Did Women's Rights Destroy Traditional Marriage?

[IndiReloaded]

Independence is not the final stage of growth though.

Effective interdependence is a great force that harnesses capabilities of individuals and lets them enjoy the benefits that neither could enjoy individually. Hopefully this will be our next stage of evolution and answer to a lot of current problems that we are facing.

You'll get some eye rolls from this, Mish. But for what its worth, I think you have nailed it. Good for you.

The next hardest part, tho, will be finding (or uncovering) that partner who thinks the same way. THIS is the crux of the problem, not understanding it intellectually.

[Indignant]

This is a really good point, I think. The guys who CAN afford it, are often looking for their "equal" in intellect, career, success. But the type of woman who would be all these things is not going to be happy being a stay at home wife. Why would she be?

if women took their rightful paths in life such as staying home, raising a family and making her husband happy, then both partners would be less stressed, their would be more better paid jobs for men. basically all jobs would be for men mainly. women wouldn't be as egoistic and picky as they are now, and would respect men a lot more.

[IndiReloaded]

I'm not sure about the 'rightful path' part. I have no issue with ppl wanting to work and make contributions outside the home. I just think that doing so involves certain choices that folks are often not realistic about.

[IndiReloaded]

Actually, the rise of the internet has made it possible for a lot of women to do both: get an education and balance work/home. Most of my work now involves telecommuting with only occassional travel. Gives me a lot of flexibility. Given what you do, it must be similar for you, Dig.

But that requires some thinking and planning. And some ppl like working outside the home, so there is also that. But again, its just another reality variable that needs juggling.

[Indignant]

first of all women are made completely different from men. their bodies and minds have a completely different role in life. why are women made to suffer a million times more than men? menstruation, child birth, body changes after the birth and tons of other things that i mention. women were made to be cherished by men since we are the more fragile creatures. after we got equal rights to men all that was lost and abused.

[Indignant]

Actually, the rise of the internet has made it possible for a lot of women to do both: get an education and balance work/home. Most of my work now involves telecommuting with only occassional travel. Gives me a lot of flexibility. Given what you do, it must be similar for you, Dig.

But that requires some thinking and planning. And some ppl like working outside the home, so there is also that. But again, its just another reality variable that needs juggling.

oh gosh no, i am not even close to complaining about my life. i love my job and i love working.

[ecojeanne]

if women took their rightful paths in life such as staying home, raising a family and making her husband happy, then both partners would be less stressed, their would be more better paid jobs for men. basically all jobs would be for men mainly. women wouldn't be as egoistic and picky as they are now, and would respect men a lot more.

what about the idea of putting the men in their rightful place in the home to look after the kids while the women go out and play and get paid better, i prefer that scenario

[Indignant]

what about the idea of putting the men in their rightful place in the home to look after the kids while the women go out and play and get paif better, i prefer that scenario

ideally it would be fine, if we were created equal. but we were not, everything has a purpose in life. and we broke the initial path that we were supposed to take.

[IndiReloaded]

oh gosh no, i am not even close to complaining about my life. i love my job and i love working.

But how did it affect your marriages? Or did it?

[Indignant]

But how did it affect your marriages? Or did it?

i don't know really. my first one was when i was 18. i was severely abused by an older russian guy, he was 24 at that time. the whole scenario ended with him going to jail of course.

the one right after that was when i was hmmm about 19 to a 31 year old man. it took me 3 years to realize that I was the only working in the family and all of his grand ideas and dreams got us nowhere. i just got my stuff and left.

[ecojeanne]

ideally it would be fine, if we were created equal. but we were not, everything has a purpose in life. and we broke the initial path that we were supposed to take.

we are created equal, it's just unfortunate that men took advantage of women thoughout history when we were weak. we had the babies. men are at the top atm, i don't think that will change in the near future. some women want to be 'protected' and want to play that role. lots of women who reach the top are practically men coz the men don't want them there so they had to become the type of women you don't like. i don't necessarily praise these women coz there are ways to get things without stepping over your grandma. i would like if it was 50/50 men and women making the decisions it won't be in my lifetime, i won't be a bitch about getting where i want to go. women are great indig, you should believe me, we get a hard time of it without getting extra stick from other women

[Mish]

The next hardest part, tho, will be finding (or uncovering) that partner who thinks the same way. THIS is the crux of the problem, not understanding it intellectually.

I agree

And it would also be difficult to bypass personal selfish feelings sometimes as they pop up on the timeline of a relationship. Perhaps this needs to be looked at as a type of graduation?

[starbuck]

I don't really see how women would ever be satisfied not gaining the same rights as men quite honestly. The careers that women were traditionally limited to before the sixties, were what? Nurses, secretaries, teachers, and people in care-giving roles? Not bad careers of course, but not every woman is suited for them. There could have been a brilliant scientist out there who never got the chance to make an amazing discovery because the opportunity to be a scientist was unavailable to her. Women's rights in the Western world was going to happen whether you like it or not.

How exactly is marriage suffering though? Because you don't have to stay with someone out of financial security? One could actually make the argument that marriage has a deeper meaning than it once did previously since many traditional marriages were more like arrangements before women got equal pay.

Maybe women's rights didn't ruin marriage. Maybe they saved it?

[Indignant]

we are created equal, it's just unfortunate that men took advantage of women thoughout history when we were weak. we had the babies. men are at the top atm, i don't think that will change in the near future. some women want to be 'protected' and want to play that role. lots of women who reach the top are practically men coz the men don't want them there so they had to become the type of women you don't like. i don't necessarily praise these women coz there are ways to get things without stepping over your grandma. i would like if it was 50/50 men and women making the decisions it won't be in my lifetime, i won't be a bitch about getting where i want to go. women are great indig, you should believe me, we get a hard time of it without getting extra stick from other women

physically and mentally women are created different from men. we are great, no doubt about it. but unfortunately men don't see it or respect it as much as before we got rights. talk about chivalry. its a phenomena hardly seen nowadays.

[Indignant]

I don't really see how women would ever be satisfied not gaining the same rights as men quite honestly. The careers that women were traditionally limited to before the sixties, were what? Nurses, secretaries, teachers, and people in care-giving roles? Not bad careers of course, but not every woman is suited for them. There could have been a brilliant scientist out there who never got the chance to make an amazing discovery because the opportunity to be a scientist was unavailable to her. Women's rights in the Western world was going to happen whether you like it or not.

How exactly is marriage suffering though? Because you don't have to stay with someone out of financial security? One could actually make the argument that marriage has a deeper meaning than it once did previously since many traditional marriages were more like arrangements before women got equal pay.

Maybe women's rights didn't ruin marriage. Maybe they saved it?

i wonder what's the ratio of brilliant men scientists to women.