Relationship with Friends

[nomas]

I can't seem to find any thread I'd like to post in so I'm starting this one.

Let's discuss "Friends with Benefits"

Do you think guys/girls (generally speaking) have different views on it?

If you're not single, put yourself in a single person's shoes and give me your thoughts on friends with benefits. How common do you think it is? What do you think most people think of it?

My thoughts: I think it's no big deal these days. For either sex...for the most part. Especially the younger generations. I think kissing is pretty casual these days and the mood dictates when it's cool..well..for men, any time is a good time to kiss, for the most part. As for women, they do need to have the mood set, again, for the most part.

I don't think many people have to be in a formal relationship before they'll kiss someone anymore.

Now, part two to this: Even if you agree you don't have to be in a relationship to start with the kissing..do you think that both sexes have the same views as far as whether it will eventually lead to a relationship? Again, I think men are more liberal here. I think if a girl makes out with a dude she's just "sorta seeing" she has the hopes that it'll lead somewhere toward a formal relationship. I think less of a percentage of girls do the kissing for fun as opposed to kissing with purpose.

Your thoughts?

[inkeepingsecret]

Part 1

I dont know anyone that wouldnt kiss before a formal relationship. Heck, i dont know a whole lot of people that wouldnt have sex before jumping into a exclusive relationship.

Part 2

I think it depends on the person... Where they are at in life, experience, etc... As for me, when i meet someone i dont like to have any expectations. Even if i am complelty spun on the girl, i try not to give my hopes up, or whatever. Expectations only lead to disapointment. I suppose im being negative. As for girls, i have no idea what they think about when they first get involved with someone.

[shh!]

I think you are right about the different motivation for casual kissing and sex. I think girls who do this are usually "auditioning" for a larger part in the guy's life, while for guys it is probably much more meaningless. This is one of my main objections to "friends with benefits" - aside from unwanted pregnancy, STDs, etc.

[artyemi]

It's not guys and girls who have different views on it, but the people who are in it who have different expectations. Lack of communication, perhaps.

[Asip4u]

nomas, I agree to the fact that it's probably more common with teenagers. I don't know too many people around my age (20-25) who have fwb. Most of the guys and girls would never get together with a friend. I guess it really depends, some people think that friendship and sex should not mix because one of them, and a lot of times both of them, end up ruined. I think girls for most part, like you mentioined, look for something more meaningful even if it starts out as something like kissing without being in a relationship. In general, for a lot of guys it's more like an experiment and it doesn't happen as often that the guy would want to consider something more serious.

[Sami09]

i feel kissing is ok but i dont believe in casual sex i feel it should happen with a person that you really love and care about. At least that is how i am.

[Asip4u]

i feel kissing is ok but i dont believe in casual sex i feel it should happen with a person that you really love and care about. At least that is how i am.

Yea, although, how many people can actually stick to that?

[indigosoul]

Do you think guys/girls (generally speaking) have different views on it?

Hi Nomas. Good question; I think I'll answer this one. Yes, I think M & Fs have different views on FWB. Most men (I infer) would like to have lots of sex, doesn't have to be associated w/love, attachment, etc. Possibly better if not. Biologic drive & besides, it feels good, huh?

Women tend (not all, tho) to get emotionally attached w/sex. I would argue most do sooner or later. Used as an expression of their love/feelings/caring, etc. rather than just the act itself.

So long as men are considered okay by having lots of sex and women who are promiscuous as considered "sluts", then "friends w/benefits" will not be generally accepted in our society.

If you're not single, put yourself in a single person's shoes and give me your thoughts on friends with benefits. How common do you think it is? What do you think most people think of it?

I think I answered this already. Would you want to have a longterm/committted, etc. relationship w/a woman who had a lot of sexual partners? Why or why not? Even assuming she was careful about STIs...

Now, part two to this: Even if you agree you don't have to be in a relationship to start with the kissing..do you think that both sexes have the same views as far as whether it will eventually lead to a relationship? Again, I think men are more liberal here. I think if a girl makes out with a dude she's just "sorta seeing" she has the hopes that it'll lead somewhere toward a formal relationship. I think less of a percentage of girls do the kissing for fun as opposed to kissing with purpose.

I think its a chicken vs. egg thing here. Personally, I'm initially attracted to someones brain/personality before thinking about sex w/that person. Which I think is a leaning towards "relationship". Understanding another at their core & being able to share thoughts, feelings, and ideas. Not that I don't notice physical attractiveness, but there are a lot of good looking ppl who are just not all that interesting to me. Men don't seem to have this requirement as much (for the sex, I mean, they do if they seek a relationship). Again, its probably goes back to biologic mate selection. Men w/brains will be able to "provide" better for the children, etc. Good looking females will tend to produce healthy children, etc. So I think many women (like me) are programmed for the relationship-thing from the start.

