Is this how relationships should be?

[IndiReloaded]

It turns out that when these passionate couples look at or think about their spouses, a part of their brain called the ventral tegnmental area lights up. This is a section of the brain that is rich in the neurotransmitter dopamine, which is connected to our ability to feel pleasure and joy.

Interesting. So, it seems that this psychologist (ugh) wants to say that the VTA is related to love. Aside from [what should be] obvious in that the 'love' feeling has not actually been shown to be related to the activation of this area (it could due to any number of things), this researcher actually contradicts his own interpretation in a recent paper. Check it out (I will bold the relevant section):

Care to explain this discrepancy, nov13?

J Neurophysiol. 2010 Jul;104(1):51-60. Epub 2010 May 5.
Reward, addiction, and emotion regulation systems associated with rejection in love.

Fisher HE, Brown LL, Aron A, Strong G, Mashek D.

Department of Anthropology, Rutgers University, Newark, New Jersey, USA.
Abstract

Romantic rejection causes a profound sense of loss and negative affect. It can induce clinical depression and in extreme cases lead to suicide and/or homicide. To begin to identify the neural systems associated with this natural loss state, we used functional magnetic resonance imaging to study 10 women and 5 men who had recently been rejected by a partner but reported they were still intensely "in love." Participants alternately viewed a photograph of their rejecting beloved and a photograph of a familiar, individual, interspersed with a distraction-attention task. Their responses while looking at their rejecter included love, despair, good, and bad memories, and wondering why this happened. Activation specific to the image of the beloved occurred in areas associated with gains and losses, craving and emotion regulation and included the ventral tegmental area (VTA) bilaterally, ventral striatum, medial and lateral orbitofrontal/prefrontal cortex, and cingulate gyrus. Compared with data from happily-in-love individuals, the regional VTA activation suggests that mesolimbic reward/survival systems are involved in romantic passion regardless of whether one is happily or unhappily in love. Forebrain activations associated with motivational relevance, gain/loss, cocaine craving, addiction, and emotion regulation suggest that higher-order systems subject to experience and learning also may mediate the rejection reaction. The results show activation of reward systems, previously identified by monetary stimuli, in a natural, endogenous, negative emotion state. Activation of areas involved in cocaine addiction may help explain the obsessive behaviors associated with rejection in love.

PMID: 20445032 [PubMed - in process]

[nerdy_guy]

Interesting. So, it seems that this psychologist (ugh) wants to say that the VTA is related to love. Aside from [what should be] obvious in that the 'love' feeling has not actually been shown to be related to the activation of this area (it could due to any number of things), this researcher actually contradicts his own interpretation in a recent paper. Check it out (I will bold the relevant section):

Apparently, nov13 thinks love is just a mentality. What say you Oh Great Indi?

[IndiReloaded]

Well, I agree that its ultimately chemistry, so I suppose its possible that some people can continue to make these limerance chemicals. My guess is its more of an addiction response (i.e. partners get addicted to each other--this would explain those 'love to hate each other' couples). I'd still need to see more solid proof to believe it, tho. Its not enough to compare new and old couples who are different. I'd need to see the same couples over a period of years to even start to believe this. Like I said, my husband and I get along quite well. We'd even call it 'love' but it is for sure not the same as when we were dating all those years ago.

Its also different from what I know about neurochemistry of attraction. What I know is there is an initial response that is very powerful and seems related to oxytocin but there is a later response that has different pathways.

In any case, the abstract I posted seems to say that you can be 'in love' (undefined except with fMRI) but still be 'unhappy'. So, as usual, the psych research is just a big mess. Did I mention I haven't yet met a psych researcher I found intelligent? Plus, I'm frankly offended that research dollars are being wasted on this when there is so much more worthy uses of fMRI. Its not like these machines are readily available like pipets.

[ecojeanne]

your relationship should not complement your life, it should be your life. It all comes down to how important something is to you. That's how you prioritize. And your life is a product of that.

Actually I hadn’t read the thread until now and this is the craziest statement I have ever heard

Also some of your statements are quite harsh to others when they disagree with you. People can and will disagree on here, no need to be such a bitch about it (altho it is fun to read the backlash). the mistake you made was using the word ‘prove’. You can’t get away with that here! You CAN have an opinion but if cite something as true and you try to prove it by your opinion, It just doesn’t impress. I can see you do believe this but like I already said, don’t be so fcking mean to everyone just coz you THINK you’re right. I think life experience is better than any study out there and I think there are enough people on here with plenty of life experience to know better, but that’s just my opinion. I personally think love is a development that over time you crave because it is a wonderful habit and when it’s gone it not necessarily the person you miss but the feeling and time spent. Generally when breaking up people are left with so much never ending time to fill. That’s the real problem with ‘love’. I think hollywood is most certainly to blame for this fairytale ideal you have. If you let love become your life as you have suggested then you are the one who will be so addicted that you will become depressed. It’s best not to get to overly dramatic about love for your own sake.

