My ex, all a bit messy

[Lynyrd]

So I was with my GF for 2.5 years and we broke up in the summer. Throughout the time we were together we didn’t really have a great deal of time together as we worked opposing shift patterns. I eventually moved my work shifts so we would have most evenings and at least 2 full days off together each week. Throughout the relationship she got close with another guy as she saw him more often than I did. When we eventually broke up they got together pretty quickly. I have since started seeing someone else too but my heart is with my ex and her child. I have told her this.

We are still in very regular contact, i.e. we text almost every day, she has been to my house a few times and visa versa. I didn’t tell her I was seeing a new girl for quite a while but she now knows. If ever I mention her she gets angry. The other day she told me she is angry that I am now doing all the nice things I am doing with the new girl and wishes we had done those things. She told me we were the couple that should have made it and we both screwed it up. She is right.

What I want to know is why we are still in such close contact 6 months after the break up. Neither of us has told our new partners about this regular contact for obvious reasons. My heart is really with her and I just want her to take that brave step and let’s give us another go, especially due to the fact we will see each other every day.

I have written a letter to her new boyfriend but haven’t dared send it. It is polite but contains about 40 examples of where she has gone behind his back, such as coming to my house (one day even ended up in bed together) and the like. I do not wish to hurt him although his feelings are not really my primary concern; I just want him to leave. I have resisted sending the letter a few times when I have known they have had really nice weekends away coming up as I did not want to spoil the weekend for her.

Should I break them up or will it backfire on me. Is there anything else I can do? If she was not sending all these signals I would have forgotten about it by now, but she must still have some feelings for me due to the risks she takes and the things she says. Any advice?

[melancholia]

Do not send the letter. Talk to your ex about your feelings and see where she is at. Trust me, if you send that letter, you will lose any chance you may have to rekindle you relationship. If she doesn't feel the same way and she doesn't want to reconcile, then you should stop spending time together and move on. It would be too hard to be friends if you are still pining for her and can't get past your romantic feelings.

[TheEvilJester]

Most definitely agreed with melancholia here. I think writing the letter may have been a good and therapeutic experience for you, so no harm no foul in WRITING it..... BUT I would most definitely NOT recommend actually sending it. I would not recommend, either, that you try to interfere in their relationship in any way.

Now, that doesn't necessarily mean you have to just give up. In most cases, I would tell somebody that they should never mess with somebody's relationship. That if somebody is in a relationship, you should just let go and move on.... especially in a case like yours because you are actually in a new relationship yourself....


BUT.... I feel slightly different in your case because of just one element. You BOTH seem to still have some unresolved feelings for each other. Honestly, I could certainly be wrong. Or, it could be possible that she still cares for you (and that is why she finds it hard to let go) but she is still steadfast that you don't work as a couple. It's just, in the case, that certainly isn't the vibe I get. It sounds like you both still feel like it could/should work.

It also sounds like neither of you truly has their full heart in their new relationships because part of you still wants to be with each other. So, I do think this is one case where you should at least talk to your ex about how you are feeling. I do not personally think you should frame it in a "I want to be with you, please leave him for me" kind of way. Maybe it's just me, but I think it should more so be framed as though you needed to confess your feelings to her, but you will then leave her to decide what to do with the information. Were it me in your situation, I might say something like:

"I know the timing on this is so bad, and I'm sorry for that. But, I just can't help how I feel. There is part of me that is still thinking maybe we made a mistake ending things. That maybe we could work out if we really gave it a chance. There is part of me that wants to try again. I don't want to lose what we had without at least giving it a real try. I know now you are with somebody else, so I wouldn't ask you to end something if it is working for you. So, I just wanted you to know how I feel, and that if you maybe feel the same way that I'm open to talk about it."

If you go that route, obviously put that in your own words, but that is just my idea of how I might handle it were I in your situation. I think that makes your intention clear. It isn't like anybody hearing that wouldn't obviously know the implication is you want to give it another chance. This way, you leave it up to her to decide if she wants to take that chance with you as well. If she winds up deciding to stay with her new fella, then that was what was going to happen anyway.

