But the indifference remained and I saw a future with no children whatsoever and I was content with that.

I've had a few relationships and even was married for a few years, but still did not desire a family... only thought about it when the oddity of my indifference was pointed out.

A couple of weeks ago, I had a dream about a guy I've been seeing. As was expected, the dream started out as rather erotic but progressed into something more. The details involved having our own house, good jobs, and all the intricacies that make up a stable life together. At some point in this dream, we both learned of the conception and yet we were not troubled... there were moments during the term that were noted, but still not really troubled... and even the birth, though difficult and painful did not seem to scare me as much as I would think. I remember there were two children born, one boy and one girl --- fraternal twins. I remember the name of the boy but cannot remember the name of the girl. We were both overjoyed at the new family we suddenly had.

I awoke with a start, uncertain as to how I should feel. I've never had these thoughts before, and I do not know why I would have them now. Is this just instincts finally coming into play or is there more to this?

it's just a dream, i've had dreams where i was preggers too, it's freaky. i don't think it means anything other than maybe you were talking to a pregnant woman recently or you saw a program on tv...it seems dreams like this comes from no-where but there is always an explanation if you think hard enough about what you saw and did that day previously

speaking of which; i had a really funny dream lately where myself a vashti were having a disagreement about whether i should climb over a fence or not! haha mad

Good lord, don't get pregnant because you had a dream that turned it out well! A dream is a meaningless event. Even if it respresents your unconscious desires (which no one knows for sure), it doesn't matter if it doesn't match your conscious desires.

And the reason kids will listen to you when they aren't listening to their parents is precisely because you aren't their parent. Young children always behave the worst for their own families because they trust that they will be loved anyway. This is not true of a stranger.

Oh.. no... no... I'm not rushing out to get pregnant. Pregnancy still scares me a bit and my life at the moment doesn't afford me the luxury.

I'm not a stranger to the children I mentioned... more like an 'Aunt.' They tend to straighten up whenever I go to the grocery store with their mother(s)... whereas I've been told they do not listen in my absence. Even had them confide in me secrets (who they had a crush on from the older ones... simple likes and dislikes from the younger ones) that were unknown to the parents.

I was just curious if any one noticed a shift in their thoughts and feelings when they either reached a certain age, were in a better relationship... or if such things occurred quite suddenly. The dream just started all of these feelings.. that's the reason for stating it. I've had strange dreams before and could easily disregard them... but this one seems to stay with me... and I'm not sure why.

Well, aside from the dream, I think you should definitely think hard about giving up the possibility of children. I'd be really sure one way or the other because it will definitely impact your life in ways you cannot possibly imagine. You might want to seek a counselor to bounce your thoughts off of, because I don't imagine this will be the kind of decision you can make in an instant.

For the record, most of the people I know knew early on if they wanted kids or not, but I think having sub-par partners could put a damper on anyone's plans to procreate.

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Originally Posted by vashti [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Good lord, don't get pregnant because you had a dream that turned it out well! A dream is a meaningless event. Even if it respresents your unconscious desires (which no one knows for sure), it doesn't matter if it doesn't match your conscious desires.

And the reason kids will listen to you when they aren't listening to their parents is precisely because you aren't their parent. Young children always behave the worst for their own families because they trust that they will be loved anyway. This is not true of a stranger.

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So true, just like when students listen to their teachers more than their parents. Dont think that a dream is a go signal for you to get pregnant. However it's not bad to have children if you are married.

I didn't start entertaining the thought of children until recently (I'm 28). Even so, I'm only entertaining the thought.....still a few more years until I'm actually ready to do it.

It changed for me when I met the right person. Nobody I'd been with in the past would've made a suitable parent. Once I finally met a man who seemed worthy I started thinking how cute he would be as a Dad - gasp!

On the flip side, my best friend is married and neither her or her husband want kids. She despises them. She said she just has no motherly instinct at all. I find it weird, but I guess some people just don't feel the need to procreate.

The best parents, IMO, are the ones who wait to have children until they have something to give to their child. Not the other way around. Too many ppl have children for their own selfish reasons, IMO.

