Supreme court to hear death sentence inhumane

[miSSleepy]

See, a baby/fetus that is aborted has not done anything wrong to warrant it's death. A person who has committed some horrible crime is not on equal footing as an unborn person.

That’s a valid point, but one of their arguments IS that it is like playing God. However, it’s also in debate at what point the organism becomes a HUMAN BEING. But that’s another debate anyway.

when you think about it, is death really that bad?? you are set free to meet your creator, but what am i talking about.. i don't believe that there is a god, but that's another story.

Well, what if they don’t believe in that? And assuming that they do after being sentenced to death I’m sure they’ll be looking forward to eternal damnation in hell.

I wont regret or take back anything Ive said thus far. I wont apologize for my beliefs either. My A on term paper was because of my strong belief and the facts I submitted in it.

I’m a teacher, and unless things have changed so drastically at school in the last 20 years, you got that mark because of the way you structured and presented the argument. Therefore the theme of your argument is irrelevant to your mark. IF your teacher was biased towards your belief because she held it as well, that still does not validate your argument today. This is completely irrelevant.

Yes it does cost more to sentence someone to death. But in my opinion I dont want my tax money to be used to let someone of that nature "play" in prison. Other countries have other means of sentencing their criminals and other countries do have the eye for an eye standard. A thief gets his hands cut off, etc.

When you did your research for this paper did you actually study anything in opposition to capital punishment? It seems to me you acknowledged only what you wanted and ignored the rest. Your research and study of the topic has been skewed to what you want to believe.

Go out there and read something about prison life, about these people, about what it’s like. Read some reasons AGAINST capital punishment. “Michael X on Death Row” By Jeffrey Robinson (QC, sort of a celebrity lawyer).

And of all those I have conversations with regarding this matter from 24-75, the MAJORITY of those people believe in the death penalty. There are a few who believe its socially wrong, but I certainly dont try to convince them theyre wrong. Everyone has their own opinion. I just happen to be very mindful about it. And have strong feelings about it.

Well guess what, now you’re hearing opinions against it as well. What difference does it make really?

Damn how long ago did death sentencing start?? OMG , the townspeople would stone the person to death, there were hangings in the town square. Firing squads, etc. Electrocutions. THOSE were horrible ways of putting someone to death. Today, lethal injection is less severe.

History does not justify anything. People used to get hung as witches. How does this point help you argue your belief?

I find it VERY interesting that some people on here are totally against while those in person almost 99% believe in it.

because in person you’re much more likely to talk to people of the same opinion and/or choose who you communicate with. You also have a much narrower population. On here there are 1000s of people across the world.

I didnt start the thread to start a debate of fire. But peoples thoughts.

and you’re GETTING thoughts. But it’s naïve to think that your VERY opinionated OP would not cause a debate. And a debate is not a bad thing, it’s just putting forth rebuttals for differing opinions. So what is your problem with it?

Tiay Im NOT trying to argue with you do you not get that? i voice how i feel and you attack that. I see your point, and understand it, but i dont undermine your personally thoughts about it.

You think she’s attacking you because she disagrees, that’s all. She’s voicing how she feels. Do you feel threatened because she’s doing a better job of arguing? No-one’s undermining your personal thoughts, they’re just bringing in their own that may be better presented.

Squirrely, you began this thread with great aplomb and confidence. You must have known that a controversial issue would cause a debate. And now you’re backing out of it.

[DoesntMatter]

I hope this debate ends in an oily, erotic catfight

[Charlie Boy II]

Me too.

Squirrelly - Tiay just pm'd me saying that it's typical for an ignorant single mother redneck like you to support the death penalty. What do you have to say to that?

[miSSleepy]

Me too.

Squirrelly - Tiay just pm'd me saying that it's typical for an ignorant single mother redneck like you to support the death penalty. What do you have to say to that?

...ohh... no comment

[vashti]

Very funny, charlieboy.

