Suffering and Jealousy (not bad though)

[Bonovox40]

First of all, the title isn't as bad as it sounds, there's 2 parts to this.
The first is the "suffering". I talked to Betty last night and she told me that she feels that even though we may suffer being apart, that this is something
special and worth suffering through to have thatchance to be together again after the summer. That, if we didn't have to suffer and face hardships in this
relationship, that we wouldn't value it as much or know it's something special, rather then if it was easy or simple.

The other part is jealousy. She is a little jealous at times but she tells me she doesn't want to feel that way , it's just hard knowing what she sees in me and thinks other girls will see it too. Last night I told her that my friend Steve wants me to go with him and his wife, to take his friend who's visiting from California, to a Chicago dance club. I told him i'd go because he wants me to come, not because I really want to go. I was honest with Betty and told her this.

She wasn't upset but she felt a little disheartened because she knows I will be in a place where men and women dance and she is not there with me to share that, and will worry that women will hit on me. I told her "I am not going to meet women, or even dance with women. I'm only going to be with my friends and dance or drink with them." She said that "I know I cannot ask you for anything, it's only been 2 weeks, I am sorry that I feel like this inside I know it's not right to act like this towards you. I believe you that
you will not be with other girls or things like this, but I know that I will have trouble sleeping because I will be thinking of you. It's just that my ex behaved
like this but in a bad way and did not care that I thought of him."

I tried to reassure her and said "Honetly, I usually only go to clubs maybe oh...once a year." she goes "Oh, thank you thank you so much! I'm so glad you are not like that!" I said "I like to go out and have fun with friends or gf's, but we hardly ever go to clubs. If I had a gf that wanted to go with me, it would be different but nobody has so far." she said "Maybe when I am done with camp, we can go somewhere together and dance." I told her that would be fun. She said "Please do not think I do not want you to go out and have fun, I want you to. I will just miss you as always." I told her that i'd love for her to come with if she could, there's no question of that. She did ask me if I drink alot and I told her "only one or 2 drinks the whole night. I want to be able to think clearly." and she asked "If you had more, would you...not be able to think and be bad?" I said "No, no. I've never done anything bad when drinking like you think of. Besides, I will not drink more than 1 or
2 that is how I always am. I do not enjoy just drinking for the sake of drinking." (She basically wanted to know that if I drink that i'll lose my
inhibitions and go after some women. I'm not like that, never have been.)

We also talked about our pasts a little. I told her that I have learned from past relationships that I have to be myself, and explained to her how I put on a cocky/macho front with Joy, but that wasn't really me. I explained to her that Joy fell in love with the fake me, not the real me and that when she figured out who I really was, she wasn't happy. Meanwhile, I wasn't happy not being me either so I want to just be me with her and see how she feels about who I really am. Betty said "I did the same thing with Tony. The
first 2 years I acted like someone else, and then when I just was me, he didn't like me anymore. But I stayed and tried to work things out. It was so hard work to be someone else and I wasn't happy doing that. I know
now that I have to have someone love me for who I am, not what I hope they would want." (same sentiments exactly!) I told her "I am stronger now, for being weaker in the past and learning from it."

We did talk about nice things too. She said how when I touch her, it makes her feel in ways she has never felt before from anyone, even Tony when she was in love with him. She said that nobody has ever touched
her (and I don't mean just sexually) with the kind of passion and emotion that I have and that she knows now what she has been missing in her heart. I was really surprised at that and that cleared up ALOT of doubt I
was feeding myself unnecessarily. She is a BIG romantic at heart and was commenting at how beautiful the moon looked through the trees that
night and how bright the sky was. I told her that "I do not need the moon, all I need is you, to light my way through the night." I could hear her melt through the phone. ;-)

I did get confirmation to come visit Sunday from "Grandma" on the phone and then told Betty. She was SOOO excited and couldn't stop saying "Thank you, thank you God for this." It will only be for one day and we will not be able to be close to each other, (kids and Nazi Nancy are there) but we will be
together again and that's what we both want.
So good times ahead I think, even with times getting
difficult. I'm excited at the possibilites for good things with her.

[jslaughter]

It sounds like whatever misgivings you were having are sliding away. . .

I suspect coming from where Betty is coming from - a little jealousy is normal, and admitting that she feels jealouse is okay - acting like a psychotic nut isn't and she ISN'T doing that.

It sounds like you have similar attitudes on being able to make sacrficies to be together.

Two thumbs up . . . sounds good. Let us know how the visit goes.

[Bonovox40]

I will. "Grandma" said "I don't know what Nancy will say about you coming...oh screw it, I want you to come, you better come visit us!" (jokingly) I told her I would be sure to and i'm bringing some xmas lights as my excuse as asked by Grandma for a birthday party decoration.

