Best Love vs First Love

[IndiReloaded]

Too many people are slaves to their feelings.

Best post of the day. Hell yes, I agree. Most of us have the self-control to not eat chocolate all day, inappropriate actions based on feelings are no different.

[halang]

too many people are slaves to their feelings. love is a verb. love is what you do. love is staying with your wife and following through with your commitment to her despite this other woman coming up.

who have you been loving? her or your wife? who's been really loving you? who's been there for you through all the good and hard things you've gone through? who cooks for you and makes a nice comfortable home for you? those things are love. having feelings for somebody is quite different, and it's not love.

feelings are fleeting. your wife has shown you that she loves you. she's actually demonstrated it in her actions. that is love.

I'm sorry misombra.
I think our dictionary is different.

I'm a kind of guy who read Kahlil Gibran so much.
Love is love. It's the feeling in the heart.
Believe me, I can feel it.
I feel my heart rate change when I meet the woman I love
(and so far, only to two women).
In reverse, I also desperately miss her so much
when she is not around.
It's like a soul bonding.
So love, is there without me or her has to do anything.

On the contrary, you are saying about the actions like
cooking, tidying the house, etc.
So you count the actions as "love deposits",
that one should owe to.
IMHO, you discredit love as a "give" and "take" phenomenon.
For me, you are saying about marriage, not love.

So I believe that some people may have a happy marriage with
a spouse they don't love. Maybe because their spouse give
them 9 out of 10 of their physical and emotional needs.

However, in my world,
a true happy marriage can only happen if there is love.
On the other hand, love does not need a marriage.
It is there in the people that can feel it, with pure heart.

I wonder why not so many people see this way.

[Mish]

My family is running so well, not in any bit I decrease my love to my wife.
I just want to have a good communication again, with my old best rival,
who is coincidently, also my first love.

Fair enough. You just want a good communication with your ex who is your first love. You don't see anything wrong with that one little step. Because, after all what's wrong with just having a clear communication with another person? Especially someone as important to you as this person.

What I think others are trying to warn you off (And I am btw of the same opinion) that you may be not seeing a couple of steps beyond that clear communication. How such a little step can in the future be a cause of a lot of problems that you yourself may not be able to find a way out of. Look at yourself as a container. You open yourself up and in there you see all these wonderful things on display that make you (the current you) who you are. These are the you that everybody knows, the face you show to the world. But deep down inside there are other older containers, packaged for many years with lots of older things with a lot of sentimental value. They are the you you used to be, but not anymore. Yet, these containers are deep they hide a lot that has been long gone and forgotten. They are worlds of their own with deep and powerful feelings. The danger lies in bringing all of these feelings out into the forefront once again, re-experiencing them again, getting lost in them. These deep uncontrollable feelings.

Of course you can say this will never happen because you will consciously always keep these feelings in check. But can you really? I ask because many of us who have been down this road know how difficult (I would even say close to impossible) it can be to contain this once its out.

Your family is running well. You clearly love your wife. I have seen this situation change in the matter of days. I will be honest with you, I really don't want you to go through what I have seen.

[luvispower]

halang, stop it. you are betraying your wife. why do you need to maintain a relationship with a woman, who is already married, who was your 1st love, knowing your wife wouldn't like it, and when you already have enough love from your wife?
just ask yourself, can you live without your wife? can you live without your 1st love? if your 1st love disappear from your life, can u still continue your life, just as u did for the past few years?

[misombra]

I'm sorry misombra.
I think our dictionary is different.

I'm a kind of guy who read Kahlil Gibran so much.
Love is love. It's the feeling in the heart.
Believe me, I can feel it.
I feel my heart rate change when I meet the woman I love
(and so far, only to two women).
In reverse, I also desperately miss her so much
when she is not around.
It's like a soul bonding.
So love, is there without me or her has to do anything.

On the contrary, you are saying about the actions like
cooking, tidying the house, etc.
So you count the actions as "love deposits",
that one should owe to.
IMHO, you discredit love as a "give" and "take" phenomenon.
For me, you are saying about marriage, not love.

So I believe that some people may have a happy marriage with
a spouse they don't love. Maybe because their spouse give
them 9 out of 10 of their physical and emotional needs.

However, in my world,
a true happy marriage can only happen if there is love.
On the other hand, love does not need a marriage.
It is there in the people that can feel it, with pure heart.

I wonder why not so many people see this way.

oh come now. now you're just trying to justify having an affair because you have some fleeting feeling. i wish i knew your wife so i could tell her what a dog you are.

if you were my husband and you were working on something with your ex, you would be gone. the only feeling you would have is that of foolishness.