[Tiay]

Tiay Im NOT trying to argue with you do you not get that? i voice how i feel and you attack that.

no, you voiced how you feel, then I voiced how I feel. If I, hypothetically speaking, had started a thread saying.. oh, say, something like this: "the death penalty is such BULLSHIT! BULLSHIT BULLSHIT BULLSHIT and more FÜCKING bullshit! I can NOT believe that this brutal, uncivilised ritual of vengeance still exists in this day and age. I'm SO DISGUSTED! This just erks my shit. ... ..What the is the country coming to???"

well.. would you maybe feel a bit.. uhm.. what's the word i'm looking for..? oh yeah, attacked by that? Would you not want to make a post citing the reasons for your own belief?

that is all I did. You "attacked" me as much as I "attacked" you, it's called debating, and it's a *good* thing! When you voice an opinion like that, did you expect everybody who agreed with you to post "yeah you're right" and everyone who disagreed to just ignore the thread?

I see your point, and understand it, but i dont undermine your personally thoughts about it.

I had to really think about this one for a while...

I'm undermining your personal thoughts, ie your opinion, about the death penalty. So it's my fault for bringing up facts and ideas that could disprove your opinion? You'd tell everyone who disagrees with you to quit voicing their beliefs to you, rather than actually considering how or whether your belief stands up to their arguments?

Often religious beliefs are considered beyond argument. Ie, somehow you can't debate about god with a believer, because their belief is somehow holy and untouchable. Incidentally, their belief would not stand up to the cross fire of rational debate. So instead believers say "it's my belief and you should respect that."
And you're doing the same thing.. only with your belief in the death penalty. Fine, you can believe what you want, but realise that I was not trying to attack you or to take away your right to believe whatever you want. It's not about that.
Ideas are supposed to be argument-proof. If you keep shielding your beliefs from argument, your beliefs are morely likely to be wrong. If you expose your ideas to as much argument as possible, then those beliefs that you are left with afterwards must be some damn logical, well-grounded and resilient ideas.

If somebody puts forth an argument against something I believe in, I cannot justify my belief in it till I can counter that argument..

For instance, I made the argument: "innocent people will be sentenced to death", and because you wont actually debate with me beyond posting a link, I just looked up the "risk of executing the innocent" section there myself. I was genuinely curious to see what it said! It's huge so I skimmed it.. and it basically goes about "disproving" various studies that attempted to show that innocent people had been executed. The second thing it did was belittle the innocent deaths by saying how few (0.14% of the 7,800 executions since 1900..) there were.
My counter argument: The whole point with being sentenced to death when you're really innocent is that the evidence is against you, and nobody can prove your innocence. Hence, it's impossible to actually *know* the numbers here, hence studies about this are bound to be inaccurate, obviously! Pointing out that fact doesn't mean that innocent people wont continue to falsely be sentenced- it doesn't touch the original argument.

I was simply putting up studies of what was mentioned. We could go back and forth for eons. Thats not the idea for me. I wasnt looking for people to dog others out, just simply what everyone else thought.

this is what I think..

Get a grip, this isnt a pissing contest. It obvisously shows that issues of this nature are strongly opinioniated. If you didnt notice that website was PRO. but there were facts in there which i felt were releveant.

yes I noticed that the website read PROdeathpenalty.com
why didn't you pick some of the facts out of it then?

Its cool, I certainly dont look down on anyone or think less of anyone because they dont feel the same as I do. I had NO intention of trying to pursuade someone to go to my side. It is what it is. People have strong passions about so many things, and that just happens to be mine.

Lets agree that its ok to disagree on issues. I do see your point in your thoughts against it. But its fine, I still see you as someone with legitimate reasons for your feelings.

sure, let's agree to disagree- and thanks (:

[Illusional]

i don't think that a majority of the prisoners are bored to death. c'mon they had movie days, free time to play basketball or whatevers, and they gumble if they don't get something different to eat on a daily basis. that sounds like cruzin to me.

raverboy

[tooxshort]

i don't think that a majority of the prisoners are bored to death. c'mon they had movie days, free time to play basketball or whatevers, and they gumble if they don't get something different to eat on a daily basis. that sounds like cruzin to me.

raverboy

And don't forget the most important part: The anal rape.

I think the death penalty sucks because of the system ... I find it much worse to be sentenced to life in prison ... or better yet, life in solitary confinement! Now, inmates would much rather be dead than to have that happen to them.

It's true, they get a lot of free time and all, but there really isn't anything to look forward to in there. No kind of future or brighter day.

But the CA prison system is absurd too. We will be erecting more prisons than hospitals and schools in the future. And by the time death row inmates actually DO get killed, they've been there long enough to be sick of life as it is ... although I do feel for those who have been wrongfully accused ...

