Confusion, an ex, lies and the justification of it

[BadRobot]

Hi

Basically I can't use the line "to make a long story short" because in order to get proper advice all the facts should be put out there so this problem has n lengthy explanation...you will be reading for about 3 to 5min just to warn you.

Been dating her for almost 5 years...I am her first long relationship, previous being 3months. First ever intimate partner. Got engaged too early at 6months, engaged for a year and broke it off because she got accepted into physical therapy which meant another 4years of student life and we couldn't build a life yet as two young working adults.

We are two very stuborn people. We are strong about our opinions and this generally caused a lot of fights. We would fight almost every week. Although it must be said the reason for our fights never grew from anything serious. Our problems should have been easily resolved...stuff like friends, difference in opinion, back chatting, harse words etc. Never anything serious like cheating or beating one another.

Before I met her she had like a non serious relationship with someone abroad. Longest time they spent together was 2 weeks. When I met her and heard about them two still talking I immediately told her friends I am backing off. No way I am going to compete for someone's affection. They reassured me that he is basically out of the picture and she is way more in to me. I then demanded she break it off for us to begin seeing each other. She agreed.

Apperently the guy spoilt her rotten and treated her like a princess which in my opinion is common in any fresh relationship because one always tries to put your best foot forward. The same could be said for me and that I too treated her wonderfully during the kick off of our relationship.

During our time together we would fight often. Couples do fight and when it gets bad I believe that both are equally responsible. This only when both contribute to it and when bad words and behaviour are dished out by both parties. At the time of our engagement, 1 year into our relationship and after one bad fight, she texted her ex who was abroad telling him that she missed him. He knew she was engaged and told her to stop and respect her fiancé.

She did tell me afterwards and her excuse was that she missed how he treated her. I told her that I respected her honesty but that I will not allow it again. I explained to her that she was with me and chose to be with me. If she believed she made the wrong choice she should leave me and persue someone else. I never have any contact with my ex girfriends simply because I believe that they should stay in the past. She promised me that it would never happen again.

She is a firm believer in honesty. She lives by it. Although I do feel honesty is very important I am someone easily tempted at telling white lies. For example I enjoy a bit of gambling, she hates it and gets upset when I have some fun with my spare cash. On more than one occasion I would lie about going gambling which I know I should rather not do...

Getting to the point.... The other morning, almost 5 years into our relationship, she came to me in tears. A friend of the same ex bf wanted to know if he could give her number to her ex because he requested it. She was crying because she thought I might get angry if her ex texted her. I comforted her by saying I would never be angry with her for something out of her control. I explained that if he did by chance contact her that she should tell me about it first and then we would deal with it. I also mentioned that I would appreciate it that when he does contact her she must inform him to not bother her because she is in a relationship. That night I got a feeling and asked her if we might see if he has friend requested her on Facebook. She freaked out and started a fight. I took her phone and I saw 3 new unread text messages from his foreign number. I put her phone down and said that she sould be honest with me about what is going on. I asked her to tell me if this was the first time he contacted her and she said yes. I was sceptical and assured her that she could tell me the truth if they had been talking and if I was not pleased I would get upset, walk out the house, cool off outside but would not fight with her.

She assured me she knew nothing about the text messages and that she didn't even read them. I again gave her the opportunity to come clean and she stuck with her story. I accepted it and asked her what she was going to do about it. She told me that she was curious as to what he had to say because his 1st message stated that he wanted to tell her things he can't do over sms. I then went on to ask her if it even matters because we both knew he was going to confess his feelings. She again made it clear she was curious.

After a long talk without any fighting, and note we do fight a lot, she was so pleased we could resolve it peacefully that she said she would ignore him. She deleted the messages. The following morning I was still not at ease. I began fishing. Turns out they were talking. He said that he was thinking about her the past few days and she texted back wanting to know more.

I lost it because she lied about not talking to him. Got in my car and left the house. She had been lying to me after numerous opportunities to tell me the truth. This bothered me because someone who lives by honesty and lies makes one doubt anything else they ever claimed to be truthful. I know we all make mistakes but some lies bare higher consequences than others. Lying is still wrong but lying about cheating feels more treacherous than lying about how much you had to drink for example.

I am not accusing her of cheating. I need advice. To me it feels like she is tempted. She is curious and wants to keep her options open type of thing. Either she is not over the guy or she is looking for a way out. I ended the relationship. Should I stand for the second offence, that I know of, or should I just send her on her way? To me lying about serious things puts doubt in my head about the whether other serious things are true. I quote from Johnny Depp comes to mind. A dishonest person you can always trust to be dishonest. Its the honest ones you should be careful of.

