My story

[DoesntMatter]

Hello everyone, this is my first post on this site. My reason for posting is that I am looking for any feedback/ comments/ thoughts/ ideas/ advice, that any of you can give me. Although there is a section of the board intended for new members to introduce themselves, I am not looking to merely introduce myself but hopefully hear some input on a wide range of questions I have. My reason for giving you my background is to help you better understand where I come from.
First to tell you about myself. I am 17 years old, will be 18 in less than a month. I live in western New York. Next year I will be attending college. Actually, in about 3 and a half months I will be attending college. This means I am in my senior year of high school. By now you are probably wondering what the hell I am doing on this forum. So on to the story...
Like I said I am almost 18. I have never been hugged by a girl, or kissed, or had sex. I've never had any meaningful relationship with a girl. This is largely because I am never in the right situation. Seriously, almost never. Actually, I've had very few non-business relationships with even guys (you know, friendship).
So I'm pretty late into this game, the one of dating, intimate relationships, et cetera. This is not because I am ugly. Some of this is probably my own cynicism. If you haven't had a girlfriend, how can you tell if a girl is interested in you, or just being flirtatious because that's her nature? Idk. I also find it hard to swallow that a girl could like me. There are so many other guys out there, why would someone want me? Thankfully at least, as time goes on, women outnumber men in this country. At least that may put the numbers in my favor. Unfortunately, it also seems as though a few certain guys get most of the girls.
I have been led to conclude that, for a guy like myself, the only sure method of ever getting a girlfriend would be to amass a fortune of money. Driving a Porsche Turbo is quite an eye-catcher for the ladies, is it not?
For the last two years this has been my focus. This is why I put forth the good effort in high school to get into the college of my choice. It is also why I worked my ass off outside of school.
So here I am, about to leave for college, and realizing that I may have missed out on something that could have been good. What hurts is thinking that I may not be able to "catch-up" to others (in terms of experience, sexual skills, romantic flair, blah blah blah...). However, I am practical.
I am familiar with the concept of an escort agency. In case anyone here is not, it is a service provided where a female companion stays with you for some length of time. The presumed reason for the encounter is for sex. While their establishment as a legitimate business is questionable, this is not a law forum, so let's just assume that since they pay taxes they are in fact legal.
I am considering using the services that these girls provide as an opportunity to become better at sex. In other words, learn from a pro. My reason for this is that these girls are all very experienced, and spending three or four hours with them per week until school starts would provide me with knowledge that would take God knows how long learning from someone unwilling to teach you (i.e. someone looking for a quick lay). From what I hear, girls dislike inexperienced guys. A lot. Anyways, I would like to know your opinions on this thought.
Now let's put sex aside. There is a girl I know from school, who is the most beautiful girl inside and out. She may have given signs that she likes me, such as always smiling at me, tapping me, shouting my name... However, I also know that she is a bit of the "party" type, is experienced, and most of her guy friends are quite older than myself (and her, too). Isn't this always the case?
I have never been with her outside of the school setting. I would, however, love to get to know her better. Part of my problem is that I do not have a social circle. Or at least one that she would feel comfortable in. If the two of us were to just "hang out" sometime, that would create a potentially awkward situation. What I am getting at is, I believe it is necessary to have some type of intermediate person present to catalyze the whole thing. A person who could diffuse any potential weirdness or awkwardness. Someone who could kind of help break the ice. Who should do this? One of her friends who I don't know? One of the people I know?
I bring up a second point I want to talk about. I would love to take MDMA (ecstasy, E, tabs, whatever slang you prefer) with her sometime. I do not know, however, if she rolls like that (excuse the pun). Would it be better to bring up the topic in neutral discussion, and follow through with her personal beliefs? And depending on her response, go from there? I believe that an MDMA experience with her could be invaluable.
So maybe now you can understand my predicament. Any input at all would be greatly appreciated. Thank you very much in advance.
PS- This is my first post. I apologize if I inadvertently broke a board rule.

