No sex for you (me.)

[Petit Papillon]

Omg I thought at the beginning you said" That's a costume I use for stealing (human) babies" :O

[Take2]

Hmmm. Well, are there any good music events coming up? A concert or jazz club or some sort of music event it always a good date, and those come in all price ranges. Or a movie at a place that serves dinner and then back to your place where you have prepared dessert? Or you could go ice skating and back to your place for cocoa? Indoor picnic and a movie?

[vashti]

Do you have snow anywhere nearby? Snowshoeing is cheap and fun.

[Gratedwasabi]

Bleh. Well, guess I don't have to worry about plans.

She's too busy to see me until next weekend. :-/

To try and get something less subtle out of her, I responded that was fine and she was worth the wait and I rather liked her and just let me know when, blah blah. Her response? " will do"

So. That's.. argh. This week is going to suck.

It's not the fact that she's busy, she's in med school, I get that, it's that I feel like I'm much more in a "casual dating" zone then a boyfriend zone, which is where I want to be. I don't need lots of attention, but even affectionate texts if she refuses to speak on the phone/etc would be nice. Sigh..

[vertical_sky]

Have you guys discussed exclusivity? Is that what she's looking for?

It does sound more like a casual thing right now, but if you guys haven't discussed it then that makes sense. You might have to fling yourself out there, so to speak, to get what you want.

[vashti]

no, don't do that. it's too soon. you'll scare her off.

[Gratedwasabi]

no, don't do that. it's too soon. you'll scare her off.

Do what? Discuss exclusivity? Nah, I have no intention of talking about anything like that before we have sex. I think it's a pointless conversation to have before that point, whether it's the 6th date or the 12th.

And it's a moot point, anyway. I know she's not dating anyone else, she doesn't have the time.

My concern is that I'm going to get stuck on a casual dating plateau OR she's going to tell me she doesn't have the time and just wants to be friends.

The ball is in her court. I'm not going to contact her again until I hear from her. Period.

[sookie6]

An interesting thread!

First off, I think sex on the first or second date is waaaaay to soon...it does happen I know..fueled my alcohol or particular circumstances but if a woman is looking long term, a general rule is that she will postpone the physical aspect a bit longer. For a few reasons: the need to get to know you better, to see if she can spend an enjoyable time with you, to see what kind of person you are...you know not everybody is gonna believe you're an honest kind kind from a first date...

Also everyone has a different level of personal space...some people will hug everyone pretty quickly, talk to people very closely, be all touchy feely with strangers pretty soon...others need a bit of time and to establish trust whether it is consciious or subconscious...so if you give her some time for still a few dates without initiating anything you might be surprised that she will come to you..;and what a personal satisfaction when someone really wants to be close to you!

My advice if you like her is to think about 2 or 3 more dates, make them interesting, fun, possibly outdoor and daytime so that she does not feel any pressure...MAKE SURE THAT ON ALL DATES YOU LOOK ABSOLUTELY FABULOUS, that you smell nice and that she feels comfortable (don't obviously flirt and keep your distance)...

See how it goes!

[Gratedwasabi]

An interesting thread!

First off, I think sex on the first or second date is waaaaay to soon...it does happen I know..fueled my alcohol or particular circumstances but if a woman is looking long term, a general rule is that she will postpone the physical aspect a bit longer. For a few reasons: the need to get to know you better, to see if she can spend an enjoyable time with you, to see what kind of person you are...you know not everybody is gonna believe you're an honest kind kind from a first date...

Also everyone has a different level of personal space...some people will hug everyone pretty quickly, talk to people very closely, be all touchy feely with strangers pretty soon...others need a bit of time and to establish trust whether it is consciious or subconscious...so if you give her some time for still a few dates without initiating anything you might be surprised that she will come to you..;and what a personal satisfaction when someone really wants to be close to you!

My advice if you like her is to think about 2 or 3 more dates, make them interesting, fun, possibly outdoor and daytime so that she does not feel any pressure...MAKE SURE THAT ON ALL DATES YOU LOOK ABSOLUTELY FABULOUS, that you smell nice and that she feels comfortable (don't obviously flirt and keep your distance)...

See how it goes!

I always look absolutely fabulous and smell wonderful.

I think you're probably right and I shouldn't worry so much about being more intimate/sex/whatever. It sucks that I get to see her infrequently, but I'll try to plan next weekend for us to go for a hike and have a little picnicy food for us. That's my plan.