Have I made the right choice? Am I right by not being able to trust her when it comes to being tempted by het ex or any other guy. She states that she loves me dearly and that she did nothing wrong. To me wanting to know more after a guy expresses his feelings is looking for trouble. We have been having problems but why not just leave me? If its so unbearable with me then end it. She says she doesnt want him but me. Any advice?

[Wakeup]

I'd lie to you too... out of fear because you sound like a controlling, insecure tyrant who has verbally abused this woman and tried to control her like she was 13 and you were her over anxious father afraid that she'll actually start to be a tad independent of him.

If you don't trust her to be the person you expect your life partner to be then do her the kindness of letting her go so she can either sink or swim. You trying to run her life the way you have been is ridiculously codependent and inappropriate towards a grown person. She can change on her own if she actually WANTS to but if she doesn't want to change then quit trying to force her to. You've ended the relationship so keep it ended and while you're single try to fix your need to control.

Let her to it. When you're gone then you can quit lying to her about your gambling as well. Find someone who you don't have to lie to. Your ex will be free to do the same or suffer the consequences with the next guy as well if he's as unyielding as you appear to be. Relationship boundaries have to be mutually agreed to... not arbitrarily set by you and she is expect to adhere to them. If she doesn't agree then you're with the wrong person.

If you didn't want her talking to him then why would you suggest she give him her number but tell you when he contacted her... that's a shit test you gave her and yet another way you tried to control her.

Why not just tell her "no, he's gone from your life and I'd feel better knowing he stays gone. What do you think about that, dear?" Instead of how you handled it which just ended up in the shit storm that it did.

[BadRobot]

I value your opinion. Thank you. Could you please explain to me in what way I am controlling? My words may have come across wrong so I would like to clarify...

Firstly I have no idea why she would be afraid of telling me about something like her ex texting her. Never have I been demanding or controlling. She has the freedom any person should have. She goes out without ever having to consult me. I never snoop on her phone because why would I invade her privacy. She would come home late hours without me knowing where she was and without me caring. Just a hello how are you. No questions. No snooping. No problem. Things a controlling person probably would do or not do.

Am I wrong to expect her to break it off with someone else before we start dating? If my ex girlfriend texted me wanting me back or either proclaiming her feelings is she entitled to know about it or not?

What is it about what I said that makes me sound like a tyrant? The reason I posted her was to make sure if I am in the wrong. I only wanted her honesty. I asked her gently if they had been talking and she lied to me. Why? She wanted to cover up their conversation. Am I wrong for not allowing my fiancé to send I miss you text messages the her ex? Am I wrong for not allowing such behaviour? Because if I am then I have been going about relationships all wrong. I didn't know flirting and secret texting was allowed.

If my words came across as controlling then I just didn't use the correct ones. So if you could tell me how my behaviour seems harsh please point them out. I will then reflect on them. Thanks =)

- - - Updated - - -

For the record I didn't tell her to give him her number. He was looking for it through one of HER friends. I had no idea he was looking for it untill she said so. I told her that if he did get it and contact her then that won't be her fault. Obviously... My concern would be if they did start flirting and she keep it from me.

[Wakeup]

I suggest you read back your own post and when thinking about what I've said, you may actually be able to recognize where you were being controlling. I'm not going to go back and point out where you have been each and every instance as my post explains where I think you were trying to control already.

I will add to what I've already said by pointing out that you and her frequently bickering and at logger heads with one another are symptoms of two very suborn people who are showing one another that you both may be of the "its my way or the highway" mind-set and so she may also be trying to control you in some way.

Anyway... I believe that you have every right in the world to expect someone to be finished with a past ex before beginning something new with you. Before very long before she came to you and told you that someone has told her that he wanted her number.
She should have just told who was ever asking "No I don't want him texting me now that I'm in another relationship."
You should have been more honest with her about that and told her that you would appreciate if she kept him gone instead of just telling her that you want to know when he contacts her... thereby giving her the impression that you were okay with her talking to him as long as you were in control of the situation and she told you when he made contact.

BOTH of you could use some improvement on communication your expectations so it's clear to the other what you want from your partner rather then expecting something that has never been voiced. If changes aren't forth coming after deliberate communication then it's time to say goodbye and you'll have no need to ask a forum board if you've done the right thing because your partners actions or lack of them will tell you that you have because they are unwilling or incapable of giving you what you want.

You don't appear to be controlling in the sense that you tell her when she can go out, how often she can do it, how she dresses etc but you do seem to be trying to control her without actually telling her what you want her to do.... which was to cut all contact with this guy and stop being curious as to what he wanted with her. Why didn't you just ask that since that IS EXACTLY what you want?

Do you see?