So I believe that some people may have a happy marriage with
a spouse they don't love. Maybe because their spouse give
them 9 out of 10 of their physical and emotional needs.

that's because it's not about getting your emotional and physical needs met, it's about GIVING that. if you're not giving that to somebody, then you're just not loving them. if you're getting it and not giving any, then you're not loving.

[IndiReloaded]

Wow. Okay, one last try:

I'm a kind of guy who read Kahlil Gibran so much.
Love is love. It's the feeling in the heart.
Believe me, I can feel it.

Noone denies your feelings, we already said this. What are you going to do w/them though, that's the crux of the matter? Feed them or leave them? IMO, you're not too far in yet, so you stand a chance of keeping things under control if you wake up & listen to what everyone is telling you.

I feel my heart rate change when I meet the woman I love
(and so far, only to two women).
In reverse, I also desperately miss her so much
when she is not around.
It's like a soul bonding.
So love, is there without me or her has to do anything.

Oh man, you are on your way already.... 'soul mates' is so common in affairs. Its people's way of justifying hurting their spouses. Some even think the Love is a sign from God. Wrong. Emotions are chemicals, just like a drug & you are letting them cloud your judgement & getting addicted in the process.

And, you DID do something. You opened that Pandora's Box Mish mentioned. You didn't have to look but you did. You CHOSE to renew contact w/this gal after all this time. Now what?

So you count the actions as "love deposits",
that one should owe to.
IMHO, you discredit love as a "give" and "take" phenomenon.
For me, you are saying about marriage, not love.

Its both. Ppl love each other b/c they satisfy emotional needs. Did you even read Will Harley's link I posted? This old flame of yours is satisfying an emotional need, count on it, and you are on the slippery slope. What's scary is that you don't seem to want to admit it. Think you're the only person to experience the 'old flame' thing? Its not special, you're NOT soul mates & this story is as old as the hills. Be careful.

So I believe that some people may have a happy marriage with
a spouse they don't love. Maybe because their spouse give
them 9 out of 10 of their physical and emotional needs.

You are living in a dream world. 90% is an incredible marriage! If that's what you have then be very grateful & don't **** it up!! Noone can satisfy another person 100%. I think part of your problem is unrealistic expectations.

However, in my world,
a true happy marriage can only happen if there is love.

So what are you saying? That you don't love your wife? Is the truth finally starting to come out... this is the beginning of what everyone is trying to warn you about. You loved your wife enough to marry her, didn't you? Or did you?

On the other hand, love does not need a marriage. It is there in the people that can feel it, with pure heart.

No, it doesn't.

But most ppl won't be able to accept that & not let it affect their marriage. It takes a really unusual mindset to move forward from this & still maintain contact & be honest about things in a way that isn't damaging to either yourself or the others involved.

Here's your likely future if you keep contact w/this gal (assuming she doesn't break it off w/you first, which if she's smart she will), its already happening: you will spend more time & energy on each other & fall 'in love' again. You will start to neglect your wife & family (b/c one only has so much energy to give to others). You may or may not start a physical affair. You will eventually reach a crisis point where you need to make a choice b/t your marriage and this other person. Your wife may leave you at any point she figures out what's going on, BTW.

If you finally decide you've let things get out of hand & want to fix your marriage, you'll need to stop all contact with this gal to get your head sorted out. All everyone here is saying is skip the middle steps & break contact now.

You mentioned Kahlil Gibran; I own an old copy of The Prophet, fyi. Its a lovely work. But I think you misunderstand. When he describes marriage & spaces, he didn't mean to give your love to someone else, but to use those separate experiences to enrich your interactions with your partner & make your bond stronger.

But you seem set on your path so good luck. Before you do or say anything further w/this other gal, just think whether you'd be okay with your wife being privy to it. In this case, your vaunted honesty might be the thing that will save your marriage.

PS, you're an intellectual snob who doesn't really seem to value the opinions of others except in a certain context. So FWIW, I am a doctor (PhD). Another of those 'smart women'. Some here might say I know what I'm talking about, especially on this subject.

All the best, OP.

[halang]

PS, you're an intellectual snob who doesn't really seem to value the opinions of others except in a certain context. So FWIW, I am a doctor (PhD). Another of those 'smart women'. Some here might say I know what I'm talking about, especially on this subject.

Yes, you are right ;-)
And I hope the last posting was not your last try.

I spent one night just to think about this issue sistematically.
Here is the points:
1. How I model my relationships
2. Why I'm tempted
3. Why my wife does not like it.

----------------------------------------
So let's begin with first topic.