As for your current girlfriend, before long you need to decide what you want to do about her regardless of whether or not you and your ex get back together. Believe me, I know you don't mean to treat her this way, but she's not somebody's consolation prize. She's not there to hang on so you have somebody in case your ex doesn't want to get back together. She deserves to be somebody's top priority. If that can't be you because your heart is with somebody else, that is understandable.... but then don't leave her hanging. Let her be free to find the guy with whom she really is meant to spend her life.

For that matter, though, don't necessarily decide that hastily either. Make sure you do think long and hard on that. Reason being, maybe what you are clinging to with your ex is really more an idea than a person. In other words, there is always the possibility you two just are not a good match and wouldn't likely work anyway..... but you can't help that part of you still longs for what you thought you two could have had. Sometimes love is a strange emotion like that. Hard to get over. So, at least give yourself time to decide if you can't focus on your current girlfriend because you still love your ex..... or if secretly, without you even realizing it, you just aren't actually giving her a fair chance because you are clinging to something that maybe was never meant to be.

Not easy questions you have to answer. I wish you the best in your journey and hope it works out for the best for everybody.

[Lynyrd]

Hi to both of you and thank you for taking the time to reply to my question.

You are of course right about what I should do with regards the girl I am currently seeing. It is not fair that she may end up feeling not to disimilar to the way I feel now. I will have a proper conversation with her this week.

With regards to my ex, things have moved forward slightly. We have been in contact nearly all day every day since my last post. The other evening she invited me round for supper as she came home from work at 10pm. throughout the day she had been poorly and was talking about wanting a bath when she got home. She made a number of comments but the most significant was "I need to have a bath and go to bed as soon as we have had supper and not end up with you in it haha." She also texted with things such as "I think you should go to my house, run me a bath and put the electric blanket on my bed," and a number of other such things.

Whilst we were talking yesterday both on the telephone and via text message she again expressed her frustration that I am doing nice thiings such as going to cocktail events and weekends away with the new girl. She stated she was angry that I had not put the effort in with her. She even started talking about our former sex life and a number of other private things such as my preference regarding the idfferent pubic hair styles and different sexual positions we enjoyed when together. She stated we should be "Secret friends," and that she will send me a picture of her new nipple piercing.

Now I realise all this sounds rather under handed. She is a decent girl however, she has a good job in law enforcement and despite all the events over the last 6 months, if we got back together I would honestly trust her. She is good, proper and a great mother.

I have tried the month long no contact rule and it worked very well. It changed us from constantly arguing about the reason for the break up to the current position we are now in where we are back to speaking honestly. I fully understand however that she will have strong feelings for both of us. I have explained my feelings to her and she does seem to waver a little and generally agrees we would have made a great life long couple. I just need that little more impetus for her to finally get rid of her new boyfriend now she is starting to see we did make a bit of a mistake.

As such i have resisted sending the letter for fears it may take us back a step, but have you any ideas on any sort of gesture I could do to make her finally see I am a decent guy?

[Lynyrd]

Further to my last post, despite him staying over last night she was asking me to bring her breakfast in bed this morning as he is now at work. It is very tempting.

[melancholia]

How could you honestly trust a woman who is talking to you the way she is while in a relationship with someone else? I think you should dump your current girlfriend, since she deserves better, and ask your ex to dump her BF and get back together with you. That should work out perfectly well for both of you.

[richiro]

Should I break them up or will it backfire on me?
Intervening into another relationship ALWAYS backfires. At the very least it shows very bad integrity and character on your part so even if you do get togethr - that will always be in the back of her mind and eventually she'll decide to break up with you b/c nobody wants to be with somebody who's capable of that.

Is there anything else I can do? If she was not sending all these signals I would have forgotten about it by now, but she must still have some feelings for me due to the risks she takes and the things she says. Any advice?
No.. she does not have feelings for you. Not the kind you think. This is a woman with bad character and no integrity. She developed a relatinship with another man while she was with you. thikn about that for a second. Now that she's with somebody else she's trying to (appearing like) she is tryign to re-deveop somethign with you.

