Is Romance dead?

[Killerbabe]

I'm sorry to day this, but I disagree with everyone but MVP, because I have lost all faith in women and men. Men are bastards and women are bitches, ummmkay?

Warning: Highly cynical content. May cause disappointment. Keep away from children.

After an internal war within myself and externally with the entire world consisting of women and men, I have finally derived to an inevitable conclusion, that there is no such thing as romance and, surely enough, "sacred marriage".

If we go back in time, or perhaps just open up the Holy book and read into say, Leviticus or any other book in the Hebrew Bible (previously, the "Old Testament") - we will be taken into a wild journey of fornification, adultury, incest, and surely enough polygamy ie harem. People, and men in particular, have always enjoyed sexual diversity. Women are ****ing whores and were always willing to sleep with whoever, be it her best friend's man. We're worth each other.

So, my conclusion is - there is no romance, at least not for too long. That is to say, that there IS romance, when a guy falls hard for a girl, but as time goes by romance withers away.

Romance, the life-long kind of romance is nothing but a delusional product of aging housewifes who write silly novels about puppy love. Take any romance novel, a sappy movie script and you'll be overwhelmed by cynicism (well, if you've come to the point of understanding the nature of men). It seems to me, that people who write those scripts just scribble and laugh to themselves at every other corny phrase they write. Those scripts, books, whatever, are too surreal in terms of defining love. "Romantic" things like that never happen to real women.

Take "Gone With the Wind" for example. Rhett Butler, a sexy product of Margaret Mitchell's love-starved, sex-crazed imagination portrays everything a woman wants to see in a man, and does everything to make a woman go wild, tear off her clothes and hop on top. To cut the crap short, everything that happens thorughout the book is a silly fairy tale. However, Margaret wasn't your typical housewife, so she had to compensate for Rhett's unbelievable love for Scarlett by having him dump her in the end. For that realistic ending I respect Margaret Mitchell.

Now let's examine a romance novel by a male author. My favorite author ever is Erich Maria Remarque (male author, ignore the feminine middle name). One of my favorite books by Remarque is "Three Comrades", a romance novel which took place in Germany, during the Great Depression years. The book is not exactly a romance novel, because for men there IS no such thing as romance of course. The book breathes with philosophical deliberation (a brilliant school of thought), economic hopelessness and moral desperation, and encompasses the biggest tragedy of all times - taking love and life for granted.

Unlike silly women's literature, the book delivers a sad story how one young man kept playing a girl that loved him to death (literally), and only having found out at the end that she has a fatal sickness - tuberculosis, he realizes that he is losing the very essense, the very source of joy, and the love if his life. Only then he commits himself to her and they spend every day of her remaining life together.

Thing is, there HAS to be some obstacle for a man to love a woman. It's always got to be an issue of life or death, an issue of now or never. But what we forget in our never-ending pursuit of complete satisfaction, in our daily quest for happiness against the odds of this dull life, is that there IS an end to everything, and if we don't appreciate what we have and take comfort in the simple pleasures in life... we night end up regretting the losses. We are so neglecting to the most importnant things in life - health, loved ones - that we only regret the loss when it's too late. You never know what you have until it's gone - but DEATH should be a reminder to us how valuable and dear life is. Personally I think it's a shame to play one another - at least in the world we live in today. With the recent tragedy in Beslan (the school massacre), and worldwide natural disasters, it's about time we learned to value each other's lives and take care of one another, instead of playing foolish games when fate itself is playing cruel games with people's lives.

[blue]

i feel that romance does exist i see it everyday when it comes to my grandparents they have been togther for 40 years and the romance is still alive shit they have sex more often than i do and thats the truth they kiss hold hands and caress eachother. romance exist but relationships take work, it is not a fairy tale everyday couples are faced with money problems and all kinds of issues it takes work and it takes work from both parties to keep the romance alive. communication is key!!!

[cbee]

Reading Killerbabes post reminded me of one of my favourite books - Anna Karenina. Oh so sad but a great book.

At the moment I'm most firmly in the camp that romance is not really alive and kicking. Unfortunately I've become very cynical about romantic gestures such as flowers etc... maybe I'll learn to take them at face value again, maybe not.Romance is the superficial layer and as far as I'm concerned it's pretty much take it or leave it. It's not until you get deeper down and have a true and deep friendship with great mutual respect between two people that a relationship really works.

[Innova]

In theory, much of what each of us believe is opinion, while there are subjects that a group as a whole will fall into, there are some that are different thus we can never say what something truly is...reason being that nobody has a whole view of the world to generalize a thought, simply we do not know each and everyone and thus can only gain an hypotic opinion based on a group and never the individual.

Far too many factors involved with love or romance to command to say what exists and what doesn't. For the many that fall out of romance could do with something as simple as a character change. The phenom. that seems to happen over night and "Seem" to become somebody else. Love "can" last a lifetime in my opinion, but so can "Romance". I think though with romance is the fact that as time goes on..your willingness to do so is much increased in length, however I don't think it can die? But then again perhaps love and romance are intertwined..they should be, for you cannot romanace someone (Taking out he lust part of the definition) without loving them.

As with any question that involves life and its entity, there are many different angles, many different words that could discribe such a thing, and in doing so the world will have several different views and understandings..and its in our own opinion or view of a pasts history that allows us to believe which we may feel is right.

[MVPlaya]

There is a misinterpretation of what I wrote, per Breezy, Fawn, Killer...

The title of this thread is "Is Romance Dead?" By itself, it seems to suggest that there was a period of time when people were all about love and that somehow, modern society, in its intricate technological superstructure, its gluttonous hedonistic media, and increasingly disillusioned populace, has suddenly gone from that pursuit of love to pursuit of sex. I disagree with that. I disagree not because I believe there is no romance, (I do believe there are men and women out there who truly believe in romance and would practice it, if given the chance and a partner they'd be satisfied with), I disagree because I don't believe this romance has somehow been significantly more widespread back then than today.