Regarding the "friends" part... I think this requires defining. I'm pretty picky about who I consider a friend. Since (by my definition) there would already be an emotional/intellectual connection w/this person, having sex w/all the ensuing attachment, bonding, etc. wouldn't be a good idea unless you happen to live in Utah or Bountiful. I think many ppl consider FWB as a temporary situation for satisfying a biologic need until something "better" comes along... I would call this more "acquaintances" w/benefits. Which is fine, so long as both (or however many) parties understand this is temporary. But a friend w/benefits won't work, I think, b/c someone will be bound to develop romantic "feelings". How could you not?

Is my $0.02 on this one.
__________________
Then we laughed for a moment
And I said, "I never knew"...That you like Pina Coladas...

[artyemi]

just for clarity, even though we're answering what we think guys/girls expectations are regarding the whole fwb stuff, could we say what sex we are? i know what gender most people are, but i feel like more information could be weaned from this thread you know like:
how men feel about fwb
how women feel about fwb
what men think women think of fwb
what women think men think of fwb

gosh.. i'm thinking it would be a cool thing to do, with age and stuff too.. and whether you've been in one, how you've arrived at the fwb.. oh well.. i'm in my research mode.. maybe we'll see if sex is becoming more casual... or the idea is becoming more "normal"

[nomas]

ARRGH! I had this whole big post all typed out and a stupid error erased everything!

Anyway, the gist of it is:

Maybe I should be more clear as to what the intent of the discussion is really about..not that your responses haven’t been interesting…but here’s what I was thinking:

Okay, two parts, first the more interesting one to me:

Say you meet someone in a bar. This person talks to you for the night/dances/drinks and you’d like to see more of each other, you exchange numbers. You go out on a few dates or pseudo-dates, but neither one really with the intent to be just “friends”, really, but both of you do like the kissing good night or all out make out session, whatever the case may be, but you’re still not formally a couple. Why? Because neither one of you (I guess it’s really more the male’s role here) but you only really see each other a couple of times a month..but when you do see each other, there is kissing involved. You can’t be called “just friends”….you can’t be called an official couple. So this is what I meant by the “friends with benefits”.

NOT to be confused with:

You are buddies of the opposite sex. You’ve been friends for years, or at least months. You’ve been friends while you’ve both had significant others. One day the planets are aligned just right and you kiss under the stars. You decide you’re still not a couple and maintain your friendship, but still occasionally make out with no strings attached. This is a totally different, and more commonly accepted definition of “friends with benefits”.

You may discuss either or both, (or change the subject altogether) but the interesting part to me is, as Arty suggested, to get a statistical view of how you feel each sex and/or age group views these relationships.

My views stand as I stated them. I believe that generally men are just pleased as punch to have either of these friends with benefits situations. Just for the pleasure of kissing. Period.. Of course, the right girl may come along which will interest the guy and he’ll want to make her his exclusive girlfriend, ha ha, and this may be the very girl who takes the traditionally male stance of “this is just for fun..sorry, I have no feelings for you”.

In these generalizations I’m reminded of how a friend of mine views them: her 90-10 rule. Means: 90% of the time something is true for 90% of the cases, while 10% of the time it’s false for 10% of the cases…leaving some percentages in limbo…but ah, well, you get the gist of it. I often times prefer to use the Gaussian curve.

Still, there you go. Now discuss…

[indigosoul]

ARRGH! I had this whole big post all typed out and a stupid error erased everything!

Say you meet someone in a bar. This person talks to you for the night/dances/drinks and you’d like to see more of each other, you exchange numbers. You go out on a few dates or pseudo-dates, but neither one really with the intent to be just “friends”, really, but both of you do like the kissing good night or all out make out session, whatever the case may be, but you’re still not formally a couple. Why? Because neither one of you (I guess it’s really more the male’s role here) but you only really see each other a couple of times a month..but when you do see each other, there is kissing involved. You can’t be called “just friends”….you can’t be called an official couple. So this is what I meant by the “friends with benefits”.

NOT to be confused with:

You are buddies of the opposite sex. You’ve been friends for years, or at least months. You’ve been friends while you’ve both had significant others. One day the planets are aligned just right and you kiss under the stars. You decide you’re still not a couple and maintain your friendship, but still occasionally make out with no strings attached. This is a totally different, and more commonly accepted definition of “friends with benefits”.

You may discuss either or both, (or change the subject altogether) but the interesting part to me is, as Arty suggested, to get a statistical view of how you feel each sex and/or age group views these relationships.