So what do you think is going to happen if you get back together again?

Actions never lie. Words are too easy to lie. Always see a person's ACTIONS and mute out their words. Cuz thats the REAL them. (Same reason I said to never intervene and try to influence another couple's relationship.. that's YOUR actions!)

So what is she doing and why? She's feeding her ego. She's more into the hunt and acquiring men then being with them. so it is not YOU or any man she's interested in, she's only interested in proving she can GET any man. Bad girl. Worst kind. Run away fast!

[Lynyrd]

Thanks guys for the replies, very sobering.

The reason I say I trust her is that because the initial break up was my fault. I didn't put enough effort in, I was young at first, I spent my time traveling rather than putting effort into the relationship and caring for her. The breakup was inevitable, in reality I drove her into the arms of another man. Whilst they became good friends whilst we were together, she ended up in a relationship with him after we split.

I now realise all these things. I am 31, I am a police officer, I have a good income, own my own house and have a great family. I love her and her daughter to bits and want them to be my family, I want to spend the rest of my life with them.

For months she has seemed to be in a state of uncertainty. This guy left his wife to be with her, and he has an 19 month old son and 4 month old daughter. That must surely be playing on her mind too.

We have discussed at length what our life would have been like and both seem to agree it would have been awesome. But the reality is she now has feelings for both of us. I just want her to realise I am genuine. I don't want this to be the one for me that got away. I am also a realist though and realise if we did get back together she would still have feelings for the other guy for quite some time. These feelings would however fade in time when we had the great life together that we could. Her friends and mother have both been in contact with me saying don't give up on her.

[melancholia]

You are clearly living in a dream world. You did let her get away. Relationships almost never work out after a break up, they just don't. The same problems come up and there's resentment that builds from past heart break. You are much better off to just move on, but for some reason you won't allow that for yourself, or for her. Give her space and let her figure out her own feelings about you and her current boyfriend, don't try to tell her how she feels and that her feelings for her new BF will go away if she just dumps him for you... my god. You say you've grown and changed because you have a good job and some more money than before, but clearly you haven't grown in maturity or integrity.

DUMP your current girlfriend because it's clear you don't actually have real feelings for her, you are simply stringing her along until your ex leaves her BF for you, which most likely won't happen any time soon.

[richiro]

The reason I say I trust her is that because the initial break up was my fault. I didn't put enough effort in, I was young at first

At the same time - she started seeing and deveoping somethign with somebody else while STILL with you. Nothing you did excuses her doing that. You weren't lying to her. You didn't mis-represent yourself to her. You didn't lead a 2nd life away from her. You didn't betray her. You didn't deceive her. She did ALL of those things to you. Whether the break-up was your fault or not matters not in this context.

in reality I drove her into the arms of another man.

No. sorry. she is an adult and is control of her own actions and needs to own her actions. Just like you own your actions for how you made her unhappy, she must OWN her actions in being with another man while still being with you and hiding it from you. Only take ownership of your own actions that you control. You are not responsible for the actions of anybody else. This is what's called "being an adult".

This guy left his wife to be with her

Which is proof that her actions were not innocent. They had talked and planned this on their own away from you. So you are not responsible for that!

That must surely be playing on her mind too.

I doubt it. She seems to have no problems with it now does she? It certainly didn't stop her. And her actions show that she puts herself first regardless of how it affects others. So i really doubt she's worried or has been consderate of yours or their feelings. (same goes with him).

she would still have feelings for the other guy for quite some time. These feelings would however fade in time when we had the great life together that we could.

REally? You think so? Seems to me her actions show that her feelings DON'T FADE over time. They didn't for you. What makes you think they would for her? REMEMBER. She LEFT YOU for him. She has NOT left him for you what with all this talk. My friend.. the best advice you can ever learn is ---- WORDS ARE CHEAP. Anybody can say anything they want to. BUT ACTIONS... ACTIONS NEVER LIE. Forget everything she has said and forget everything both fo you have SAID. instead.. LOOK AT HER ACTIONS. That will tell you exactly what she is and what's going on. LOOK AT YOUR OWN actions and compare them to HER actions.

