Advice needed!

[IndiReloaded]

We are talking, real life normal people here you two. Extreme examples of scenarios do nothing to further your argument, they just make you desperate to prove your point.

Vash has made a *conscious decision* to stay committed to her marriage. So she will & that is all. Get it?

Unless of course, space aliens come to earth & threaten her & her family with vaporization unless she divorces her husband to become UberSpace-King Slorc's Sex Slave.

Then you'd be right, Cain.

[IndiReloaded]

Okay, I agree with all except the above. I believe exclusivity is automatic once a relationship is agreed upon.

I don't have a problem with this. Exclusivity = monogamy for as long as the present relationship lasts (but no *promises* about the future--get it?). THAT = commitment. What are you disagreeing with?

[shh!]

Unless of course, space aliens come to earth & threaten her & her family with vaporization unless she divorces her husband to become UberSpace-King Slorc's Sex Slave.

Damn it indi! You figured out our vulnerable spot!



Cain - there is no great secret to staying married. You just refuse to consider divorce an option, and you marry someone who is like-minded. That would make for a pretty boring book, don't you think?

[Cain]

I'm done offering my opinion on this site since it's usually wrong.

[shh!]

On this site, or on this thread?

[Cain]

This website. More recently, my opinions have apparently been wrong. I'll take another hiatus. Maybe I'll come back in another few months.

Ciao.

[Mish]

We are talking, real life normal people here you two. Extreme examples of scenarios do nothing to further your argument, they just make you desperate to prove your point.

No not desperate. It shows one instance where the seperation can happen, very quickly I might add. It opens up the perspective that it can happen no matter how much one tries to deny it.

[Mish]

I don't have a problem with this. Exclusivity = monogamy for as long as the present relationship lasts (but no *promises* about the future--get it?). THAT = commitment. What are you disagreeing with?

The future part. Exclusivity applies to both the present and the future for as long as the relationship exists. Before a person wants to mess with that they should end the relationship, then they can mess all they like.

[Mish]

This website. More recently, my opinions have apparently been wrong. I'll take another hiatus. Maybe I'll come back in another few months.

Ciao.

What about people like me who supported you? You can't leave me behind.

[IndiReloaded]

I'm done offering my opinion on this site since it's usually wrong.

If this is how you are going to handle disagreements in your relationship, then good luck to you.

<sigh> Its so rare to find people who actually understand how to argue & not take it so damn personally. Its not about being right or wrong, you goof, its about opening your mind to another perspective. Don't freak out that there are other opinions out there besides yours. Vive la difference.

Mish, you're the best. If I were single & 15 years younger, I'd come to Australia just to find you.

[IndiReloaded]

The future part. Exclusivity applies to both the present and the future for as long as the relationship exists. Before a person wants to mess with that they should end the relationship, then they can mess all they like.

Okay, I understand the problem, but I don't know how to word it differently to explain. I need to think about this a bit more. Suffice it to say for now that what you think I'm saying isn't what I mean as regards future.

Its more to do with being able to expect that person will still be around, say, 10/20/50 years later.

Exclusive means just that: for however long it lasts. No expectation that things *should* be lasting any longer.

Sorry, tired. Mbe someone else can say it better if they get what I mean.

[Mish]

Okay, I understand the problem, but I don't know how to word it differently to explain. I need to think about this a bit more. Suffice it to say for now that what you think I'm saying isn't what I mean as regards future.

Its more to do with being able to expect that person will still be around, say, 10/20/50 years later.

Exclusive means just that: for however long it lasts. No expectation that things *should* be lasting any longer.

Sorry, tired. Mbe someone else can say it better if they get what I mean.

I think I know what you mean Indi. That exclusivity can't be expected to last in the same way as commitment. And that there is no expectation as far as longevity of the relationship is concenred thus you put emphasis on the future. I agree with that by the way. That's why I put in the line "for as long as the relationship exists".

If you look at relationship as a contract (be it a verbal contract) then exclusivity is one of the main delivarables of this contract. The way I see it, the contract may be ended for various reasons, but for as long as this contract is in place the deliverables will continue being delivered.

As applied to relationships the way I see it, the fact that exclusivity exists doesn't mean that relationship shouldn't come to an end for whatever reason at some point in time in the future. But until it comes to an end both partners are bound by exclusivity. And the way I see it also, exclusivity extends way beyond the "we will not have sex with another person", it extends to a whole range of other acts that can be classified as cheating. This may include, but not limited to; making out, french kissing, urinating on one another (or other fetishes some peopel are into these days), emotional cheating (I think you had some articles on that somewhere), I would even go so far as include leading the other person on as an act of breaking exclusivity.

Personally this is the only way I can see how relationships can function and how both parties can build trust.

[Mish]

Mish, you're the best. If I were single & 15 years younger, I'd come to Australia just to find you.

I'm not into stalkers, but if that was to occur I'd make sure I'm easy to find just for you

[IndiReloaded]

I think I know what you mean Indi. That exclusivity can't be expected to last in the same way as commitment. And that there is no expectation as far as longevity of the relationship is concenred thus you put emphasis on the future. I agree with that by the way. That's why I put in the line "for as long as the relationship exists".

Exclusivity will last IF combined with commitment. But until there is commitment, there is no guarantee. Without commitment, the relationship can end at any time either partner feels it necessary. At which point, exclusivity ends (unless they cheated). Like what you said. This is the best way I can explain, sorry, I didn't spend a lot of time:

[cutiegeneral323]

What the hell is with so many people trying to mess with someone in a relationship? They are NOT available. What if you told her how you felt and she decided to break up with her boyfriend? Do you think you're that prince that she'll never leave? She'll do the same shit to you when someone better rolls along.

Don't tell her your feelings. You'll put stress on her and she'll want to break the friendship off unless she's a tramp that leaves her boyfriend for you... but then again, as I said, she will most likely do the same to you.

You need to establish boundaries with girls in relationships. They aren't your flirting toy. She is in the wrong too, but you should still know better. It's disrespectful.

the reason is, is because everyone wants what they can't have