Ohhh, okay then.

1. Am female who likes men.
2. Am over 30
3. Am married.
4. Never had FWB by either scenario

So, other than my net income, theres the relevant demographics/experience.

I think men like nookie however, agreed.
I think women will tend to get attached w/sex regardless.
I think your 1st case, casual "friends" CFWB is okay if alright w/everyone.
I think your 2nd case, good friends under the stars is a set up for eventual heartache. Someone will fall for the other eventually b/c you like them enough to consider then a good friend, whatever that is to you.

Oh, and aren't your %ages simply 99 and 1 %?? (joking, I get it...)

Next...?

[nomas]

Part 1

I dont know anyone that wouldnt kiss before a formal relationship. Heck, i dont know a whole lot of people that wouldnt have sex before jumping into a exclusive relationship....

Well, IKS, now you know at least one: indigosoul.

This is what I was looking for, you two are on opposite sides of the poles, it appears.

One thing Arty said: It's not about men or women, but individuals. This may hold a lot of truth.

Another one of my theories is this "balance theory". If you like someone quite a bit early on, and the other only likes you "some"...you'd best not show more than what's being reciprocated. If the balance tilts too much in one direction, you've lost this person. It works in most relationships..even just a friendship. If someone looks too desperate to have your frienship, your attention, you will tend to push him/her away. The "pathetic" factor will be established and, especially in a romantic relationship, the other person will stop being into you. Same way with these situations. If the guy is the one that wants to turn a FWB relationship into something more..the girl may shy away from it, given that she doesn't already reciprocate his feelings. If the guy is showing interest early on, this may turn the girl off to it.

What do you think of that one?

[indigosoul]

Well, IKS, now you know at least one: indigosoul.

Don't misquote me, tho Nomas. I don't have a problem w/sex the way you describe. It just isn't the issue for me. The mental connection is. The rest is gravy, savory tho it is.

The "pathetic" factor will be established and, especially in a romantic relationship, the other person will stop being into you. Same way with these situations. If the guy is the one that wants to turn a FWB relationship into something more..the girl may shy away from it, given that she doesn't already reciprocate his feelings. If the guy is showing interest early on, this may turn the girl off to it.

I think there's some truth to the pathetic factor you state. But only b/c of the discomfort it causes the recipient. No one likes to feel pressured. If you're looking for a recipe for "FWB to more", I think it would be more successful to "hit them hard" with an emotional bomb (unambigous or close to, depending), THEN withdraw. It is the absence of pressure, combined with the thought this would provoke that would produce the effect you want. Assuming the "potential" is there, which it probably is for the reasons I mentioned earlier... FWB (#2) will already "know" each other to some extent. Feelings for wanting "more" a just a matter of time.

[nomas]

Don't misquote me, tho Nomas. I don't have a problem w/sex the way you describe. It just isn't the issue for me. The mental connection is. The rest is gravy, savory tho it is...

I was referring directly to this:

4. Never had FWB by either scenario

I didn't mean you had a problem with it..it was just that you said you hadn't done this and IKS didn't even know anyone who wouldn't..but I guess "would" is the key word..you didn't say you wouldn't..you just simply hadn't.

[artyemi]

Another one of my theories is this "balance theory". If you like someone quite a bit early on, and the other only likes you "some"...you'd best not show more than what's being reciprocated. If the balance tilts too much in one direction, you've lost this person. It works in most relationships..even just a friendship. If someone looks too desperate to have your frienship, your attention, you will tend to push him/her away. The "pathetic" factor will be established and, especially in a romantic relationship, the other person will stop being into you. Same way with these situations. If the guy is the one that wants to turn a FWB relationship into something more..the girl may shy away from it, given that she doesn't already reciprocate his feelings. If the guy is showing interest early on, this may turn the girl off to it.

What do you think of that one?

Agreed. But because there is no equilibrium between the two parties involved, I believe that eventually either one will crack.

Say you like someone a LOT. You end up in a FWB type of situation with the person. This person doesn't reciprocate the amount of like that you have for the him/her. At first, you're okay with it and you only display the amount of like that you believe that this person has for you. Heck, you're just happy to be with the person in any capacity this person wants to be with you. But damn those human emotions. How much of it can you hold in before you explode when you fully comprehend that it can never be more?

Or that person somehow realizes that she/he likes someone more and end it with you. Or that person develop half a heart to realize that you like him/her a lot and it's better for you to move on to someone who will like you just as much..

But you can't move on that easily because you're satisfied with how much attention that person is willing to give you that you never bother to seek elsewhere. You like that person that much to be satisfied with only a portion only to realize you want more than a portion. You want everything.