When did money get in the way of love?

[singularity2006]

I just had a psuedo breakup with my gf of 1 year and could use some advice or insight as to what went wrong.

Preface: I met my gf at our family business, which is a large Asian supermarket in the bay area. We are independently owned and operated and are socially, very visible in the Asian community. My gf on the other hand is relatively new to the US and has been here nearly three years and lives off of financial aide. People have always told her that I'm a playboy, going for anything that shows skin. People have always been telling me that she's using me, only for my money.

We threw away those thoughts long ago and promised not to let them bother us. We were so happy. We went to school, worked hard, went after our goals, at least for a while.

Her situation: In her family, her mom has weird financial issues and does weird things with their money. My gf pays half of her wages to her mom for rent and the other half goes to her car payments. Her car insurance is near expiration and she needs to renew her subscription. The problem is that because of the disparity of distribution, she has nothing left for insurance.

My situation: I personally refuse to allow anyone to have any fuel or ammunition to use against me to fuel the idea that she uses me. As a result, I took the route of deciding never to handle any big ticket expenses for her. I would take her out, cover smaller things like gas and/or cellphone bills but car payments and insurance is strictly her's to deal with. I feel bad as shit that I can help her but I refuse to because of my belief that I do not want to do anything that might give people something to say about me.

Her idea: If i really loved someone, money would not matter and would come and go like water.

My idea: I refuse to do anything that would enable anyone to say that she uses me although whole-heartedly I know she does not.

It's been very emotional... i know how bad her money problems at home become at times yet i refuse to help her for certain things. I don't know if I'm being a scrooge or am I justified in doing what I do. Her mom is pyschotic, moved out for a week and said she would only move back in if my gf and her sister paid up $1K to pay off her mom's debt to her aunts. Her mom bitches at her each month for not paying more in rent. 6 months ago, she paid for her mom's insurance and her own, which wiped out her savings. I've heard her and her mom argue to tears at home... it's painful as hell to listen to but i honestly don't know what to do. I don't know what's more important... ensuring that i hold my values and respect about what people say or making sure she has every opportunity in the world to reach her goals....

Mind you, we're both college students so I money is actually a very finite resource for the both of us. My parents may own a supermarket, but I work for a wage, pay for school, gas, and all my other miscellaneous expenses. I do admit though, I don't handle insurance or car payments. Comparatively speaking, I retain 90% of my income per month easily in savings. She retains 0%. Gas and phone bill alone, I use up 50% of my earnings for her.

Anyway, those are my objective and subjective valuations. I really don't know what is right or wrong anymore... i need help. I just can't help but cry and wonder why we were able to overcome sooooo many barriers before only to be stopped by the very first barrier we overcame in the first place.

In the end: in the end, she hung up after a long winded discussion about how she thought that I believed in those rumors about her. I myself tried so hard to explain my position but it just didn't go through.

[Debunkt]

Her idea: If i really loved someone, money would not matter and would come and go like water.

My idea: I refuse to do anything that would enable anyone to say that she uses me although whole-heartedly I know she does not.

My idea: Ya'll are both looking at the wrong points. If you TRULY love someone, you're not going to care about what others will say or think, and do what you want to do.

[MVPlaya]

You should never have to validate your affection by buying gifts or paying for others expenses. Any request to validate affection in a material form should be rejected. If you genuinely want to help someone or if there is a major problem in their life where you feel obligated to help them from a moral stand point, thats your choice, but the other party should never make their affection contingent upon how much of your salary you invest in them.

[Vanilla Gilr]

I couldn't stand by and watch someone I love suffer financially because I was worried about what someone might say or think. If I love someone and I know they are not using me...that's all I need.

If you're more worried about what people think than you are this girls welfare..let her go now...so she can find someone who will really love her.

You said your parents pay your insurance etc...you've been blessed with someone helping you financially...and if you're keeping 90% of your wages...it doesn't sound like they are picky about what they will or won't pay for you...but you have very definate ideas of what you will and won't help her with.

She has every right to be hurt and upset at you for believeing the rumours about her. And honestly...if I was her...I'd break up with you. It's hard enough to be poor...but to have your interigty questioned by somone who supposedly love you? Who needs that?

It's not like she said, 'Pay this or I'll dump you' You said you've seen all the hardship she's been through...you said you have the means to help her out...you choose not to because you're worried what people might say.