I think you are wise to wait until you have financial and emotional stability. I was almost 30 before having my son, and completely finished with school & had good job stability. We were married for 5 years before deciding to have him. He's a fairly privileged child compared to his agemates, but he's doing a good job becoming a reasonable human being. But its only b/c we waited that we are able to provide this kind of nurturing environment for him. It wouldn't have been the same in our 20s.

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Originally Posted by IndiReloaded [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

The best parents, IMO, are the ones who wait to have children until they have something to give to their child. Not the other way around. Too many ppl have children for their own selfish reasons, IMO.

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I totally agree. There are also so many people who just have kids because...well that's what you do in life right? Without thinking through the enormity and consequences of this life altering decision.

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Originally Posted by IndiReloaded [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

The best parents, IMO, are the ones who wait to have children until they have something to give to their child. Not the other way around. Too many ppl have children for their own selfish reasons, IMO.

I think you are wise to wait until you have financial and emotional stability.

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I agree completely... However I have become more and more concerned with children in general. Been spending more time watching how other people react with their children. Noticing the traits in the parents of well-behaved kids and the traits in the parents of disobedient kids. I tend to be analytical at times... so I guess I'm approaching this new curiosity in the same way I approach most things in life.

My boyfriend did sense I was more distant lately and had asked why this was. After a little gentle prodding, I did finally tell him about the dream and my curiosity as of late. When I had finished he smiled and told me it was a wonderful idea but reminded me that given our circumstances it isn't possible. I agreed and reassured him that I do not plan to take these notions seriously.

However, he has brought up the idea of having children a few times since then though explaining that he was merely curious. I sense that he really wants kids... but I could be misreading this. If he does, I'm not uncomfortable with the idea, but I do realize I have a lot of work to do in regards to stabilizing my life.

And yes... I do feel that I should have something to offer any children I may have... for it is so much easier to lead by example... than to try to explain to a child how to be successful in life when even you haven't figured out how yet.

**** children

I'm on the same page as you, Indi.

I always said there was no way I'd have kids until I was finished school, married, had a good job and a house, and had managed to get some of my travel goals accomplished.

I'm about 75% there, and in two years I should be 100%. But by then, I'll still probably find a reason to delay the process ;)

Children are not the people of tomorrow, but people today. They are entitled to be taken seriously. They have a right to be treated by adults with tenderness and respect, as equals

This world has all the children it needs and then some. I don't see the point in bringing more into the world while other children are homeless and/or starving.

At least that's what I tell myself to justify my complete and total unwillingness to even entertain the thought of having children of my own. Someday my sister will have children (through artifical means, she is to be untouched) and I'll get to spoil them rotten and then flee when they mess their diapers. Being an uncle is good enough for me.

Women who like babies (and children) and want some of their own are 10x more attractive to me

Aeradalia, you sound entirely sane to me. What kind of idiot is baby-obsessed in high school? Ick.

I think you're starting to entertain the idea subconsciously because you're starting to be a responsible adult. I wish everyone worked that way.

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Originally Posted by Gribble [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

This world has all the children it needs and then some. I don't see the point in bringing more into the world while other children are homeless and/or starving.

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This is a good point. I suppose there is some amount of genetic selfishness/arrogance that went into our decision.

Tho I do believe that the issue is quality vs. quantity. My husband and I genuinely believe that we have a lot to offer our son (and hopefully society) by raising a very well-brought up human being. I suppose by that argument, we should have had 4. But it wasn't in the cards. We have discussed about adoption/fostering now that our son is old enough to understand & is more intellectually independent. Perhaps we should consider this more seriously if the future permits.

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Originally Posted by Gigabitch [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

What kind of idiot is baby-obsessed in high school? Ick.

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I went to high school in a small town in East Texas where the only available lifestyles involved mostly factory work or farming... so the views on having children were perhaps more old-fashioned and traditional.

I also spent some time in a high school in a larger East Texas city --- an alternative school really --- and had the opportunity to see first hand what it's like to raise a kid when you're 12 - 18 as a single mother.It was mandatory for everyone to take parenting classes (a requirement for the alternative school I believe)... and even basic child psychology. It was fun, though at the time I didn't see the point in me, personally, having to learn it.