[squirrley]

I put up a link that was PRO-DEATH for a reason, to show facts supporting why I believe in it. Thats all I needed or shouldve done.

I dont have to defend myself, and no Im not attacking anyone, guess no one sees that. Just because I dont believe its wrong doesnt mean I was attacking those who believe it is wrong. I already stated anyone can post a link for material for those against and its arguement.

Teacher or no teacher, my comment about my paper has been blown out of proportion. That was almost 20 years ago.

I dont DEBATE, never liked debating about things, whether I have a strong feeling about something or not. I just threw that out there for people to chomp on. I dont have to DEBATE anything. Those are my thoughts and my opinions and so I wanted to hear what people said.

[IndiReloaded]

Feelings are irrelevant to argument/debate & cloud issues. Employing emotion is a trick of rhetoric to cause ppls hormones to affect their judgement. But feelings can't be proven or quantified so they contribute nothing to an argument. Its all about the facts and who presents them best. Or who spends the most money/resources on ensuring that votable topics are heard with emphasis on a particular set of facts.

[Tiay]

I put up a link that was PRO-DEATH for a reason, to show facts supporting why I believe in it. Thats all I needed or shouldve done.

posting links is great for showing where your info comes from, but it wont do much to just plonk out a link like that's the end of the story. Two links, say pro and against pages, can't talk to each other- they need humans to pick out the important bits and weight them against each other.

I dont have to defend myself, and no Im not attacking anyone, guess no one sees that. Just because I dont believe its wrong doesnt mean I was attacking those who believe it is wrong.

um, that's exactly what I said. that's why I put "attack" in quotes. Your initial post stating your opinion was, however, pretty aggressive.

How come, when you do it, it's "voicing your opinion", and when anyone else does it, it's "attacking"? we both voiced opinions, that's it.

I already stated anyone can post a link for material for those against and its arguement.

(see above)

Teacher or no teacher, my comment about my paper has been blown out of proportion. That was almost 20 years ago.

maybe it was blown out of proportion because it was apparently the only reason you gave as to what your belief is based on, so since debating is about tacking that apart, everyone zoomed in on the only thing there was to zoom in on in your argument.

I dont DEBATE, never liked debating about things, whether I have a strong feeling about something or not.

I've definitely picked up on that. And I don't get it... as I said, I can't justify my belief in something to myself unless I can defend that belief against those who disagree with me. After all, those people might have a good point or know facts I don't, and I may end up changing my mind, or at least updating my original opinion. And yes, i've gone into debates with a firm view on something, and come out the other end having changed my mind. And I'm better for it.
But you're basically saying "that's my belief and that's it, I don't want to debate it or know about any reasons why it might not be true"

I just threw that out there for people to chomp on. I dont have to DEBATE anything. Those are my thoughts and my opinions and so I wanted to hear what people said.

and of course, nobody can force you to debate anything. And you did hear what other people said right? so then don't say that I was attacking you just for voicing myself- just like you did! Heck mine had less curse words.

[miSSleepy]

This is getting pointless.

she doesn't want to debate, and I can guess why
she isn't understanding your points Tiay, or mine

You can't realise have a proper debate with someone who doesn't want to have their beliefs disputed.

[Tiay]

yeah, I can see that.. ah well.

tooxshort made a good point there- even if we could theoretically justify the death penalty, no state has ever seemed to have a system for executing it properly, no pun intended.

And also.. an inmate *seems* to have all these things.. and people go "gosh, they have free time, play sports, free food.." and those are things that we'd all love to have. But it is a different thing entirely to *only* have those things.
as a crude example, if I've been working really hard and I decide to chill for a day, ie watch tv, go for a walk, snack, tv, snack, tv.. by the end of the day, I'm really kinda sick of it. People *need* the challenges of work, of life, that's what we thrive on.

[DoesntMatter]

I think prisoners should be forced to do productive work for at LEAST 40 hours per week, or an average work week. But without pay (idk). Maybe give them the option of a shorter sentence if they do productive work that society will benefit from. Otherwise they will be a waste sitting around in a cell contributing nothing to society

[Illusional]

this thread has turned into a debate between squirt and tiay.

raverboy