Until your worry about another person overrides any concern about what others might think...you shouldn't be with that person.

Just my opinion.

[whaywardj]

Singularity: At the risk of clanging on stereotypes:

I'm a Red Blooded American White Boy who spent a lot of time in the Bay Area and good deal of that time dating and becoming deeply involved with women of Asian descent, particularly Chinese, Japanese and Korean. INVARIABLY, without fail, at some point in these relationships, either the families of the women, or the women themselves would put me on a hot seat about my financial standing and my future prospects in that regard. It was an "Asian thing" in my eyes. A well-intentioned effort on the part of families and the Asian community at large to assure that their sons and daughters didn't involve themselves with anyone or anything which could diminish the hard-earned standing their elders had won for them. That it was also a materialistic preoccupation which sometimes approached obscene proportions was always conveniently overlooked by all...except me.

You have three choices: 1) Buck your family and tradition and take the "independent American" route of helping your loved one to the fullest extent you're able, regardless of the consequences; 2) submit to the wisdom of your family and tradition and let her go, then seek out for yourself a love of better community standing; 3) or work with your family and tradition to "package" your loved one (and HER family) in such a way as to make them see, if not current material benefits to the involvement, at least, the potential future benefits she represents. At the very least, show them how the involvement will not diminish, or will replace with interest, the things they may fear it could cost.

As to any ideas there is an over-abundance of "wisdom" in such outlooks as those you may be struggling against, let me offer this: In all my life, I have never heard such awful racial slurs as those which the Chinese and Koreans I knew lobbed against each other. And I spent my early childhood in Alabama. Choose what you value most with that aspect of Asian tradition in mind.

[singularity2006]

I am feeling like such trash right now because for soooooo long, my exposure to Asian culture in this American world has lead me to a split personality. I'm constantly struggling with what cultural values and norms I must follow and worry about how I care about someone. It hurts me to hear my family tell me I'm too young and stupid to understand a relationship and deserve nothing of the sort to be part of my life for years to come. It is sad that I somehow agree with my own ignorance in that I try so hard to play it safe according to my familial rules that it overrides a lot of my deepest convictions for her.

You are very right - stereotypes are a shit. Do I err on the side of safety or do I err on the side of unstrustworthiness?

[whaywardj]

Construct a different paradigm for yourself, man. One that doesn't force you into an "either-or" decision. One way to look at it is to realize that the delimma you're in is a direct result of the freedom-of-choice your forebears aimed at your having. Now that you have it, it's rather hypocritical of them to dissuade you from exercising it, wouldn't you say? "Untrustworthy"? "Safety"? Relative to what? And for whom?

[singularity2006]

What I mean by my comment is that do I err because I wonder if I'm doing it because I want safety from criticism or because maybe my mind has truly been poisoned by those rumors about her and I want safety for myself.

In any event, I think over some of the things she said and here's some more that I recollect. I recall that on the outset, she didn't want to get into this relationship in the first place because externally, we are very different people from very different backgrounds. But I have always been quite set on the idea of equal opportunity and the ability for anyone in America to make it up the ladder if they truly want to. As a result, I encouraged her to work harder in school in the hopes that one day she'll make it out just like I will in a few years. I have always stressed the ideas of us being equal as people. Financially, what I have is an after-effect of my family, not my own work. As for her situation, I told her it's the same. Difficulties and situations aside, I have always stressed that she is a person just like myself.

However, I do admit that when talk came up about money, I consciously made an effort to avoid all questions about it, even when she herself was joking around about it. And though my intention was that I wanted to preserve the idea that we are truly equal in terms of wealth/social status, my actions ended up making her picture us as being more different than we really are.

I was bouncing this question to a friend of mine who is of the same cultural mindset to get her opinion. But what is your opinion? In essence, my gf got mad at me for a couple reasons:

1. I believe the rumors that she wants me only for money (though I vehemently deny this)
2. My actions that i intended to make us appear equal made us more different than anything. She felt hurt by it, that i would actively hide and avoid those questions about myself and my family.

Yesterday, we actually made up and kind of got back onto somewhat stable ground. But I do find it weird... i told her sister about what happened and her sister yelled at her and said she was using me. I really don't even know what to think about that comment. Their family dynamic is just so complicated.

[bluesummer]

The plain truth is this: different socio-economic backgrounds are almost always going to become an issue in a relationship. We'd like to think that love conquers all and money doesn't matter, but that's not in the nature of humans.