[zro]

Hi doesntmatter,

you are only young mate, its not too late - dont resort to prostitutes, i have never hired a prostitute so i wouldnt know, but the idea of paying for sex is demeaning and lacking self respect and self confidence

Secondly, have you raken drugs before? - people react differently to drugs, some can take it, for others it is fatal - i am a recovering addict and trust me you do not want to get involved in that scene, plus you would not be able to have a "real" relationship with her, if your base with her is a drug hazed night

I cant really offer any advice on how to get a girl like that because "party" girls have always been a turn off for me, all i can say is that it is NOT too late for you, you are only 18, dont stress over it too much, it will come in time

[DoesntMatter]

Thanks for the reply zro.
I personally do not view prostitution as demeaning, so I would not have a problem with it in that respect.
I do not know why it matters, but I have taken drugs before, and I am sure that everyone on this forum has. Alcohol and caffeine are drugs. Besides those I have taken methcathinone, and MDA, and MDMA. Alcohol and caffeine are addictive. MDMA is not. It also does not produce a "haze" of any sort, only a memory that you can recollect with crystal clarity. I couldn't give a shit about doing heroin or cocaine or weed, or any other drug. They seem like a waste of time.
And while she is a party girl, she is not the stereotypical party girl. Her dress, demeanor, and behavior would never give it away. She is far from being a slut party girl.
Do girls usually date older guys because they just mature faster, or because older guys are more confident? I think it might be better for me to try to get to know girls a year or two younger, because girls my age will "befriend" guys my age, but they do not view them as relationship material.
Basically I keep ending up back at square 1. Without money I am going nowhere. Ironically this will in the end probably hook me up with a shallow girl, which I do not want. But that is better than nothing. And at least I know exactly what I have to do.

I feel like the guy in the song Boom Boom Dollar.

[Gigabitch]

I think you're trying to make decisions about life before you live it. It's like trying to figure out how to swim before getting in the water.

Your broad generalizations work when applied to large populations, not individuals. The fact that you've decided at 17 that the only way you'll ever attract women is by getting a Porsche is just plain sad. Let me tell you something- the kind of women who are impressed by this are likely to be the worst people you could possibly associate with. You'd be better off with the hookers.

Ah, yes, the hookers. Do you honestly think that technique is the most important part of sex? It isn't. It's the connection, the emotional experience brought about by physical contact that makes it worthwhile- otherwise you'd just as well keep masturbating and save yourself a whole lot of trouble. I don't think you're going to learn much about connection from a prostitute.

Quit holding yourself back from life. Quit using drugs to replace actual experiences (yes- I know about this- I have done an actual shitload of drugs in my life and I can tell you, you're wasting your time). Quit trying to come up with a formula for getting what you want and go talk to that girl. She's a unique person with things to teach you.

[DoesntMatter]

Quit using drugs to replace life experiences? If I am correct I said I have used drugs before, not that I actively use drugs. I have used drugs 4 times in my life. Yes, 4. And that was only after evaluating the risks and everything else associated with them (except the cat perhaps). I am not a dumbass and do not intend to cause brain damage just for a "good time".
I like what you said about the emotional connection being most important, though. If that is true then praise be to God. But why is it that girls rip on inexperienced guys mercilessly behind their backs? To their face as well? I tried talking to a few girls before when I was in Mexico, they were just kind of "flirting" with me I guess. Well anyways I was compared to the 40-year old virgin. Lol. It was a valid comparison at least. So of the very few times I have attempted to "chat up" girls in this manner, it has usually resulted in some form of mockery.
I know that all girls are not like this. I also know that these same girls respond differently when other guys approach them. It's a bit of a numbers game, right? You try talking to 50 different girls, if 1 likes you back, then good. But what I want to do is better the odds.
What do you mean by "talk to that girl" Giga? I do at school. What do you recommend for me to say to her or any actions I should take?
And thank you for the good post Giga.

[Gigabitch]

I think you just may have had the misfortune to meet a huge number of bitches so far in your life.

Yeah, I guess it's a numbers game, but it can get discouraging if you spend all of your time getting shot down. Happily, you're on your way out of high school, and things will get infinitely better with regard to the way girls act.

Now let's talk about what you want in a girl- are you looking for the kind of qualities that a good girlfriend would have or are you just trying to pick up saucy little tarts at the mall?

[YourBestFriend]

Hookers? do you really think they will make you a better lover?

They will give nothing accept maybe AIDS, and a few minutes of "good" time, so dump that idea (not even mentioning that technique is not important if you and your girl love each other).


DON'T TAKE DRUGS!!!

You will only get ****ed up, and regret it when it's to late.


