Is It Enough?

[Pretender]

I got a question for everyone.

I've been thinking lately about what the "requirements" were to get married to someone or to even stay with them for that matter and I always thought you had to be head over heels in love with them. Now I think all you have to have for the person is love and you must enjoy being around them. I don't think you have to be in love with them to marry anymore because that way you're never dissapointed when you find your partner changing into something he/she wasn't originally. I mean look at the divorce statistics 51% or more marriages end in divorce, it's outrageous. Obviously something isn't working. In other countries they don't marry for love and stay together longer than is normal.

My professor was discussing it today and he finally made me make a decision about what I have to feel to stay with someone. I'm sticking with just loving them and enjoying their company.

I dont know what do you guys think?

[sfalexi]

I think along your lines. You don't have to be "blindsided" or have the thought of living without them want you to end your life or something. I also think that if you love them and have a very happy relationship, it's enough to make it a permanent bond. That's why I think there's PLENTY of girls out there that I could marry because I know there are plenty of girls out there that I can love and have love me back. I'm not looking for any special "one".

Alexi

[sfalexi]

In the meantime, Pretender, "How YOU doin?"

[LightOn]

Divorces happen because people are convinced by society that their lust is "love" We have lost track of the slow paced traditional ways that lasted! We tell ourselves "but it's the 21st century, we have a new trend in this modern time". That's what were doing wrong, mankind has been around how long now? I don't think love is a new trend, Do you? Before marrying be able to determine lust from love but have both for that significant other.

Edit Here is a example story read if ya want

Jack and Jill are married. They live more of a traditional type marraige. Their friend Bob, notices that Jack and Jills relationship seems a little dull and simple. He doesn't understand what keeps them together, so he tries to spice things up for his own relationship. Moving fast getting engaged, wanting his relationship to be better than what he perceives Jack and Jills to be. However Bob's Significant other gets upset from Bob wanting to take care of all the great things of a relationship quickly. Meanwhile, Jack and Jill could not imagine being seperated, because they are, ONE.

[jerzygrl]

Wow, Pretender. You must have a very persuasive professor!

Lets remember that one should not marry because they have too, but because they never want to be without that special person forever. Marraige is not a business agreement.

If you have decided that what you want is to settle with someone because you get along and care about each other, you are selling yourself short and settling. I'd rather be single forever rather than marrying somone I wasn't in love with.

In your post you seem to put a large emphasis on the increasing divorce rate. In regards to that, I have to say 2 things. Number one, I think that being in love with someone is the best thing to base a marraige on, and number 2 what happens if you marry someone your not in love with and then further down the road meet someone who you are in love with?

I dont think that there are REQUIREMENTS to getting married... I just think when you find the right person you know and you will have no doubts....

maybe im living in a fantasy world but I would never marry someone I'm not in love with... i'll never settle

[IceQueen]

The requirement is simple.

You have to know the person in all completeness, and still have no doubts you want to grow old with him/her.

[Pretender]

Cute Sfalexi...


My professor didn't convince me of the fact that to marry because you are "in love" isn't the way to go. I'd just been thinking about it and it made no sense to me to marry someone you are in love with because eventually that person will change. And what will you do once they change, you can't do anything your stuck with this stranger you've known for years and kind of wonder what else is a joke in your life. This is my belief on being in love with someone:

You dont fall in love with the person you fall in love with the image you created of that person, and as soon as something taints that image you find yourself disgusted with the person and yourself for having been so blind. And more than often it's hard to fall back in love with them because the image is and always will be tainted.

Now that to me is like the New Testament in dating.

Jerzygrl I think you are disillusioned to the fact that you will live happily ever after if you are only going to marry because you are in love. Being in love with someone doesn't last forever but loving someone can. Jerzygrl you could be right on the settling factor or you could be immature in the ways of love as of yet.

I agree with IceQueen to an extent. But the fact is you can never ever ever know anybody in completeness. To be honest you don't even know yourself in completeness. There's things thats happened to you that you will never remember yet they affected you in some way.

I used to think like Jerzygrl but now I find myself either a little more mature for not believing in the fairytale relationship or I guess you could pity me for my lack of unrealistic dreams.