It's kind of ironic. The more I compare Betty and myself, the more similarities and life experiences relationship-wise, we've shared. It's like we kind of equal out in the equation of everything. I don't know if that's always good or not, but it's interesting nonetheless. At least i'm happy that with what she's been through, she seems to KNOW what she wants and is ACCEPTING of that, instead of fighting herself because she isn't sure. I think she knows her doubts of me are a result of her past and she understands that and is trying to base what I/We have done/showed each other rather then what her ex has done. It is difficult at times and I know this first hand also. I am understanding about it. I'm curious how I can go out Tonight or Sat night and ease her worries without looking like i'm adjusting my life to fit all her concerns. You know what I mean? I want us to live our lives and trust, but I don't want to be a dick and be like "Well, I want to go out with my friends, you can worry all you want but i'm not going to mess around. I know you trust me but that you'll worry and I can't do anything about that." I know it's kinda unfair in a way, but also that there will always be concerns at time and that I shouldn't have to change my life/friends to accomodate her and vise versa. I KNOW she is not asking for that (like Robin was) but it's still kinda a torn feeling with that I feel good for going out with friends, but bad that i'm causing her some grief and self doubt.

What do you think I should tell her or do to ease her mind?

[jslaughter]

What do you think I should tell her or do to ease her mind?

let's face it if this works out as more than a summer thing there are going to be lots of times when you are in the position of doing things without each other. Go with your friend - it sets a bad tone to back out because of your budding relationship. (If it conflicted with time you could be spending with her that would be different.)

Assure her everytime you talk to her before you leave that this is about spending time with your friends and the first time you talk to her afterwards let her know that it was a nice place and you can't wait to share it with her or that even her company couldn't have salvaged the evening - when you go dancing you will find somewhere better to go. (Comments like that let her know she was on your mind while you were out.)

And if some girls hits on you - if you opt to share that information you get a 10 yard penatly for over-sharing. It will not secure her fears to know you didn't fall for this chick - it will confirm her suspicions that other chicks are going to be after her man!

[squirrley]

Girl you beat me to the punch on this one-

Bono-youve got a WOMAN who knows what she wants and has had some experience vs-Joy. So go with the flow on this one. You guys have a lot to learn about one another and as things come you will learn it. Like the whole going out bit-of course she feels shes found gold in you and may have insecuritites about it-but youve established yourself in this situation-youre not a partier! Youre going out with your friends and youve told her-you couldve very well not have...shes got to you credit for the truth. And I agree whole heartedly with Jules-dont share if you were hit on-cause we knows its bound to happen we just to want to know about it.

Let her know you had a nice time and wished she was there with you-youre doing great so far-you guys are establishing trust and open commmunication you MUST have this with a long distance relationship right now.

As for her telling you she loves this soon-well shes forthright-and OPEN to the gills she wears her heart on her sleeve and let you know it-dont fret that right now-its all good. Take your time though in that department. If youre NOT ready to tell her youre in love with her DONT tell her-just let her know you do care about her and you have feelings for her-just reassure her things are fine and youre working together for the same goals!

Goodluck to you Bono-this sounds like a more stable possible relationship! KEEP THOSE LINES OF COMMUNICATION OPEN!!!!

[Killerbabe]

About jealousy ~

I was in a long-distance with my boyfriend for three and then four months in a row with the exception of seeing each other for two weeks in Costa Rica in between those 7 months.

It sounds crazy but I've never been jeaous back then. Never. Because when Mike left I knew exactly how he felt about me, we've spent lots of starry nights together telling how much we're in love with each other. So when he left I was so blindfolded with love I never even thought of Mike hitting on some girl. Never even crossed my mind.

Besides, we called each other all the time and talked for hours... Mike wrote me e-mails saying that every time some girl tries to talk to him he gets an image of me in his mind and just looks through the girl and almost ignores her. Things like that really enhanced my trust in him

However, when I came out to live with him together something happened. I wasn;t as confident anymore...for reasons I can't really find. I really became insecure when I came to the states. I felt incompetent, different, and...let's just face it, not good enough. I was just kind of scared of American girls. They really are different from Russian girls. Everyone has nice and straight teeth, long thick hair... good genes, in a word. Also, I was a lot thinner (still am), I literally felt like there was LESS of me, lol. That's when I started getting jealous.

Another reason to a girl's sudden jealousy might be that in the midst of growing used to each other guys often stop saying the things they used to say, act a certain way. All in all, they're suddenly back from the "la-la land" and are not as crazy and passionate for you anymore. Mind starts wandering...heart loosens its grip, body aches for something else. I am yet about to find out what happens after. is it something we will overcome and learn to deal with or have we reached Final Fantasy Game Over?

[squirrley]

You brought up a great point Killa-having the fantasy being over-Bono-DONT ever stop saying those nice things-you feel them...tell her!