Oh, and stop worrying. You are not even 18 yet, your whole life, is before you, and your best years are only beginning, so don't sweat it

Only by getting rich you will attract girls? that's a load of crap mi amigo.

Women that are attracted to money are scum, and usually marry 80 year old rich guys that drop dead within a year, just to get some of their money, so keep off from such bitches!

True love doesn't depend on money, nor do your chances of finding it.


Go on and be with that girl you like. Take her out, have fun.
You don't need any one beside the one you love to have a successful relationship

[DoesntMatter]

@Giga-
I don't think it makes a difference what I am looking for in a girl. It's not like I have an array of options to choose from. I have no options. But ideally I would like a good girlfriend.
And how do things get better after high school? Girls get more serious or something? Because I know that right now, the group of guys who drink every weekend, spend all their minimum wage earnings on a new Mustang, and go to the community college are the ones with the chicks. Oh yeah, they are at least 2 years older than the girls they are dating/seeing/****ing. At least. The girls I know (16 - 18) all hang out with guys who are 21 - 25.
@YourBestFriend-
Not hookers, escorts. Big difference. Escorts are more legitimate, and usually belong to an escort agency. You don't find them on street corners. They look far better as well, and aren't coked out. They are also more expensive, usually about $300 - $500 per hour.

I can't believe the people who post complaining their girlfriend broke up with them after a year, or things like that. At least you had a girlfriend in the first place. ****ing remember that.

In another month or two I think I might try out my Porsche hypothesis and see what happens

[Gigabitch]

Dude, first of all, move away from where you live. It sounds like you're in the land of Lowered Expectations. Clearly, you belong somewhere else.

The reason to focus on what you want in a girl is to remind yourself that you DO have choices, even if they're not apparent right now. You don't have to just wait around like some dork and then roll over for the first girl that lets you put your hand up her shirt. You're an angry man waiting to happen.

I think you have a choice right now to go down the shallow, Porsche-identified road right now or go another way entirely. Take the other road.

Go out and make your life into what you want it to be. There's a girl out there somewhere for you. She'll show up.

[DoesntMatter]

I guess I do live in the land of Lowered Expectations (Rochester NY). But next year I will be living on campus at Cornell in Ithaca. Hopefully I will find a nice girl there.
So I have about 7 weeks left of school in my senior year, then summer, then college. I do not know anyone else who is going to Cornell, and I think more than two-thirds of the kids who go there are from out of state. Lucky for me, this means no cliques will have formed by the time I get there for orientation.
I am hoping that I can get to know some girls while I am there to maybe find a girlfriend!!!! I guess I'll see what happens.

[Gigabitch]

I guess I do live in the land of Lowered Expectations (Rochester NY).

Eeew. That's where my mom's from. I was born in Albany, actually. My mom thought Rochester sucked, so she moved us to New Mexico when I was little. I've never been back.

I think you should spend the summer trying to build your skills. You know, try to date a bit just to get your feet wet. You don't want to show up to college completely green.

[Glyph]

I'm sure this probably doesn't help at all - I know you feel as if you've missed a lot of social avenues during high school - but it's probably a GOOD thing. You're almost off to college, you're not tied down in a serious relationship, which means you've got a clear head to do things right: get through school, get a good education and degree so that you can have a good job. There are women who love MONEY (bad) and there are women who love DIRECTION (good), and there's a big difference. Having a good job that you worked hard for will definitely boost your confidence also, and that's like CRACK to a woman, seriously - we love men who are confident and self-assured without being a cocky jerk.

Right now, girls your age have no idea WHAT they want. And these girls hanging around with 21-25 year olds? First off, if any of them are 16 that's illegal, and I'm sorry to hear they're getting into "relationships" like that. Secondly, these older guys probably ARE expecting an awful lot from them in these relationships - and I totally wouldn't be surprised if a few of those girls end up pregnant either right out of high school or shortly thereafter, no education, prepared to stay home and never work. That's what happened to me at 19 (luckily, my situation changed, but only after marrying the asshole).

Learn to find happiness in what you've got in life NOW; the more you chase after love, sex, whatever, the more it's going to elude you. If women love confidence, then conversely, they're majorly turned off by desperation. Looking desperate to a woman is absolute suicide. Find happiness in your day-to-day life and women will notice that. After all, if you can make YOURSELF happy, then it's logical to assume that you'll make HER happy as well.