And I really thought I was crazy. So you’re the new crazy girl, that’s cool, I love crazy people.

[nov13]

Like I said, I don't care if you don't believe this. I'm trying to help the people who believe and want true love. The people who don't believe it's possible are the ones who can't have it and all they can do at this point is try to prove to others that they can't have it either. People like vashti and indireloaded are just insecure and they don't have what we are speaking of, so they have to shut it down as something impossible, otherwise they'll have to admit they have inferior relationships. I'm being blunt, but it's the truth.

[nov13]

"Actually I hadn’t read the thread until now and this is the craziest statement I have ever heard"

And that's exactly why, you'll most likely never have what we are speaking of. You cannot fathom how valuable a relationship is and how much you have to give to it.

[IndiReloaded]

No intelligent rebuttal so its incorrect assumptions and insults now? LOL, you are such a teenager, thank goodness school is nearly back in session. Keep up the great work convincing everyone.

Meantime, I loved Peter Cook's 'True Wuv' segment from TPB

[nov13]

Where are the insults you speak of? Did I use profanity anywhere? You're the one with the "insult" vocabulary of a 12 year old.

If the truth hurts you, then you should take it and use it to better yourself, not run into a corner and feel insulted.

[ShannonMI]

Where are the insults you speak of? Did I use profanity anywhere? You're the one with the "insult" vocabulary of a 12 year old.

If the truth hurts you, then you should take it and use it to better yourself, not run into a corner and feel insulted.

You did insult all the people that posted on this thread. Just because you didn't use profanity, doesn't mean you didn't insult. I appreciate the article you posted on lasting love. Maybe you should have posted that before all the insults and the BS. You wasted a lot of time and engery on being a jerk.

[ShannonMI]

Where are the insults you speak of? Did I use profanity anywhere? You're the one with the "insult" vocabulary of a 12 year old.

If the truth hurts you, then you should take it and use it to better yourself, not run into a corner and feel insulted.

Do you not consider these insults? These are your words in various posts:

You are not crazy about your husband. You are naive to think that, gigabitch.

Indireloaded, you haven't shattered anything, but your chances to appear somewhat intelligent, and you make me laugh.

Indireloaded, you are a medical "miracle" - you can function without a brain...LOL.

People like vashti and indireloaded are just insecure and they don't have what we are speaking of

[nov13]

1st, 2nd, and 4th are true.

3rd - had to come down to her level so she can understand my post.

[ShannonMI]

1st, 2nd, and 4th are true.

3rd - had to come down to her level so she can understand my post.

Always have to have the last word nov13? You're one of those? Let it go dude, honestly. Time to move on.

[fi123]

I really wish everyone wouldn't keep ganging up on nov13 because she has different viewpoints to other people. It really feels like everyone is gaining strength from seeing that other people are having a go at her and that gives them more confidence to have a go at her. It makes me feel a little uncomfortable to be honest. She may have different viewpoints from other people on here and i'm not saying i agree with things she says but reading the attacks on nov13 is making me feel quite uncomfortable. People are who they are and they have their opinions whether we like that or not. When some people feel attacked they tend to attack back and i think this is what nov13 is doing.

Just because this is on the internet does not mean that good manners cannot prevail. I would not attack someone verbally and personally if i met them say in a bar and they had different opinions to myself but maybe i am alone in that.

Live and let live for goodness sake., Maybe the world would be better place if we all folllowed that stance.

[lahnnabell]

I really wish everyone wouldn't keep ganging up on nov13 because she has different viewpoints to other people. It really feels like everyone is gaining strength from seeing that other people are having a go at her and that gives them more confidence to have a go at her. It makes me feel a little uncomfortable to be honest. She may have different viewpoints from other people on here and i'm not saying i agree with things she says but reading the attacks on nov13 is making me feel quite uncomfortable. People are who they are and they have their opinions whether we like that or not. When some people feel attacked they tend to attack back and i think this is what nov13 is doing.

Just because this is on the internet does not mean that good manners cannot prevail. I would not attack someone verbally and personally if i met them say in a bar and they had different opinions to myself but maybe i am alone in that.

Live and let live for goodness sake., Maybe the world would be better place if we all folllowed that stance.

Shut up.

[fi123]

raspberry lol ....