I tend to classify my relationships into:
- friends
- close friends
- love
- mariage
And I have the fuzzy boundaries as follows:

Friends are people that I THINK I like them,
because we share a lot of activities together.
In general, I'm extrovert. In an EQ test,
I was classified as a sanguin person.
So I have many activities and many friends.

Then some friends may become my close friends.
We go for having fun together a lot of time.
I THINK, I can share some of my inner
thoughts with them. I believe they will not betray me.
I have only one or two close friends at a time,
although for all my live, I have been having 6 male close friends
and 2 female close friends.

Then come the love.
The difference between close friend and love is,
I FELL it in my heart. I do NOT THINK it with my brain.
For me, it is so clearly distinguisable.
I almost had a telepatic connection with her.
In my live, only two women have being in this category,
and these are not including the two female close friends.

The highest relationship for me is the mariage.
This is when I THINK I like her,
I FELL that I love her, and more than that,
I TOUCH, SMELL and TASTE her.
In other word, this is the stage where I let my intimacy flows
without boundary, and I give a full commitment to her.
I'm a strict guy. Other than my wife,
I never touch any woman (and man of course),
except for hand shaking.

Ok, so I hope, you can understand now,
why I said that for me, love is love.
It comes to my heart for granted,
not because I think I love this girl,
or worst, because I want to make love to her.

===============================
2. Why I'm tempted to contact my first love

I put a lot of thingking on this. Maybe bacause of two things.
Firstly, when I felt in love to her, I was not expecting it.
In fact, I refused it.
My heart badly wanted her, but my brain thougt NOOOO !!!!
We were in high school, we were two smart people, and big rival.
We both knew that we had to study hard
and could not afford to surrender to this silly feelings.
Then we went to different universities,
separated almost 500 miles away.
I met my second love, that become my wife,
while she met her spouse.
Now we have our own lives.
I don't have any intention to change these lives,
but deep in me, I fell that I have been not honest to her.
So when we are approaching our 40s,
I think we are mature anough for the truth,
and I contacted her.
She told me thet she was also had a crush on me,
We had a good laugh together for the pain and naive teenages
That's was a big relive.

Secondly, I had to recall my motives.
I was a naughty, hiper active boy.
My parents were always on their top patience,
but they gave me the space,
"You can do anything, except smoking, drinking,
and dating before the university".
Damn, I accepted their challenges.
Despite my wildness, I really showed them
that I could maintain not to cross that boundaries.
They highly appreciated it, and gave me their full trust.
Maybe, that's the game I want to play now.
I want to win my wife trust by showing her,
that I can be a (close) friend to my (ex) love,
but still I will not cross the boundaries of a mariage.

Well, some people like to play an extreme physical sport, right.
I'm playing an extreme emotional sport now

-----------------------------------------
3. Why my wife does not like it.

I continued my analysis.
This is when I found a really deeply sorry.
There is a contrast between me and my wife.
I'm an extrovert, while she is an introvert (classic huh ?).
I have more relationships (friends, close friends) than her.
I think, I gain more emotional supports not from her.
She is, on the other hand, have only me as a close friend.

So now I can understand why she is so worry.
We we watch our kids are playing something challenging,
like climbing a tree or riding a horse,
we know that they are have fun.
However, sometimes it is unbearable thinking that they will fall.
For my wife,
watching me playing the extreme emotional sport is unbearable.

------------------------------------------------------------

Epiloque

I sent an SMS to my (ex),
telling her that she was my first love,
but that's only for our good love history.
Our current lives are on separated paths.

I thank you all, the unknown people,
for the hard complainings, that push me to make up my mind.

Cheers

[Gigabitch]

if you were my husband and you were working on something with your ex, you would be gone. the only feeling you would have is that of foolishness.

You're kinder than me, Misombra. I would leave him with a sharper, more localized feeling.

[Mish]

They highly appreciated it, and gave me their full trust.
Maybe, that's the game I want to play now.
I want to win my wife trust by showing her,
that I can be a (close) friend to my (ex) love,
but still I will not cross the boundaries of a mariage.

Well, some people like to play an extreme physical sport, right.
I'm playing an extreme emotional sport now

Indeed you are. I will save you the anticipation and suspense Halang, you are going to lose this game. This game is nothing like the game you played with your parents. The rules are completely different. Essentially, you are planning to play with trust and that's like playing with matches in a room filled with kerosene. You better watch your moves in your game very carefully, because one spark will set it all ablaze. If I were you I would quit while I was still ahead.

[misombra]

agreed. this will not end well, says my crystal ball.