[hunterprincess]

The most important question I would ask myself, if I were in your shoes, is do you trust her? Trust in a relationship is paramount. I have done things similar to what your partner has done, only difference is I was upfront about it when asked. I didn't do it because I was lonely or seeing what my other options are, I just wanted male attention. Somedays in my relationship I don't feel like I exist or matter. If I were you I would try and understand why she was having a conversation from her ex, besides curiosity. She either lied about because (1) she knew you would get pissed and didn't want to fight, (2) she is ashamed, (3) she has no idea why she did it she just did.

[Wakeup]

Actually, you know what? I'm changing my entire stance on this and I'm just going to say that you did the right thing by breaking up with her. You argued all the time due to both your being stubborn and at logger heads because of it. She continued to be in contact with an ex (who didn't have her number) with whom she gave her number to after knowing how you didn't like her talking to him... as such, you are better off without her so you can find someone you will be able to have a more chillax relationship with. Someone who isn't jonesing to communicate with an ex... someone you don't have to be right with.

Good luck going forward.

[TablesandChairs]

If this was my relationship, this is a hypothetical of what would happen under the same situation:

Ex boyfriend messages me on FB (I have him as a friend - not an issue). He says he wants to tell me something important. 'Oh what could it be?' I think. I type "what is it?". He might say 'I miss you and want to be together forever'. I say 'Oh ok...I have a partner now but I'm sure these feelings will fade in due time'.

Then I would go on with my day. At some point during the evening, I might mention it to me partner. If I didn't forget. My partner would say 'well aren't you popular'. I'd say 'yeah totally. Can we watch what I want on TV for once? I'm sick of the Walking Dead'.

The end.

[BadRobot]

I actually decided to go see a couples counsellor, she has her major in behavioural psychology...

I gave her a bit more insight into the whole situation...a few things that didn't cross my mind when I typed the 1st post. I must have rushed things a bit.

[MENTION=52694]Wakeup[/MENTION]...I did tell my gf that I didn't appreciate her contacting her ex as well as that it is something that should not be present in a healthy relationship IF there are still feelings between both. Years ago, after the first incident when she said that she missed him, I requested she respect me enough not to be in contact with him. I failed to mention that which gives good reason why you would have suggested those things in the first place.

I have a bit more clarity on the situation and to sum up that which the counsellor said for anyone having the same problem read on...she pointed out the following and note I was completely open with her about all my faults and our troubles. ( I was not going to waste my money by keeping things from her. I needed answers immediately).

She stated that there should be no reason for the behaviour on my gf's part. With regards to behaviour she meant the deception. Regardless of how she felt about the relationship, being it a good one or not, there should be no room for contacting ex partners other than things like they shared a child, sorting out old possessions etc. She pointed out two types of people...those who sever all bonds with ex partners and those who choose to keep them in their lives. Although those who choose the latter can't be judged as being in the wrong, because its a personal choice, they run the danger of keeping bonds alive. These bonds can, although not always, make room for past feelings and memories to creep in. It refreshes ones memory. This can prove a dangerous situation because it may or may not remind us of good times as well as the bad. I know here are a lot of may and may nots as she stated as well. She decribed it as a seed which we unconsciously give "water" and room to grow. This could some day grow into something we never intented like the situation I am in.

The counsellor then started talking to me about the "possible" why. Why did my gf contact her ex and why did she hide it from me. She could not give many definite answers because she needed to hear the why from my gf. Although she gave me some insights, the clearest and most profound was that my gf would eventually leave me for him or either cheat because she was hiding it and doing something she thought needed to be hiden from me.

The reason she hid the truth from me is because of guilt. Someone who believes they have done nothing wrong has nothing to hide. My gf believed she did nothing wrong but the question remains why did she delete the text messages and keep the deed from me. She did do something she wasn't supposed to hence all the deception and I will really never know what they talked about. The councillor explained that if you take a cookie from a jar, eat it and someone later wants to know who took a cookie, you would not hesitate to say it was you. This is because of your belief that nothing was done wrong. You have nothing to be guilty of hence you have nothing to hide.

Basically my gf had no valid reason for encouraging her ex to proclaim his undying love other than wanting something she wasn't prepared to admit yet. Be it that she was seeking attention, felt lonely, was unhappy, if we fought a lot or whatever it doesn't excuse the behaviour. My gf should have left me if any of these were the case.

The counsellor quoted... "If you are unhappy in a relationship then leave. If you love someone be true and honest. If you love someone and your are unhappy then you are confused. The two don't go hand in hand."

Please note I just explained what the counsellor said and I have to agree.

I understand some people do things differently when it comes to an ex. I forgot to mention this before, she would mention him or bring him up more than usual during our time together. I just choose not to bothered about it and that was MY mistake.

Well some recent news is that my gf doesn't know if she still has feelings for him or not...question answered.

Thanks though to everyone who commented and gave your opinions. I appreciate it.