[squirrley]

Ok I have to put my two cents in here...and this is only my OPINION:

I think that you have to understand that there are about a trillion other prof's out there that will either disagree with yours or stand behind him. Its up to the individual THEMSELVES to decide who they want to marry and their own reasons or if even if they want to get married period.

I wouldnt marry someone just because I loved him. There are so many different kinds of love that its so reduntant to say that you can marry someone just for love. WTF? You gonna marry your brother?

When you fall in love with someone its completely unconditional...
and Ice is right to some extent-you should know that person AS completely as you can. Yes people do change thats NOT a bad thing...if its in the context that that person IS growing.

I guess I personally disagree with your Prof. And truly you need to make your own decisions on this issue dont base on it what hes lecturing on...this isnt something that can be taught. I think this class gives people a different outlook maybe. But in truth in todays society its easy to get married and easier to get divorced for 99 bucks. ITs sad.

Well-I wonder why? Because he(your prof) feels as though you dont have to be in love with your partner, just love is enough?
ya know the old saying "sometimes love just isnt enough?"

This whole thing of falling in love with the image of that person?
Im sorry but its THAT person himself/herself that put you there to start off with, the things that they say or do, how they make you feel...MAKE YOU FEEL...thats not an image, thats fact. Also YOU set your own expectations...you are responsible if those expectations arent met or have failed.

I think what Jerzygirl meant was that she herself is comfortable in knowing what she is looking for in a partner and what she wants out of a relationship-thats healthy. And its NOT unrealistic to wait for the right person. She is wise in the fact that shes NOT gonna settle for just anyone in spite of just loving them.

Pretender-everyone gets burned somewhere in there life...for those who dont God Bless them, but it puts a stinger in your ass you cant remove it feels like. And leaves a bitter taste so that you dont want to get involved again, but you get back up pull the stinger out for crying out loud and enjoy life to the max.

I guess I disagree with your theory or thoughts on marriage or your requirements...but it is YOUR own...and its what YOU are comfortable with so thats all that matters. Everyone is entitled to their own thoughts...

[Pretender]

Squirrley I know there are a bunch of professors out there and it wasn't even the fact that he was a PROFESSOR just the fact that he shared the same opinion as me that helped me to finally make up my own mind. I'm not making him into a deity, god help me.

Your comment on marrying your brother was just kinda immature. You know what I am talking about when I say you love someone enough to marry them, I didn't know I had to be so specific in everything.

I never said change was a bad thing its a wonderful thing. It helps you mature and become a better person. What I was trying to say is if you fall in love with someone say when your 19 get married have kids by the time your 34 he is NOT going to be the same person you fell in love with. Where does that leave you???? Are you in love or do you just love him. I believe you just love him. Love is unconditional it bends and changes along with the couple. But being in love is something different and special that won't last no matter what anyone wishes to think.

I don't know if you have ever been married or not Squirrley but your not married now and he is so I would take his opinion just based on experience. It's not like hes some quack whos just preaching to his disciples. He's sharing his life stories and lessons with us and if you choose not to believe statistics and what people say from experience then it's your choice.

You may set your own expectations but you are NOT responsible if the person doesn't meet them. You either have to expect less or get over it. And you do fall in love with the image of a person. I've learned that from experience. You could be dating a drug dealer with 8 kids he doesn't support and hes in a gang and still love him with all your heart because in your mind he is a good guy when in reality and society he needs to change because hes whats wrong with America.

I've never felt like I was settling for anyone, maybe it's because I don't feel I'm better than anyone. We're all equal in our own little ways. And I know what I want in a partner without a doubt I know. Who are you to decide if you are settling for someone or not? It's either you love him or you don't, you know?

Can I ask you a question Squirrley? Who do you know that has met Mr. Right? Mr. Right is an image we create in our heads. you will never find Mr. Right you will have to give and take. Get over his flaws and focus on his attributes. You're living in a dream world if you think you will find Mr. Right. Mr. Right is who we make him. No one will ever be perfect we just learn to deal with that because it's not POSSIBLE. So in effect we "settle" for the closest we can get to Mr. Right.

I agree with you about people getting "stung" but what does that have to do with what we are talking about? Getting stung is healthy it makes us stronger.