So, shortly after high school... girls had kids (because that's what mom did, and her mom, and her mom's mom.. etc) and the guy's well... not always sure of their reasons... but they seemed to follow suit nonetheless.

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Originally Posted by Gigabitch [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

I think you're starting to entertain the idea subconsciously because you're starting to be a responsible adult. I wish everyone worked that way.

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You might be right... I may have been putting the idea on hold all these years because it never seemed feasible, and now that I am in a relationship with a man who's not only stable emotionally, but wanting to wait (a sign of a good head on his shoulders)... these thoughts have emerged.

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Originally Posted by DoesntMatter [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Women who like babies (and children) and want some of their own are 10x more attractive to me

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This I agree with. It's a catch-22 for me. Women who don't love children aren't really women. It's so wrong.

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Originally Posted by IndiReloaded [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Tho I do believe that the issue is quality vs. quantity. My husband and I genuinely believe that we have a lot to offer our son (and hopefully society) by raising a very well-brought up human being. I suppose by that argument, we should have had 4. But it wasn't in the cards. We have discussed about adoption/fostering now that our son is old enough to understand & is more intellectually independent. Perhaps we should consider this more seriously if the future permits.

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I'm sure you do have a ton to offer. But to be devil's advocate why not adopt to begin with? Do you believe that genetics plays a large part in how children turn out?

Dreams are difficult to interpret or they may mean nothing at all.

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Originally Posted by ecojeanne [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

speaking of which; i had a really funny dream lately where myself and vashti were having a disagreement about whether i should climb over a fence or not! haha mad

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This one, however is easy ... it expresses conflicted bi-curiosity!! :P

Sorry, Jeanne ... just teasing.

Carl.

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Originally Posted by Gribble [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

But to be devil's advocate why not adopt to begin with? Do you believe that genetics plays a large part in how children turn out?

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In short, yes. I think that intelligence and other traits are heritable. Certainly there are several generations of scientists (and now engineers) in our family. While part of that is environment, I doubt that is all of it. We are here b/c of certain genetics that allowed us to flourish and I think those are worthy of passing on.

But it would be interesting to do the experiment. Find out just how much an adopted child will absorb living with in a science family. Not to imply we aren't tolerant of other aptitudes (there is also a strong aptitude for music in our family, on both sides) but there is no way that even an adopted child of unknown genetic origins wouldn't get a science education in our home. Something to think about, as I said.

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Originally Posted by Gribble [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

This I agree with. It's a catch-22 for me. Women who don't love children aren't really women. It's so wrong.

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What are they then?

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Originally Posted by Dasein [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

What are they then?

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The mother must learn to trust her own perceptions; no one can know her child as she does: "To demand that others should provide you textbook prognoses is like asking a strange woman to give birth to your baby. There are insights that can be born only of your own pain, and they are the most precious."

Seek in that stranger who is your child the undiscovered part of yourself. The child emerges as both the benefactor and the victim of its mother´s love, with the author intervening like a guardian angel on its behalf He is equally wary of teachers, whom he consoles one moment-"You will always make mistakes because you are a human being, not a machine"

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Originally Posted by Indignant [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Seek in that stranger who is your child the undiscovered part of yourself.

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Not sure I understood the rest of your point, Dig, but I thought this^ was interesting.

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Originally Posted by Indignant [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

The mother must learn to trust her own perceptions; no one can know her child as she does: "To demand that others should provide you textbook prognoses is like asking a strange woman to give birth to your baby. There are insights that can be born only of your own pain, and they are the most precious."

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I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess this means that only a mother (or one who raises the child) can understand the child in a very specific way because of all the time, devotion, and love they spend on the child.

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Originally Posted by Indignant [Dear Guest/Member you have to reply to see the link.click here to register]

Seek in that stranger who is your child the undiscovered part of yourself. The child emerges as both the benefactor and the victim of its mother´s love, with the author intervening like a guardian angel on its behalf He is equally wary of teachers, whom he consoles one moment-"You will always make mistakes because you are a human being, not a machine"

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This part is even more confusing. First off, what stranger? I can understand children being both benefactor and victim of a mother's love, in that they learn about life... good or bad... from their mother (or guardian). The rest is yet again, unclear.

Can't fault me for not trying to make sense of this bit of advice..;)