Oh no! Are you sure?

[misombra]

aaaaaaaaaaaaaajahajaahjajaaaajajahjaaaa.


aaaaaaaaaaaajaajhahajajajajaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaja hhahajajaaa.

[GrkScorp]

My opinion if you're interested

Obviously..

Second, is it really the date spending that worries you? In my opinion the date spending is a very tiny issue compared to other important factors in the relationship like family, culture, understanding, relationship roles, views on raising children, parenting roles, if money is a concern then potential family income when there are children.

Not worried about it..

Back when I was in the market for sex.., and just sex.., my CPF was insanely low.., I had a whole bunch of ways to manage costs.., but I was also younger..

Now.., it's starting to look like a non-for-profit.., but that's because I want to give more.., because now I'm shooting for marriage with this new girl.. and not only in the grand scheme of things does it not matter.., but I want to treat her like the lady she really is.. Plus she's a sophomore in college..

I didn't start the thread because I want to apply the replies to what I do.., I just couldn't get that video out of my head.., I kept thinking.., "that's only how some guys think.., and it's pretty offensive that they chose to represent that kind of guy.., although representing the other kind wouldn't be as funny.., so I can see why they did it".. And then it got me thinking.., "what if they made a video like that for women? what would that part of the video sound like?"

Sorry if I sounded negative there somewhere

Not at all Mish..

I don't honestly care.. Just for the sake of discussion..

I know I'm Greek & Jewish.., and an accountant.. yeah.., I can see how the stereotypes might be misleading.. but at the end of the day.., it's not about the money.., it's about making the other person feel great.. for as long as the other person is being honest and genuine about it.., and not just taking advantage of it.., then I actually insist on paying for her all the way.. forget 50/50.., considering all the garbage that's out there.., I'm more than happy to treat someone like the proper woman they are..

But in the early stages.., you just don't know..

On the first date.., you always go 50/50.., you don't even know the other person.., you might have met somewhere.., exchanged numbers.., and then arranged to meet during the week.., but you're still strangers getting to know each other.. No need for awkwardness or pressure..

After that date.., (which would be the second).., you obviously liked her enough to call her back.. And since that's the case.., I'm assuming you'd want to pay for her..

[1averagejoe]

I say my ex owes me some gift certificates to some fancy restaurant because my wallet was hurting from her wanting to go out soo much. She never ate at home and never wanted to when I suggested it, and rarely offered to pay.

How about you women start hitting on guys and asking them if you could take them out. And pay for dinner, then we'll feel obligated to give you head...

It's a lot harder being a guy.

[Dasein]

As much as society likes to say that females are equal I think there is a long way to go.

In a recent newspaper in Sydney one of the stories was of the differences in pay rates for the same job between men and women. Apparently women even though they are doing the same work are still not getting paid what they deserve.

So in terms of this I think that with many couples (not all) that there is a disparity between income. I think this along with previous social mores has dictated the "man pays" situation.

I personally like to offer to pay. I make a decent living and can't complain but my partner earns significantly more than me so he often pays which he likes and is happy to do.

I don't think there is a general rule however I think that if women don't even do the "reach" for the wallet and it is expected then that is pretty rude.

[GrkScorp]

I say my ex owes me some gift certificates to some fancy restaurant because my wallet was hurting from her wanting to go out soo much. She never ate at home and never wanted to when I suggested it, and rarely offered to pay.

How about you women start hitting on guys and asking them if you could take them out. And pay for dinner, then we'll feel obligated to give you head...

It's a lot harder being a guy.

Not really.., if you put up with it and get pressured into paying for everything.., sorry.., but I have zero sympathy..

When I hear the excuse.. "whoever invites.., pays".., I simply don't ever invite again..

Because you have to consider.., "who ends up doing all the inviting all the time?".., so that little rule might work with friends.., but it doesn't work in dating.. unless you're on the receiving end.., in that case.., I'd be all for it too.. I'd just sit back and expect the other person to invite all the time.., and for me to say.., "you invited.., it's only fair you pay"..

Don't be afraid to ask.. "who's paying?"

That's all you really need to do.., do you honestly think she's going to tell you.. "you of course!"??? That kind of attitude would be an instant-break-up.. No.., she's going to gladly want to spend the day in..

If she has high-taste.., let her pay for it.., watch how fast her high-taste goes away..

Also.., if it's bothering you.., why aren't you talking about it?

"Listen.., I don't think it's fair that I end up paying all the time.."

It's honestly your fault for tolerating it.. AJ..