[sfalexi]

Can I ask you a question Squirrley? Who do you know that has met Mr. Right? Mr. Right is an image we create in our heads. you will never find Mr. Right you will have to give and take. Get over his flaws and focus on his attributes. You're living in a dream world if you think you will find Mr. Right. Mr. Right is who we make him. No one will ever be perfect we just learn to deal with that because it's not POSSIBLE. So in effect we "settle" for the closest we can get to Mr. Right.

This is what I've been saying all along in these posts. What I look for is someone who's very close to what I envision as the "perfect woman". Then I try to almost 'mold' her to be my perfect woman. Obviously you have to be in the relatoinship for a while, but if your perfect woman has shoulder length hair, and yours has short hair, ask her to grow it out. If your perfect woman loves bowling, take her once in a while and teach her and try to get her interested. She'll do it FOR YOU if she truly cares about you.

And it's a two way street. I know I'm not "Mr. Perfect" for anyone. But I'm willing to make sacrifices and comprimises to become as close to that person's vision of perfection as I can if I love them. I wouldn't change anything MAJOR about myself (like if they told me to stop playing the clarinet, I'd have to kick them to the curb REAL quick!), but small things that are virtually pointless I'll do. Especially if I know it'll make them happy.

Alexi

[squirrley]

First Pretender-I am a little older and have several friends who are married-divorced and do know people who have been married for 20 to 60 years. So my thoughts- alot of them generate from it. I can see why they are still married...

I meant no harm in the brother comment-but it was to prove a point that love comes in different ways, and I felt by your prof he wasnt instituting the feelings of being in love, is all I am saying.

As far as the Mr. Right-yea you can find that person if you have an idea of who you want to be with-he doesnt have to be 'perfect 'and I never said anything about that in particular. Some of my friends think they'll just drop out of the sky. But no one is perfect. And I think its ludacris the UPS man will bring him by. But as you go along in life and date different people you LEARN what it is you want in a partner, what you look for in someone, or what you dont want in a relationship-hence you form your ideal partner.

As far as settling-hell people do it all the time! Its no big secret and people admit it to me-insecurities, financial instabilty, not wanting to be alone-and they are miserable. But I know these people and theyve reached a point where love didnt matter, they clicked and it was enough for them. But not for me. I want an equal partner. Not someone above me or below me, but one to stand with, next to, and then behind in support of our eachothers goals, and or major decision making. My gosh I could go on about that forever, but heres the deal-most people think there is a Mr./Mrs. Right, its the norm in todays society. But as you grow older you know what you want. ITs up to the person themself to know it and know it from within.

The expectations are your own. Do you not set them yourself?
And who would be responsible if they dont meet them? Are you going to blame the guy because he didnt meet up to par? YOur expectations? HEll no-cause you placed the bar initially. This totally goes hand in hand with the Mr./Mrs. Right. Am I right? You expect him to be perfect-(I of course know better and never said anything about it myself) I have expectations I want from a potential partner. If I feel he doesnt fulfill those needs or wants then I move on...its not HIS fault if he doesnt stand up to them. Hes just the not the right guy for me. That simple. But I am not ignorant in the fact things will happen...it goes both ways. But you love them for who they are not what they are not.

Maybe thats where people like to blame failed marriages, that person didnt cut the mustard. WHY? Because he failed in meeting our own expectations. I think everyone has their own idea of who there Mr. Right would be-and its not up to us to say he doesnt exist. Because we dont know what it is they are looking for. To each their own.

Your prof has the right to lecture on his own experiences...its great that he can share them...gives a different outlook. I couldnt state the What its like to BE married, but sure do know what I want BEFORE it.

I think you and I have an understanding of eachothers opinions and I respect yours because they are yours...I just have a different view based on my experiences. Neither one of us are wrong-but its our own.

The getting stung does have a lot to do with what we are talking about-it shapes us as a person and how we view love-ie: what level of love does it take to get married now? Or will I feel enough to make that kind of commitment with someone. (sorry had to say why i said it)

Ya know when I had a friend who found their Mr. Right-he wasnt right for me, but he was for her. Its all with what you expect and what you want for your own life....