The one thing I can say to you is that you made a wise move from day one to hold back on the urge to spend large amounts of money on her, even though you could. She is only a girlfriend, not even your fiancee or someone you have long term commitment to. I guess what you should think about is this: have you or would you lend your close friends large amounts of cash if they were in trouble? If the answer is no, then it should be the same for your gf. Even now I don't lend my live-in bf of 3 years large amounts of money unless I'm sure he can pay me back, and vice versa. That way, if it ever ends, no one feels like the other one screwed them over.

Having been in this situation, I can tell you that being the 'less fortunate' half in a relationship can be very trying on your sense of security. No matter what your wealthier partner says, deep down you always feel like you have nothing to contribute and are using that person. Even families can get ugly about it. It takes a lot of strength to hold such a relationship together, so I wish you best of luck.

[sifu74]

Hey singularity2006, I feel you man. I am asian and when you hear rumors of a girl liking you only for money it is usually somewhat the truth. Take for instance, I had gone out with this one girl awhile back and her guy friends always made fun of he calling her a golddigger. She always laughs about it, but it made me wonder. Why would her friend make a comment like that abuut her, it would only make sense. Rumors don't just start for no reason. So I do find out for myself they are true. If your gf gets mad at you for not helping her fnancialy, dump her now it might get to be a burden later on, its not like you refused to help her when she has a flat on the side of the road. Money does cause problems if you let it.

[singularity2006]

It's really tough to understand what the right thing is. Because I run into two questions:

1. Did she get upset because of the amount of money at hand?
2. or Did she get upset because of the fact that I refused to help at all?

In anycase, the rumors are far fetched considering the source. This all came about as workplace rumors and the biatch that started those rumors has a mouth like you would not believe. I've been exposed and directly affected by those rumors myself so i know how far flung they are which leads me to not believe a word. In anycase, the other thing is that in all the time we've been together, I've offered her countless times to pay for her books if her book vouchers went out, offered her thousands to pay down her car loan, but in each and every case, she always refused citing the same reason I had for saying no: She doesn't want to do anything that might give anyone the impression that she is using me. It just isn't worth it.

That said, I even remember times when she asked me to buy electronics for her, like a voice recorder for school. She forced me to take her payment for it. It seems a stark contrast to what the rumors say. But then again, I was blindsided by a comment that I was being played with until now because she wanted to gain my trust and then abuse it. I find that very difficult to believe considering how genuine her discussions with me about this issue have been over the term of our relationship.

But anyhow, things got very murky in the past couple of months with her mom going crazy. Her mom does a lot of queer things with the family's money that is just unbelievable. She blew off a few thousand on a deposit on a house they could not afford, then went into debt because the previous owners fixed up the house under the assumption it would sell though in the end it did not. Then her mom bitched at them for making her pay the downpayment for the house and then moved out for a week only to come back bitching more saying that she will only come back if they pay off her loan to my gf's aunt.

Anyhow, I shelled out last paycheck just today to cover her insurance. She needs to be able to get to work and school. Otherwise it would be counterproductive for what I've wanted for her so long, which is to spend time focusing on school.

[Chlorine]

singularity2006----"But anyhow, things got very murky .....Her mom does a lot of queer things with the family's money that is just unbelievable."

No, it's not unbelievable. My cousin is in a similar predicament. He's a doctor, makes good money. His girlfriend's parents are from the mainland, they don't try and assimilate and don't even want to learn proper English. They ran up huge debts through gambling and asked their daughter for help. The girl used her feminine wiles to coax my [stupid] cousin into paying off their debts. He keeps saying he's going to break up with her expecially after the gambling mess.

Yeah right.

[singularity2006]

singularity2006----"But anyhow, things got very murky .....Her mom does a lot of queer things with the family's money that is just unbelievable."

Yeah, I do see these things happen a lot. It gets really strange what happens. In anycase, I pretty much have taken the cup as half full approach to this issue to see how it plays out. Because in general, she's treated me damn well. She makes me dinner every night before I head out to class and just a few nights ago made a soccer ball shaped and colored cake for my nephew's birthday. She spent hours on it and dotted the cream on for texture instead of just wiping it on (took like an hour and a half). Gosh, that was sweet. =)

I know I see a lot of guys get abused when they dive into these situations ... I err on the side of hope in this case to see what happens.