You end up giving oral anyway.., you end up fcuking her anyway.., sex is something you're both giving to each other.., and I hope it's not in exchange for anything else besides sex..

Aside from that.., and the companionship you both offer to each other.., don't you feel that one person is putting in more into this relationship than the other? Do you really think it's fair? These are all fair-game questions you should throw at her..

If she starts to feed you bullsh*t like "you're the guy".., instant-break-up..

I'm not even kidding.., you have no idea how many girls I've dumped on the spot.., just for sh*tty arguing.. I can't tolerate girly arguments.. lack of logic rubs me the wrong way..

The less tolerance you have for it.., (and I mean ZERO tolerance).., the more 50/50 things will be.. She'll get the idea that you don't tolerate it.., so she'll either stay or go..

Also.., consider this.., what kind of girl would leave a guy.., because the guy didn't think it was fair that he was stuck paying for everything? What is she going to tell herself and her friends? "He thought that it wasn't fair that he had to pay for everything all the time! Can you believe him? The nerve!".., she can't even call you "cheap".., without lying to herself!

There's no excuse for being in that kind of situation..

The women that leave.., are not women you want to be with anyway.., because consider what kind of woman it would take to be able to just leave simply because you're not paying for everything..

The women that would stay.., are women you want to end up paying for anyway.., that's the irony behind it.. These are women who don't have a daddy complex.., don't feel they're entitled to special treatment under traditional gender roles.., and understand the meaning of equality in the relationship.. Which means that you've been overly-excited and overly-generous.. Overextending yourself financially.. You have actually been the cause of your own problem if this is the case.., not her..

A guy has to be either very very desperate.., or very very naive.., to be taken advantage of or manipulated.. Most younger guys are both.., and as they grow older.., some will be less naive.. So.., if I was a woman.., it would be relatively easy for me to toy with you..

But if you have zero tolerance.., then you weed out all the manipulative ones..

Which also follows.., don't treat the ones that are actually worth it the same way.. Learn to tell the difference between a woman who's worth it.., and one who's not.. Once you determine she's worth it.., that she's not that kind of girl.., then it's easy to get overly-excited.., because you obviously want to treat her like your queen.., but do control yourself.., especially if you're still a college student and you can barely treat her like your princess..

[IndiReloaded]

Lastly.., because of my father.., He's been married for 25 years.., 15 of those years have been sexless.., at least between him and my mother..

I can't answer the dating question, obviously, except to say that when I go out w/friends, including male friends, I *always* offer to pay for half. Usually, however, my male friends make *me* feel guilty for offering & will pay. I make up for this in two ways: I make sure I pay for the next lunch, or I make sure they get an extra gift of some kind when we visit (i.e. an extra bottle of grog when we visit). There are many ways to be flexible about this, GS.

Now, I *will* agree with you. Your thoughts have definitely been tainted by your experience, particularly what I've quoted. I think, however, you already realize this. I will therefore only suggest you avoid your father's mistake, which is that he was obviously dishonest w/his wife about his relationship needs. If you want to avoid repeating history, make sure you check your dark spaces about this in your close relationships.

You can start buy simply discussing this current issue, and your thoughts/needs on it, with your partner. Not just this forum.

Good luck w/your new gal, GS.

[lesa]

I don't know anyone who spends $700 a week on dates.

Anyway, my husband likes to pay, and always has. He enjoys being generous. If we invite friends to dinner, he frequently pays. (Obviously, he is selective about who he calls friends.) Not everyone feels taken advantage of or entitled to something just because they open their wallet...

As a general rule, whomever does the inviting should pay. If you can't afford (or don't want to) then don't invite. It's that simple.

PS - don't you think your introduction was a little... odd? Most people just post a thread and ignore the answers they aren't interested in.

That's exactly how the ex-fiance was. He paid every time and when he asked my female friend along or even her husband, he would pay for them too.

He loved going out so he was the one always asking. If the friends invited us then he would pay only for us two if they haven't said anything about paying. I never paid. I also never opened a door in his presence (well maybe 5-10 times in the 7+ years together). The older couples watching loved it!

The current bf--totally opposite. I had to get accustom to opening doors (I didn't mind and had no problems with him not opening doors but I was just not use to it). He pays for dates if he invites and I pay if I invite. We go Dutch if that is discussed before going out otherwise he feels he should pay for some reason. He also believes a woman is not a necessity in his life. She is just an extra fun in his already fun life.

The ex treated me like family...as if we are one as if this is what couples do. The bf treats me like extra fun to his life. Neither expected anything in return that I am aware of. When I gave them presents, they both felt all "teary-eyed special-like". Also, I never expected anything as well.