[Boisdevie]

An interesting thread!

First off, I think sex on the first or second date is waaaaay to soon...it does happen I know..fueled my alcohol or particular circumstances but if a woman is looking long term, a general rule is that she will postpone the physical aspect a bit longer. !

I have to disagree with you. In my last two long term relationships (13 years and 7 years) we had sex on the second date.

[Gratedwasabi]

So.. wow.

Wow.

Woooowww..

In a shocking turn of events, at 11:30 tonight she texted me and asked me to come out to the birthday party (at a nice bar.) Obviously I said sure, I went down. and... well.. I'm at least unofficially the boyfriend. Heh. The whole night she was making sure I was next to her and when she'd laugh or something she'd lean over and rest her head on my shoulder, and this is with all her friends around. It was really, really nice. I think I made a good impression on her friends, too.

When the bar was closing, her friend that drove her was like "well, let's go" and I offered to drive her home instead, which she quickly agreed to. To make a long story short, I used the flower excuse to get her to my apartment (which she immediately agreed to, as did she immediately agree to tea when we got there..) and we made out a bit. Unfortunately it was 2:30 and she had class early in the morning and her reasonable side took over and stopped it from going further. I was a bit persistent in that I kept kissing her, but I don't feel like I was too much so and I apologized if I was being too aggressive after I drove her home.

She also made the comment a couple times of "we can have tea when I don't have class the next day" cough.. hint hint.



*edit* Also, a couple of her friends started flirting with me when she wasn't paying attention. I wonder if that was a test. LOL.

[cancankant]

Maybe ask her if she wants to do something saucy on a date...like go to a burlesque show or something!!! You mentioned you are in Seattle and I know there's a club doing old timey burlesque at Pike Place Market (The Can Can). Most women I know like burlesque because it's vintage and classy. If she thinks your off your rocker or a perv, then you have found out her stance on sex and nudity right there. You can then play it off as a joke. For instance, you've got a copy of The Stranger, drinking a cup of coffee and mention, "Oh The Can Can...ever heard of it? I've always wanted to try out that place." Her: "Yeah, that would be interesting. I think burlesque is sassy." or Her: "Strippers??? Uh...no. Gross." (to which you then just laugh it off).

I think she might be the type that is afraid of being perceived as a slut. Too fast and the guys think you are "skanky" (you used the term yourself), so she is being reserved. Perhaps also she is shy or has issues with her body (not uncommon with the early to mid twenties ladies).

I think it's kind of refreshing for a couple to forgo sex for a while, but I do think that intimacy (even if it's just kissing, etc.) is really important. Vashti hit it on the head, though. A lot of younger women have sex to please men, not necessarily because they want to have sex. Alcohol helps, but might not make for the most pleasant or memorable experiences.

[MerryH]

I apologized if I was being too aggressive after I drove her home.

Stop that.

Do not apologize. You're not sorry.

Ha. Yay. Glad it's going well.

[Gratedwasabi]

Stop that.

Do not apologize. You're not sorry.

Ha. Yay. Glad it's going well.

Well, I more joked about it. Like "sorry if I misbehaved, you're just too irresistible."

It wasn't like "I'm sorry, forgive me!"

[cancankant]

She is definitely putting up a little bit of a barrier with excuses. I'm going to say that I don't think I ever stopped making out with a guy I REALLY liked because I "had class in the morning", and I was a straight A student! It sounds like she's just very reserved and possibly inexperienced when it comes to guys or has had her heart stomped on in the past or had guys degrade her for moving too quickly (or is afraid that is going to happen).

I would take this casually. If it's meant to be, it probably will happen. If she's either not that interested, or if she is getting over someone else or interested in someone else more, it might not.

I also agree to not apologize to her unless SHE says something about it. If a woman is creeped out or put off by the way you react, she will respond in some way, either by not going out with you anymore or by simply telling you.

Have you tried to advance this farther than kissing, such as "petting" or even simply caressing her body more intimately? Have you told her that you like her a lot and want her? I think 5 dates is enough time for that shoe to drop. I would be surprised if she didn't know, but some people are less in tune with social cues or you could be sending mixed signals. This might be where she drops the bomb that she isn't interested in a sexual relationship, is abstinent or wants to remain abstinent, etc.