Essentially, I disagree with this notion that society is transforming. I believe that society still has the same social make up, society still has its players, nice men, nice guys, and losers. Society still has playsters, independent women, dopy eyed girls, hoes, and the undesirable. The only thing that has changed over the centuries is how this group of people, these actors, behave. They still have the same goals, same desires, and same skills, the only thing that has changed is the rules. In modern society we have a different way of attracting people, but we still do it. People tend to look at society's transformation on a superficial level, as if the fact that a woman dresses more revealing indicates a complete transformation of her personality. The fact that people dress differently, talk differently, and appear more open about sexuality does not mean they are more sexually inclined, it simply means its more evident for people to see. If you think romance was how they behaved in the 1950's, 1600's, 50BCE, then romance is alive and well. However, if you believe that romance is what people read in Danielle Steele books, see on Lifetime, or hear on the radio, then it was never there to the extent you believe to begin with. People haven't changed that much.

[Innova]

I agree 100%, there really is nothing more I can say...that last post of MVP pretty much hit it. There are more people in the world today, and with techological advances/media its far easier to see as such. Sure we try new things, perhaps try something different..but eventually a circle will repeat itself.

[Fawn]

Okay, I agree with MVP's last statement.
I never said there was a period in which there was just romance. Although it would be nice. I find the only thing that has changed is society's structure and rules towards romance, sex, and individualism. Through all the movements and decades we've gone through, the change is evident.

Ahh how I love romance *sigh* No wonder the romance novel industry is worth billions.

[nomas]

Is Romance Dead?

Everyone posts their opinions with reference to their definition of romance. Some people's definition of romance is intertwined and sampled from a meltingpot of chivalry, sex, love, old-fashioned, conservative values, courtship, manners, etc.

To me, romance is a little bit of each. But I also believe that my definition of romance is different than say a girl I'm courting.

In the end, I think it's not really dead. Whatever your definition of romance, I'm sure you will find examples of it, REAL LIFE examples of it in the world. The world is too big and you cannot know it all, see what goes on elsewhere. I have constant contact with north-mexican culture because this is where my roots are. I have friends and family I frequently visit in the city of Chihuahua, so I'm not so far removed from living that culture. I live in the States so I see this side of it as well..the southwest portion anyway. In all the posts here, I notice a trend that is more Western than anything else. I know there is diveristy, but the fact that we all post in english tells you there is some HUGE level of influence from the western society.

Independant of what your definition of romance is, back to what I was saying, I think there is examples of it in most big cities at least. Big cities are culturally diverse so it's a safe bet that you'll find people courting others in accordance with the romanticism defined by it's culture. The thing to understand, however, is that behavior, like life, is a rollercoaster. It is this way because we humans would get bored seing the same thing everyday. If you are surprised with a flower one day, for no reason, you feel so happy..because it doesn't happen everyday. But if you get a flower every day for ten years, you are not going to feel the same way after your 500th daily flower as you did from the first surprise flower.

Same with romantic behavior. I think that we should not get discouraged and say romance is dead and everyone is so cold now because romance isn't a constant thing. In Chihuahua, guys know what each color of roses signifies: yellow for friendship, red for passion, white for..I don't even know them, but they have their own rules of romanticism to follow for their courtship (as per my definition of romance). Now this doesn't mean they do it 24-7. It's like saying manners no longer exist because not everyone says "thank you" as much or "good morning" to every stranger you pass down the street.

My argument, in a nut shell, is that whatever your definition of romance..you will find it in real life, even if it's just at select periods...but expecting the novel/movie fictional character to happen in the real world..that's a little harder to come by.

Freddie

[LucidDream]

I know what most of the colours of roses represent...
Yellow - Happiness, Friendship & Freedom - Used to represent Jealousy 'back in the day'
Red - Passion, Love & Desire - Symbolises that 'Love is stronger than thorns'
White - Purity, Innocence & Loyalty - Symbolises that 'Love is stronger than death'. Commonly found at weddings
Purple - Fantasy, Enchantment & Mystery - Sometimes used in Royal and catholic ceremonies.
Black - Perfection, Certanty & Goodbye - Mostly interperated as a symbol of death.
Ummmm...
Blue - *strains* ... "oh yeah!" - Miracles, Possibilitys & New Beginings - Often used to symbolise the birth of a baby.
Pink - Apreciation, Appology & Sympathy - The flower of nice thoughts

Im sure there is more but I cant think of any...
oh Orange, almost forgot!

Orange - Warmth, Exitement & Pride - This one is sometimes given to someone who has achived something that others would be proud of.

... damn Im hopeless! lol

Anyway, I love reading everyones replys, you have obviousoly put alot of thought into them!

[cbee]

Hahaha,

All this talk of roses reminds me of a story my French teacher once told us about a massive booboo an English guy made with one of her friends. Basically, in France chrysanthemums (sp?) are the flowers of the dead, you put them on peoples graves etc... and to give one to a living person is tantamount to saying I wish you were dead. So this guy turns up for a date with this french woman with a MASSIVE bunch of, you guessed it, chrysanthemums. Apparently she wasn't too impressed.

[LucidDream]

lmfao, thats pritty funny.
Did he do it on purpose?

[cbee]

Not really, he was English so it was out of pure ignorance. Poor guy though - how the hell was he supposed to know about some random French custom.

Imagine going on a date thinking you've brought this lovely bunch of flowers with you and bam as soon as she opens the door she has a complete personality change and goes all cold on you. Bummer