Words are cheap. never trust anybody's words...
Trust their actions.
it is only when their actions match their words that you can trust their words.. but at every turn.. focus on their actions! Because that's where the truth lies.

[melancholia]

People show you who you are, it's up to you to choose to believe what you see and how you interpret their actions. It may be difficult for you to see her actions the way we do, because we are not emotionally involved in this scenario, but you should take your emotions out of it and re-read your own posts and try to look at it from an outsider's perspective, because it sounds insane. She left you for another man, which I would like to reiterate, is not your fault -- it was her choice, regardless of how good or bad of a boyfriend you may have been. She started a relationship with a married man who has an infant child... which shows her lack of integrity and morals and lack of consideration or empathy for others... she knows you are dating someone else, and she is still dating the married guy, yet she continues to text you inappropriately and proposes a "secret friendship" between you two... is she in high school? Only people who are embarrassed to publicize their relationship suggests something like that, and she wants to keep it secret so she can continue her relationship with her current boyfriend.

Might I add that it sounds as though you have completely forgotten about your current girlfriend? What are your plans for dealing with that relationship because if you thought you were a sh!tty boyfriend before, you certainly haven't improved much if you are willing to string her along to keep you company until your magical reconciliation with your ex comes to fruition (which I can pretty much guarantee, won't happen).

[Lynyrd]

Thanks both for your comments. I will certainly have a good think about them before making any final decisions. It is good to hear an outsiders perspective who hasn't been involved in all this. What you say about the "Secret friendship" is certainly not something I had thought about.

With regards to my current girlfriend, well girl I am seeing, I quite agree. I am meeting her tomorrow to tell her that we should call it a day.

Thanks again.

[TheEvilJester]

The more I am hearing, the more I am falling a little bit more towards my usual opinion of maybe you are better to just move on. Again, you have to do what feels right to you. So, if you'd feel better pursuing it so at least you'd know for sure, then that is what you should do.

But, the more details we are hearing from you, the more I'm starting to kind of change my mind. For example, MAYBE it is a coincidence, but it just feels like a huge red flag to me that this other fella she has left his wife for her. I mean, he's a full grown adult capable of making his own poor choices..... but I'm just finding that a little more fishy now. So, not only is she having all these very intimate discussions with you while she's in a relationship with him..... but it sounds like maybe she had been beginning to form a relationship with him (even if just an emotional one at the time) while with you.

Sure, that sort of thing CAN kind of just happen.... BUT, she's beginning to sound more and more like somebody who just does this kind of thing. Again, you really do know her better than we, so you may be better able to judge that. I'm sort of beginning to think you'd be better off to just move on and start over anew (whether that be with your new gal or whether you set her free and look for somebody else). But, again, you will have to do what feels right to you.

Good luck to you in whatever you do decide.

[Lynyrd]

Hey TheEvilJester,

Thanks again for your comments.

I have had a chat with the girl I have been seeing and told her where my head is at. We have parted on reasonable terms albeit we wont be seeing each other again.

With regards to my ex there is little news really. We have been in contact as often as ever and she seems to dangle a carrot then after she has seen her new fella we are back to square one. The day before yesterday we were having a conversation about how we would like to get married etc, talking about venues and honey moon destinations etc. Then the following day it is as if we haven't spoken about it at all.

Last night I told her I had booked a trip to Spain for the week after next. As I had not told her yet that I had split with the new girl she automatically jumped to the conclusion I was going with her when I am in fact going with a friend. She was furious stating she didn't want to know what I was doing with the new girl etc then hung up. This morning she started texting me about what she is doing at work as if we never fell out. I am certainly starting to feel like I am being used as company when he isn't around but still second best when he is.

As such I am starting to think you are probably right in what you say. We either need to get it together in the next week or two or cut contact altogether. I have not sent the letter and very much doubt I will. In fact I should throw it away to remove the temptation to just send it out of spite should we fall out again as that really was never my intention in writing it.

[melancholia]

She is using you, there's no question about it. The sooner you realize that, the better.