[lesa]

Now that I think of it, I pay at least $100 USD to date the bf now. It comes out to hundreds per month so it does get a little expensive. I still don't expect anything. When he or I am broke that day, the broke person offers to pay for the next date, or the next, etc. I don't pay for his gas though hehe.

[CherriBlossomGirl]

He also believes a woman is not a necessity in his life. She is just an extra fun in his already fun life.

The ex treated me like family...as if we are one as if this is what couples do. The bf treats me like extra fun to his life. Neither expected anything in return that I am aware of. When I gave them presents, they both felt all "teary-eyed special-like". Also, I never expected anything as well.

Isn't it wonderful to be in a want-based relationship rather than a need-based? I'm in a similar situation. It's so comforting to know that this person does not "need" you around, but likes or loves you so much that the choose to have you. Everything is more sincere. I give a gift for the sake of giving it; I do not even expect or need a thanks in return. Even if he hates what I've given him, I give it because I love him and for no other reason. Not for a thank you, or praise, or to hear he loves it. I hear people say that it sounds weird or sad, but really, it's not. I love my beau more than I've ever loved anyone, but I don't need him. You are the only person (besides my beau) that has said anything about need versus want in a relationship! *hugs*

Back to the dating thing. When you're first dating, I still stick with the invite idea. A lot of the time, the guy would ask me what I wanted to do for a date. If I didn't have a lot of money, I'd suggest something like a stay at home movie night, a picnic in the park, a day trip to the beach, a gallery stroll, etc. If I don't have the money to pay for something, then I don't expect him to have to pay for me. If he specifically invites me to dinner, then looks at me expectantly when the bill comes, pardon my french, but **** off. If you chose to go to the fancy restaurant, then you pay. I came because I was invited, I like you, I want to spend time with you, get to know you, and am thrilled that you want my company! If you were that attracted to me that you wanted to take me someplace nice, I would assume you wouldn't mind paying for the nice dinner. Not because it's the gentlemanly thing to do, but because you: a.Like me enough that you wanted to treat me to a good meal, b.Enjoy my company, and c.Wanted me to enjoy myself. I will never say to a guy, no matter how well I know him, "I love this place! Take me there!" and then not offer to help pay for it or pay for it in full.

Then again, it's not about the money or even where we go. It's about whether he is there or not. If I like him or love him, I don't give a horses ass where we are. We could be in the middle of a stinky swamp. I spend time with him because I like or even love him. I don't care if he pays to take me out to dinner or decides to cook for me instead. What I judge is his sincerity. There is never anything I expect from a date except honesty and sincerity. I don't expect them to pay for nice things. I don't expect them to compliment me on my dress. I don't expect sex or a kiss or a hug or even a thank you. All I want is for them to be open and genuine. If, at the end of the date, we just didn't hit it off, fine. It's not a waste of money or time. I was open, they were open, and we just didn't mesh. No biggie. That's dating. Try, fail, try, fail, try, fail, try, succeed, fail again. Worrying about who pays for what, for me, takes the spontaneity out of it. It's no longer about just enjoying yourself with that person, it's about finances.

Never, ever do I expect a person that I've invited out, friend or otherwise, to pay for the activity that *I* chose. Never. Can you imagine?
"Want to join me at the theatre this weekend?"
"Sure! I'd love that!" You don't even ask what play you're going to see because you're so excited to be spending time with this person that you're attracted to. You don't even know if it's a musical or river dance or stand-up comedy.
You get to the ticket booth. It's a musical. You hate musicals. But he/she is there, so you don't really care. Omg, you get to sit next to him/her in the dark, hands touching, whispering to each other between horribly tacky show tunes.
Exit your daydream and you're back at the ticket counter hearing your date say, "One ticket please."
Pop. Your affection bubble just burst.
The pimply teenager in the box office looks from him/her to you, dressed up for the evening. Confused. "You mean two?"
"Nope, just one. My lovely date will be paying for his/hers."
I've got to be honest. I would walk. Have a nice life, Monsieur ( or Madame ) Cheap-o. P.S. You have the worst taste in plays I have ever seen.

[GrkScorp]

"Want to join me at the theatre this weekend?"

If you stick to your invite rule.., and don't just have it there as a more politically-correct way to get the guy to pay all the time.. "instead of saying.., you're the guy.., you pay.., I'll say.., whoever invites pays.., but you are the guy.., so you have to invite.., don't expect me to do that"..

How often do you throw around invitations like that his way?