You have brought a valid point to the board...and it shows people do have different expectations for themselves. High or low-they are our own.

[IceQueen]

Can I ask you a question Squirrley? Who do you know that has met Mr. Right?

Well, me. She knows me, of course.

[BillyGalbreath]

The 'one'. Soul mate. Insignificant other. Mr/Mrs Right.

There is no such a thing.

In the society that we live in today everything is constantly changing. Technology gets better, faster, stronger. We rely on new things more and more. Constantly changing.

When things change the world, the world changes us. People are always changing. People change to their surroundings. I know this very well. When the world changes, the person changes, and when the perosn changes, feelings change.

People grow out of love... People grow into love... Love grows out of people... And Love grows into people...

My ex wife was a country girl to the bone. She used to live in a small town near the border of Texas and Louisiana called Orange. She was a pure girl, very smart, very sweet... She met a guy from the 'bad' side of town and became 'thuggish'. Her life changed then for the bad. She got into trouble all the time. Got hooked on drugs... etc... She ended up getting kicked out of her Aunts house and was forced to move to Houston with her mother (where she met me)

I was not thuggish, I was not into drugs... I was in a relationship that was kinda rocky because myself was going through a change before she came. I was graduating high school... that should say enough about that... Well I got her out of doing most drugs (cocaine, speed, pills...) and she got me into doing weed...

It was a weird change for both of us, but we were happy together... We had common ground... We fell in love... And no this was not lust. It was real love, stronger than I had felt love the first time...

Well after about 6 months of doing weed everyday I got tired of it and decided that I was going to quit... Since we were in love she decided she would change with me and quit too... Things we great because we lasted through a change together... We grew up if you will...

Well her look on life changed because she did not like the life i had to offer... She decided to meet new friends and she went through another change. She became a stripper... I did not change this time I stayed the same because I was happy living the married life...

When she became a stripper she changed biggest ever. She met new friends, women as well as men... She was introduced into a new lifestyle which I was not living... She adapted to it... Started to do the things these strippers did... Prostitution, masive amounts of drugs, drinking constantly...

I then was starting to adapt to this lifestyle also... Staying up all hours of the night... sleeping all day... doing drugs... drinking constantly... meeting new women.... but i never had sex with any of them no matter how close it came to that... I was happily married...

I realized that I was happily married and I did not like the way I was changing nor the way destine was chaging... She did not change back to the way she was when we met... or hte way she was when we were both happy... she changed again into someone that was not in love with me... but in love with her drugs and men that payed her for any little thing she did...

She left me and now I have changed because of it... I do not yet know how I have changed exactly but I know that I have never been more healthy.. I dont drink, i dont do drugs, I dont party anymore I am sick of partying... I have a great job... I have money in my pocket... I am no longer struggling... I am alone for the first time since kindergarten... ...

The point of this is that there is no one person that you were meant for and there never will be... Everyone changes with their surroundings... The one you fall in love with is always in your surroundings... And just remember that all things will change... your surroundings will change you. they will change the one your with... if you dont change in the same direction then it is not going to work...

And yes i will admit sometimes people will go through the same changes together for awhile... some will change together their whole lives... some people wont change at all...

But to have a perfect match as you and go through all these changes the same way is very very rare...

Not all the marriages that work out are not because of this reason... Some marriages last because they become dependent upon each other... Marriage brings two people together to benifit the other person... and sometimes the benifits do not include love at all...

So thinking about this... What IS love ? What is its true meaning ? Does it even really exists in this ever so changing world ? Or is it just another weakness to the human race ? A figment of our imagination that we strive to get, that we put ourselves through hell to try to find...

The world is always changing... It is changing right now as you are reading this...

If love really exists does it change too ?

And if it does change then is there really a special 'one' for each of us ?

From the Journal of Innova
Words of Wisdom #4
"Lifes changes are like a moving river, whats here today is gone tomorrow, and tomorrow is a whole new journey, lets move forwards...and live."

~From Legend of Drunken Master (With Jackie Chan)

[squirrley]

GO ICEEY!!!!

[BillyGalbreath]

I am not icey... I am just stating what I have learned about this situation... Thats all... I would call it an opinion of mine, but I believe in it too strongly to do that...