There are good women out there and you'll eventually run across one. In the meantime, you're at a very important stage in your life, so make the most of it, even without a girlfriend. Focus on your future. The moment you're not even looking for it is often when it happens.

[DoesntMatter]

I would like to spend the summer trying to build up some skills, but the summer between high school ending and college beginning is always the shortest. I get out in the end of June (22nd?). Early July I'm going to Florida for a cruise with my family and won't be back until mid July. Gotta be at school by mid August for orientation. But the real problem is having someone to take out.
Am I going to be completely ****ed up if I show up to college a virgin? Be honest with me. I can quite easily imagine being at some party and being passed over by the girls who will favor one of the alpha males.
As I said in one of my earlier posts, I'm probably going to hire an escort a few times in the next couple of months to at least prevent showing up to college "green" like Giga said. And if I like the experience enough, I would not mind spending $500 on an escort every week to make it a routine. While this won't provide me with love (obviously), maybe it will at a minimum satisfy some of my sexual woes.
And Glyph, I already know there are good women out there, I've seen many

But back to my main concern. Will college girls just brush me off or dismiss me as being some naive little virgin boy? (And I'm far from naive- I've seen and been in some bad shit) Just yesterday I was picking my sister up from college, and the girls seemed to treat me kind of "cool". Almost as though they could tell that I didn't belong. Maybe it's just my cynicism again, but they do seem to have some intuition and can pick up on things. And I tried being polite and friendly with them. I know that being nice won't get you ****-all in the real world, but come on! Isn't that how guys are supposed to treat girls? Or is that only if you are on "equal footing"? As in, since I am not a college guy who has had sex with at least a half dozen different women, I am not allowed to talk to them?
I am also concerned that the first couple of years of college will mirror high school in the sense that the upper classmen take all the freshman girls.
Thanks again for all your replies and help, I truely appreciate it

[CAM]

And, another reason to not go to prostitutes: incurable tuberculosis. Venereal disease is small potatoes compared to risking incurable TB and nothing is worth that risk!!!

[Tiay]

what the..?!?! no! don't sleep with an escort! are you crazy?

Lemme tell you something. I was homeschooled. Most of my direct human interaction was with my family till I was 18. I had my first kiss when I was 18, and had sex at 20. You have PLENTY of time, quit panicking.

who got it into your head that girls dislike inexperienced guys? Some do- but forget those girls, they're shallow, you don't want them anyway. Don't change yourself so that you can be with exactly the sort of people who wouldn't even like the person that you are. That'd be the stupidest thing ever. And you'd be throwing away one of the most meaningful experiences in your life.
Why do guys get this "get rid of my virginity on a prostitute" idea? Don't do it.

You know what all girls hate even more than inexperience? It's getting to know this nice guy, only to find out that he's such an insecure wimp he actually paid money to have his virginity taken by a whore, rather than saving it for someone special. Believe me, you'd never live it down. hooker, escort, shmescort, believe me, nobody will know the "difference". Anybody who sleeps with people for money is a whore. don't go there. it reeks of desperation. God, if there's one thing you could do to really stop the "good girls" from being attracted to you, that's it. stupidest idea ever. Don't do it, or I'll come beat some sense into you. No really, i'm coming to NY for the summer anyway, and I have people in Rochester. You better watch out.
But seriously though, get that idea out of your head.

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Don't mention drugs to a girl unless you've been with her for at least a few months, or unless she mentions them first. You sound like a logical person, so I don't think I need to tell you that drugs are baaad anyway.

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you're going about this way too logically. Your plans of improving the technique of sex, getting rich, driving a flashy car.. will only attract shallow girls who don't like you for who you are. Why? Are you so insecure you don't think anybody could like who you are? You have to get some self confidence in yourself.

And no, you're not screwed going into college a virgin. Some people will laugh at you, but who cares? they're just trying to justify their own behaviour.
I know a 23 year old virgin. normal guy. not religious. just waiting for the right one. Eventually a girl will come along who will value that, who'll love him for who he is. Nothing is worth compromising that.

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you've never been hugged by a girl? You just gotta open your arms and she'll hug you.

and no, you don't need a third party to 'break the ice'.. when you like someone, you aim to be alone with them.

she's been dropping hints that she likes you? You have to get out and tell her you like her. do it!