Would you say it's more like 50/50.., 40/60.., 30/70.., 20/80.., 10/90.., 1/99?

Honestly..

[misombra]

this thread makes me never want to go on a date ever again.

[CherriBlossomGirl]

If you stick to your invite rule.., and don't just have it there as a more politically-correct way to get the guy to pay all the time.. "instead of saying.., you're the guy.., you pay.., I'll say.., whoever invites pays.., but you are the guy.., so you have to invite.., don't expect me to do that"..

How often do you throw around invitations like that his way?

Would you say it's more like 50/50.., 40/60.., 30/70.., 20/80.., 10/90.., 1/99?

Honestly..

Actually, more often than not, I invite. I would say 70/30. And it's usually to do cheaper, yet more personal things. I'm not really well-off you see. Either that or we decide on things together. I've actually *lost* boyfriends by paying for dates, even 50/50. I actually had one accuse me of trying to emasculate him by trying to pay for the dinner! lol, we didn't go out on anymore dates after that.

Right now, I'm dating someone who lives about 2,000 miles away from me (Sorry, don't feel the need to divulge where). I paid about $1,000 to fly there to see him. He paid for none of it. Not one penny. I insisted. In fact, I thought he might throw a fit if I paid for it myself, so I bought the ticket first and then told him. He would be housing and feeding me, was my argument, so no need to pay for airfare too. We came to agree that it was fair. lol, and we actually ended up breaking it off before my vacay there. Non-refundable ticket. I was able to transfer it to visit some relatives. Even if I hadn't been able to transfer it, no hard feelings. Would I go back and change it? Nope. I love him. I was going there to stay with him because I love him. We're back together now.

So please don't insinuate that I always make the guy pay, or manipulate the situation to make the guy pay. I can see how you might be cynical about it, as many girls do manipulate the guys to get them to pay for everything, but that's not me.

But nice try on attempting to twist my intent into something insincere, sneaky, and stereotypical.

I forgot to add: Again, really, I don't expect invites or fancy dinners or plays. I expect honesty and sincerity. That's it.

[CherriBlossomGirl]

this thread makes me never want to go on a date ever again.

I know. Since when did dating become so calculative and....and...scripted? I like spontaneity!

[GrkScorp]

So please don't insinuate that I always make the guy pay, or manipulate the situation to make the guy pay. I can see how you might be cynical about it, as many girls do manipulate the guys to get them to pay for everything, but that's not me.

But nice try on attempting to twist my intent into something insincere, sneaky, and stereotypical.

Not insinuating or trying to twist.., simply pointing out how it can be abused..

From previous posts.., it's pretty obvious you're not that type of person.. You can't exactly compare a sweet girl from Utah to a spoiled brat from Manhattan..

But do understand.., when you're dealing with people that have aspirations of being actresses & models.., that run around the fashion district.., compete with one another on who is going to have more designer labels on them.., "that b*tch saw my Coach bag and immediately went and got a Gucci! Ugh!".. Women who feel their looks entitle them to things.., then dating becomes very calculated.. At least until you can determine which ones have the personality flaws.., and which ones don't.. Not all of them are like that.. There are some good ones out there who understand just how shallow the rest of them are..

In case you skipped over it.., when I determine she's worth it.., the whole 50/50 goes out the window.., I don't really care if she feels bad about it.., I want her to know she doesn't owe me anything.., I do it because I want to do it.. Not because I feel obligated to.., or because it makes me feel like more of a man.., but because she's worth it..

Before that.., there's nothing spontaneous about it.. Putting on a tight low-cut dress.., push-up bra.., high heals.., and hot pink thong don't exactly compel me in any way to pay.. I'm sorry if other guys have made her accustomed to that in the past.., but I'm not that kind of guy..

When you hear "chivalry is dead".., it's women like that you can thank for killing it..

[CherriBlossomGirl]

But do understand.., when you're dealing with people that have aspirations of being actresses & models.., that run around the fashion district.., compete with one another on who is going to have more designer labels on them.., "that b*tch saw my Coach bag and immediately went and got a Gucci! Ugh!".. Women who feel their looks entitle them to things.., then dating becomes very calculated.. At least until you can determine which ones have the personality flaws.., and which ones don't.. Not all of them are like that.. There are some good ones out there who understand just how shallow the rest of them are..

Gag me. Never understood the mentality behind it. LOL, my friend bought me a Chanel purse for my birthday and all the other girls oohed and ahhed. Uh, sure, thanks? Could you just give me the $400 instead? I could buy 10 purses. I don't envy you having to sift through all the model/actress types. Good luck with that.