[Killerbabe]

Exactly, there can NEVER be too much.

[jslaughter]

Bono I think you are the coolest and I am not trying to get off your topic, but I just felt the need to comment that perception is such a funny thing . . .Killa came here and felt like there was something wrong with the fact that she was so thin and most of my friends are on some diet trying to be thin. I have a friend in Moldova and I am often shocked when he sends pictures seeing how thin the girls are and how jealous my friends would be!

So women's (maybe people's but definately women) peception is a strange thing - - she may be a super model like Killa and not feel like she's up to par. Make sure you remind her.

[Bonovox40]

I don't think I can stop saying nice things. I even still said nice things when my 3 yr relationship was dying. I wasn't happy but I still tried to make her happy. I'd still be affectionate, i'd still listen to her concerns, i'd still give her my time and sacrificied for my own happiness. It sounds as though Betty is the same way. I feel sorry for her that she was unhappy for so long because I know just how it feels.

When we were at camp alone, I told her that i'd give her a massage. She said "Ok, as long as I can give you one too." Do you know how GOOD it felt to hear that? I honestly must have given Robin about 384 massages in the span of a year. Many of those were time consuming and she fell asleep during them but I continued because I knew I was helping the tissues in her back, shoulders etc. I did it out of love, not because she would roll over and want sex or something. (like I said, she fell asleep about 90% of the time) Do you know how many massages she gave me in one year?....two...2 freaking half assed massages. "My hand hurts, I'm going to stop now." All selfish from her and selfless from me. But I did it because I loved her and cared for her. I didn't want anything in return, I never asked. (but sometimes i'd try and turn it into erotic massage, but not often enough that she should be afraid to give me a massage you know?) So anyway,

I give Betty a massage and she totally enjoyed it. Then I let her do it back to me. (She told me later that just me LETTING her take PART IN me feeling good, and accepting what she WANTED to GIVE me, made her feel wonderful inside. Her ex would reject her affections and such and she said how much she always just wanted to be able to give. How she would be happy to get nothing back if she could only give a little.)
She said she could see me smile and I reached back and stroked her leg with my fingers. After she was done, I think she could've cried but I didn't see it at that moment. She just looked into my eyes, and looked and looked. I've never had anyone look at me that way before. I was so taken aback that I finally smiled and said "what is it?" She just smiled and shook her head and said "I can't express in words..."
That moment was a BIG indicator to her that she really likes who I am. Just one more reason to accept who I am in her eyes.

[jslaughter]

Ok - you are making me get tear eyed at work - stop!!! LOL

I am glad that you are happy - to me that's what matters most.

[squirrley]

AWW-see how things turn out here? Youve finally gotten into something where youre getting back without even asking-wow Bono-its about time! I know the feeling too FINALLY!

Youre a giving person and sounds like Betty is too-go with the flow on this one-and do what you can to see where this will go-she sounds like a keeper!

I think just about everyone has been there Bono in the give give give thing and get shit right back..I didnt mean to laugh at your expense on the massage issue but that held true for me too! Youve someone who likes you for who you are...stick with it!

[Bonovox40]

So women's (maybe people's but definately women) peception is a strange thing - - she may be a super model like Killa and not feel like she's up to par. Make sure you remind her.

Oh, I do and trust me, I LOVE telling her things like that because it really is coming from me. I don't flatter just to BS and make someone giggle or something. My friends all say she's the hottest girl i've dated but I don't look at her like that. Of course I find her physically attractive and alluring, but it's like I can say endless things complimenting her about just who she IS and how she makes me feel. I don't think there's ever any substitute for a kind word about someone's personality/heart as opposed to just physical features. But I do comment on those too.

Like when I told her that "I don't need the moon if I have you to light my way through the night." and if that was the whole conversation and I hung up, that would've been enough for her to be satisfied. I like to tell her one good thing about her every day that we talk. Even little things like saying "You have such a big heart for taking the time to make those children smile and their eyes twinkle under your kindness."
She goes nuts when i'm just honest about what I see in her. I don't even have to say something about her directly, but you understand.
The women I have loved in my life, I never NEVER get tired of trying to make them laugh, smile, and feel good about who they are and how I feel about them, even when times are bad. I can be pessimistic, but when i'm with someone I love, i'm an optimist to a fault.

[jslaughter]

sniff sniff

Are you sure you don't have a single older brother? One who got some of your good genes

[Bonovox40]

Maybe someday I should just start writing mushy romance novels. It seems natural for me to just spout everything off like this, even if it's explaining someone else's experience. I've been told that i'm a decent writer. I just think i'd critique my work all too fiercly. "Trials of a "nice guy": How to be 2/3rds of what women want *and into the trashcan it goes! 2 points!* :-P lol!